Recruiting Forum Football Talk XXX

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#3,229
#3,229
jave36 said:
Break it down. I said 11 out of 11 games we came out flat. You turned that into "we have to score first and lead every game and come out fast every game."

Surely you see the difference. I didn't say elite coaches always start fast and finish fast. But Saban has never had a season where his team squandered 3 or 4 double digit leads, and he's never had a season where his team didn't have a single complete first quarter.
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We've led after the 1Q of our last three games. We were tied at the end of the 1Q against South Carolina.
 
#3,230
#3,230
jave36 said:
Agreed mostly, except Shoop hire didn't take stones. He was a consensus top DC in the nation, anyone would have taken him. And on coming out flat, we haven't had a single first quarter, IMO, where offense and defense both played well.
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It tooks stones to fire Jancek who most believed did a pretty good job. It was a move that didn't have to be made. Hiring Shoop wasn't what I was referring to as much as firing Jancek to be able to do it.

Well our defense hasn't played well to start all year and now they are just plain bad so you're not gonna see a great quarter from them at all I don't believe. Something has been off there no doubt. Offense had some slow starts early in the year. It's not that we are coming out "flat" every game. Something has been off though.

TN tech game 21-0 at the end of the 1st though. Just sayin.

I would rather start slow, finish strong and win like we did this year for the most part and not do like we did last year and start out hot and squander leads.

You are unhappy with both ways apparently. Not happy this year that we started slow. Not happy that last year we squandered leads. You're just not happy.
 
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#3,234
#3,234
BigZiti09 said:
It tooks stones to fire Jancek who most believed did a pretty good job. It was a move that didn't have to be made. Hiring Shoop wasn't what I was referring to as much as firing Jancek to be able to do it.

Well our defense hasn't played well to start all year and now they are just plain bad so you're not gonna see a great quarter from them at all I don't believe. Something has been off there no doubt. Offense had some slow starts early in the year. It's not that we are coming out "flat" every game. Something has been off though.

TN tech game 21-0 at the end of the 1st though. Just sayin.

I would rather start slow, finish strong and win like we did this year for the most part and not do like we did last year and start out hot and squander leads.

You are unhappy with both ways apparently. Not happy this year that we started slow. Not happy that last year we squandered leads. You're just not happy.
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No, losing doesn't make me happy. Our slow starting became a habit, and it lost us the USC and aTm games because we couldn't recover.

Our poor finishing lost us 4 games last year.

So no, I'm not happy with team tendencies that lose games.

Edit I'll concede TTU
 
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#3,235
#3,235
InVOLuntary said:
There have been maybe two. You always have a couple. If we were undefeated those couple would be complaining about how we only beat KY by 20.

Some here are indifferent, I'll give you that, but is that an acknowledgement that they want Butch gone? Even though we're 8-3, with a chance at 9-3, here's the reasons why I think some are meh about the season:

Lackadaisical performances out of the gate against teams that should have been pre-season games. Overtime to beat ASU, 4 qtr game against Ohio, slow starts against VT, and FL.

Drama in the locker room with Hurd and PW.

Recruiting (at this point) underwhelming.

Not winning the east in another down year for the east, despite being the most talented teams of Jones' tenure. "If they couldn't do it this year, will they ever?"

Lack of competiveness against Bama.

Defense at close to Sunseri levels to end the season.

Butch's seemingly pettiness bickering back and forth with the fans and media. His endless clichés are wearing thin and his disconnect with the fans seems to be widening.

Vandy being anything but a sure win. Fans are legitimately concerned about Vandy (which they should be).

Because of injuries, we've seen a lot of next year's team audition and fans don't see the next Barnett, JRM and, Cam Sutton.


Now before you roast me, I'm not saying these are legitimate or valid. I realize injuries have played a significant role. You have to have something to sell, either the present or the future. The present, while is by no means bad, is not what was expected, and the future has a lot of question marks.

I have to admit that my confidence in Butch has taken a hit. I'm not sure he's the coach to take us to the next level. I'm by no means giving up on him. I have less confidence the AD would hire anyone any better and very well could be worse.
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Great post InVOL, I couldn't agree more! This is what most rational folks on here have the issue with. Yes, Butch needs to stay for the good of the program, but No, Butch has not been perfect and these are all legitimate concerns for those of us not simply living week to week in the moment, who look at the entire body of work and try and base our opinion on what is going to happen in the next few seasons. This program needs stability, but few can argue that even though we have a good record, there have definitely been some missed opportunities and some down right ugly winning when this should not be the case. Injuries aside, we are seeing 2nd and 3rd year players that are clearly not developing and do not even have the basics down at times.... Recruiting is at a crawl and does not look to rebound compared to other programs. On paper this program is on the rise and has improved every season the last three years--- the perfect scenario for high level recruits to be knocking down our door, yet we are jam packed full of 3*, while other programs with similar or less impressive short term resumes are pulling 4-5*... Something is amiss at the circle K.
 
#3,237
#3,237
BigZiti09 said:
It tooks stones to fire Jancek who most believed did a pretty good job. It was a move that didn't have to be made. Hiring Shoop wasn't what I was referring to as much as firing Jancek to be able to do it.

Well our defense hasn't played well to start all year and now they are just plain bad so you're not gonna see a great quarter from them at all I don't believe. Something has been off there no doubt. Offense had some slow starts early in the year. It's not that we are coming out "flat" every game. Something has been off though.

TN tech game 21-0 at the end of the 1st though. Just sayin.

I would rather start slow, finish strong and win like we did this year for the most part and not do like we did last year and start out hot and squander leads.

You are unhappy with both ways apparently. Not happy this year that we started slow. Not happy that last year we squandered leads. You're just not happy.
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I don't think Butch had much of a choice to fire Jancek. There was some off the field stuff that couldn't be ignored. But that's neither here nor there.
 
#3,238
#3,238
jave36 said:
I love the "where he'll have resources to win a natty" like he is being hamstrung by coaching here.
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Once again, read my posts. I NEVER said he has been hamstrung by not having resources here. I'm trying to get the point across that, if we win out, I believe a program that is elite enough to win at a NC level with the right coach will offer Butch the job, and he will leave. A program that has similar resources as we do, not a program on the level of say a lower tier SEC school.
 
#3,243
#3,243
unioncityvol said:
i like butch and appreciate him taking on the task. i want him to be around through the jg era atleast. the sec waters are tough, its a what have you done for me lately world and the week to week margin for error is very small and he better get used to it or maybe he should move on honestly. all fan bases are like us down here. hope he finishes what he started here.
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Shore up the linebackers and bring in a strong RB class, A. Johnson and Kongbo emerge on the D Line. The Vols are sitting pretty for 2017.
 
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#3,245
#3,245
Look, I've been plenty critical of Jones as well, but we don't know as fans half of what we think we do. It's all well and good to say the coaches should've done this, or practice should've been like that, or we should have kicked this guy or that guy off the team earlier...but none of us were there. None of us have the insight to offer those kinds of statements with any authority. And for as much as pissing away the East burns US up, how do you think the coaches and players feel? This is their livelihood.

I keep thinking about how obviously joyous Butch was at beating Florida, and the way that he came out to the end zone in Athens hours after the game had ended just to look at the place where the Hail Mary was caught. He obviously has been working his tail off for Tennessee. We were a smoldering crater of a program after the Hamilton-Kiffin-Dooley fiasco; coaches were turning us down left and right, but Jones took the opportunity knowing the expectations, knowing the pressure, and knowing the hole he was starting in. Maybe he won't work out long term, but we don't know that yet -- we're all just guessing.

If we lose to Vanderbilt then his seat will be on fire next year. We'll know then. If we don't lose, we're probably going to the Sugar Bowl. Given all the crap this team has put up with, I think we all need a little appreciation for where we are compared to where we were or where we could have been.

And instead we're worried about what some AM radio hacks in Arkansas say and about what gets put on Wikipedia. This is insane.
 
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#3,247
#3,247
The Breakerboy said:
You don't lose to teams the caliber of SCAR.....

. . .
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Let's look at Clemson - lost to Pitt.

Let's look at Michigna - lost to Iowa.

You could even lump in Ohio State's loss to Penn State.

Those are 3 of the current playoff teams with losses to teams the caliber of SCAR. And a difference between them and us is they were playing with far fewer injuries.

Basically **** happens.
 
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#3,248
#3,248
BigZiti09 said:
UNC seems way less likely. I didn't realize how little they were paying Fedora. Someone needs to scoop him up. He would be my first call if Butch were to leave.

If he goes 10-3 and wins the Sugar Bowl he is going to be a hot name for fanbases searching for a coach. People live in the "now" and he would be red hot coming off a victory in the Sugar, probably finishing with a top ten ranking at 10-3 while playing in the SEC with a ton of injuries and did it after building the program from scratch.
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I get this narrative and I can see why people think that way.

But all that happening is still far from a done deal. We need UF to lose (probably twice more). We might have to count on A&M losing again. We have to win next week.


Then, if we get the Sugar Bowl, we have to figure out a way to stop (likely) FSU or OU from rushing for 800 yards against us to win the game.


I know nobody here wants to consider it, but what if we lose or get stomped in the Sugar Bowl (or hell, even the Citrus Bowl). What if we look like Clemson did against WVU a few years back in that bowl game?


I think a lot of the people who are pumping sunshine for Butch right now talking like we shouldn't be critical of him and that we shouldn't hope for better are taking for granted that the stars will align for us and we'll be Sugar Bowl champions.


If that does happen, the fanbase's narrative will turn as well. People are just upset this week because they had their hopes dashed and Butch lacked the awareness to turn off the stupid coach talk button for once. If he goes 10-3 and we're Sugar Bowl champs it will be all Game of Jones memes again.


Regardless, I doubt he's all that heavily pursued. He might get a couple of those interviews or meetings coaches get when they want to leverage for a new contract, but I sincerely doubt anything more will come of it.
 
#3,249
#3,249
Kristy* said:
Let's look at Clemson - lost to Pitt.

Let's look at Michigna - lost to Iowa.

You could even lump in Ohio State's loss to Penn State.

Those are 3 of the current playoff teams with losses to teams the caliber of SCAR. And a difference between them and us is they were playing with far fewer injuries.

Basically **** happens.
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Those three teams are light years ahead of USCe
 
#3,250
#3,250
InVOLuntary said:
I don't think Butch had much of a choice to fire Jancek. There was some off the field stuff that couldn't be ignored. But that's neither here nor there.
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Was that substantiated or was this another Crowder gut punch or "F 'em all" social media wonder?
 
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