Releasing our Derek Dooley hatred

[dduncan4163]

I find this thread amusing. The majority of the fan base still thought that dufus could do something, right up until the end.

I held out hope till the 2011 Ky game. He should have been let go then.

 

[dduncan4163]

Hell Wilcox saw the ship was sinking a bailed

 

[allvol123]

I held out hope till the 2011 Ky game. He should have been let go then.

That s when I let it loose on that buffoon. That said, so many still believed.

 

[goooooovols]

Kiffin and Dooley were equally bad. Kiffin, if he had stayed, would have gotten us in NCAA jail. Dooley thought he could live off of his dad's reputation. They were both were program killers. Hamilton hired both so that speaks for itself! I dislike both but for me it is time to move on. It was what it was! VFL and GBO!

Not picking on you in particular but it is a bit ironic that Dooley did start the official VFL program....

I liked Dooley as a person, he was just presented with an awful situation, was in over his head and recruited remarkably poor.

With that said Go Vols and VFL!

 

[allvol123]

Not picking on you in particular but it is a bit ironic that Dooley did start the official VFL program....

I liked Dooley as a person, he was just presented with an awful situation, was in over his head and recruited remarkably poor.

With that said Go Vols and VFL!

What was there to like about him as a person? He was an arrogant fool.

 

[dduncan4163]

That s when I let it loose on that buffoon. That said, so many still believed.

Not only did we lose to Ky we lost a bad Ky squad even by thier standards. The worst part was you could see 75% of our team was phoning it in. They couldn't have cared less and that falls directly on the HC.

 

[allvol123]

Not only did we lose to Ky we lost a bad Ky squad even by thier standards. The worst part was you could see 75% of our team was phoning it in. They could have cared less and that falls directly on the HC.

Yep. There was enough offensive talent to score 70 on UK. But everyone had quit on that loser.

 

[dduncan4163]

That's the biggest difference between Butch and Dooley. I have NEVER seen a Butch coached squad EVER give up even in the blowout loss to Oregon Butch's kids still played thier hearts out. The moment a Dooley coach team lost momentum they folded like wet paper.

 

[goooooovols]

What was there to like about him as a person? He was an arrogant fool.

Well he was a smart ass which I thought was a nice quality, family guy-who seemed to genuinely understand and care about the history of Tennessee Football. He was not a great head coach but had a Gomer Pyle thing going for him. JMO

 

[allvol123]

Well he was a smart ass which I thought was a nice quality, family guy-who seemed to genuinely understand and care about the history of Tennessee Football. He was not a great head coach but had a Gomer Pyle thing going for him. JMO

Smart ass only looks good on competent people.

 

[allvol123]

That's the biggest difference between Butch and Dooley. I have NEVER seen a Butch coached squad EVER give up even in the blowout loss to Oregon Butch's kids still played thier hearts out. The moment a Dooley coach team lost momentum they folded like wet paper.

Truth.

 

[dduncan4163]

Oral History of the Derek Dooley Era at Tennessee | Outkick The Coverage

Part IV: Alumni Relations

Derek Dooley is credited for expanding the "Vol For Life" program during his time in Knoxville. However, many former Tennessee players have made it known that they did not feel welcome at their alma mater while Dooley was in charge.

Hooker: The most prominent memory was his explanation on his policy to only allow former players to come into the facility if they received clearance. That did not go over well. I was called by several players that wanted me to bring more publicity to the policy. Therefore, I asked Dooley about it. He went on some rambling explanation about how his brother wouldn't show up to his house without calling. Many fans cheered Dooley on at the time, saying I had been put in my place. However, I knew that the policy was a bad one and several former players thanked me. Many of those former players still have ties to high school prospects. Some coach camps. Some had sons who would be prospects. Dooley didn't get that. He quickly turned a recruiting tool into a hindrance.

Fred White: Tennessee Defensive Back (1995-1999). Today, VP of Marketing at Concord Insurance and Regional Sales Manager at Volunteer Pharmacy.

Our relationship was non-existent. I was a guest on "The Drive" with VFL Terry Fair and Russell Smith during SEC Media Days, and we got every SEC coach to come on our show except Derek Dooley. Of course we asked him like we asked every other coach if they could come on and scheduled the time for them to come on. He agreed to come on and then proceeded to go on every show on radio row except our show. The only show with two VFLs on it yet he didn't even bother coming on. We had (former Vanderbilt coach) James Franklin on for 15 minutes and he did the show out of respect that we were two former UT players. We even got (South Carolina coach) Steve Spurrier to come on and no Derek Dooley. That's how my relationship with Derek Dooley was.

Swain: To know that the same place players gave their all for was saying you gotta call that place and tell them you are coming? That's not home. You don't call your Mom and say you are coming home this weekend, just calling to let you know... you just show up! Because that's home. That was weird. Dooley lost lot of support there. When that happens? It travels so fast in the community, in the alumni base... anytime someone did something good or bad, we all know with 24 hours. A lot of people heard about that and decided not to go back. It was weird.


Sam Greenwood



Troy Fleming: Tennessee Running Back (1999-2003). Today, Bible teacher, chaplain and head football coach at Concord Christian School.

There was no relationship at all other than him acting like a spoiled incompetent brat who finally had a "BIG TIME" job and didn't know how to act. Another sign of spoiled, arrogant elitism. Not one time did he truly make an attempt to make us feel welcome.

Smith: I remember in the fall of 2010 during Dooley's first season, I went with former Vols Terry Fair and James Wilhoit to UT's indoor practice facility to perform an experiment to determine if there was a difference in the "kickability" of Wilson and Nike footballs (there wasn't). We went inside and watched James kick a bunch of balls. About 15 minutes after we started, a UT staffer came and informed us that Dooley himself was demanding that we leave the building. I can understand wanting a schlep like me out of there. But Fair and Wilhoit are Tennessee football royalty. And Dooley gave them the boot! Why is an SEC football coach spending time during the middle of game week worrying about a couple of former players using the practice field? Is he worried about the insurance liability? Shouldn't he be watching film or recruiting? It seemed odd at the time.

Rice: I think he saw the alumni as a threat in a lot of ways. He didn't even want to hear a whisper of "That's not how we used to do it." And that's fine. It's healthy to a certain extent. But when you're coming from the family of the Fulmer era and the free-for-all of the Kiffin year... that's a big adjustment for alumni to make. He didn't want guys around that would question him or anything he did. He was in charge and sometimes he did things that were clearly to remind everyone around of that fact. Derek Dooley was completely oblivious to the role alumni play in a program. They are the backbone of your program. They are the people that support and defend you when things go wrong. They can't actively recruit for you, but they can proudly paint the country orange with their pride and support. Recruits see that, fans see that, media see that. But without them, there is a vacuum of support. You can't have that, especially when things go bad.

Low: If you want to come to practice, you have to go through a process. More alumni complained about how demeaning he was. Dooley just alienated so many former players. He never recovered from that.

 

[dduncan4163]

Part V: Recruiting/Player Relationships

"Derek is a very articulate, bright guy. He's a great coach and a hard-working guy. He was always a very good recruiter in college, which I think is paramount if you're going to have success as a college coach."


-- Nick Saban, University of Alabama Head Football Coach.

That quote was featured in Tennessee's press release announcing Dooley's hiring in 2010. However, some were very critical of the way Dooley and his coaching staff handled the recruiting aspect of their jobs.

Low:Recruiting is all about relationships and Dooley wasn't good at relationships. Players felt shunned and he really dropped the ball. Where he dropped the ball was offensive line. They (Dooley and staff) weren't good evaluators. They would target the wrong guys. They couldn't bring in enough quality guys.

Stephen Hargis: Assistant Sports Editor, Chattanooga Times Free Press. Today, Sports Editor for the Chattanooga Times Free Press.

I had heard a lot of rumblings from high school coaches in our area that they never saw or even had contact from the UT staff. After talking with some of them I learned that the majority of our area coaches said they had regular contact from other SEC coaches but that they didn't even know who was responsible for recruiting their school for UT because they had never heard anything from the staff. Once I began visiting or calling all of our coaches (we cover about 80 schools combined in Tennessee, Georgia and Alabama) I learned that UT was even being out-recruited at those schools by FCS schools and that it had reached the point where many of those high school coaches were downright angry about the lack of communication from UT. Several of them attended UT and mentioned they didn't plan to attend games at their alma mater because they had become so disconnected with the program because they felt Dooley and his staff didn't care about their support or having a relationship with them and that when they had reached out to Dooley they had either not heard back or had felt he was arrogant and condescending to them. Several of them said they had reached the point where it was broken and they didn't care about getting it fixed with Dooley.

Dubin: I remember the Jalen Ramsey recruiting story when Dooley allegedly sent a graduate assistant to talk to Ramsey and he never even talked to him. Jalen (from Brentwood Academy in Tennessee) was one of the top recruits in the country and I was just dumbfounded by that. I hope Dooley gets another head coaching job one day. We love train wrecks right?

Ward: For a person who appeared to be so prepared and detailed, there were alarming organizational issues when it came to recruiting. Dooley's staff did a really poor job of communicating with prospects and coaches at the high school level. There are countless stories of them apparently forgetting to contact highly-touted prospects on their board for weeks at a time. Dooley's last signing class in 2012 was a disaster. Tennessee didn't sign one offensive lineman in that class. In the SEC? That's unbelievable.

Patrick Brown: Tennessee beat reporter for Chattanooga Times Free Press.

The Dooley quote I remember most came in 2011 after a morning practice in September when Malik Jackson was absent. He wasn't asked about it during his group session with however many media were there that day, so I followed him off the field and into the parking lot between Haslam Field and the football complex to get an update. So I ask, and Dooley goes: "He had a tummy ache and his mommy wasn't here to hug him ... you can quote me on that."

Haney: Initially, I thought the news conferences were vast improvements on Kiffin's. Dooley was much more at ease. Kiffin always seemed to be trying so damned hard. Dooley was affable, funny, and candid. As time wore on, though, the way he'd talk about players was grating. He was quick to bury them in public, I thought.

Thompson: Derek Dooley as a head coach wasn't the most effective, to put it nicely. His methods didn't make a whole lot of sense at times. He was a guy that would out coaches in front of the players, and never took the blame for a loss to the media, it was always somebody else fault whether it was a player or a coach. Dooley was a very arrogant person that demanded respect, but didn't earn it; he walked around acting like he was Nick Saban, but didn't have the credentials.

 

[dduncan4163]

Part VI: Game Management

In Derek Dooley's first season Tennessee lost games in ways that defied logic. We start with the LSU contest on October 2nd... a game the Vols dropped in bizarre fashion. Here is video of the Vols loss to LSU in 2010.





Brown: I was actually in the stands for the LSU game in Baton Rouge; because that was one of the few remaining SEC venues I'd not yet visited. After the second-and-goal play is stopped, LSU, out of timeouts, looks like it's not sure what to do, and you can hear the panic take over the stadium. I'm thinking about how much of an epic choke this is going to be if Les Miles screws it up, and they do, as the ball is snapped when LSU quarterback Jordan Jefferson wasn't ready and Tennessee wins. There was never a replay of the four guys running on, two guys running off and two guys who nearly ran off then stayed on the field. Some Tennessee players already had gone down the tunnel to the locker room. LSU scores, and the stadium explodes in relief, and we just tried to figure out what happened as we left. That night in Baton Rouge, LSU fans were apologetic toward the Tennessee fans I saw. I think my friend and I got a free round or two of beer from them. The majority of them only stopped bad-mouthing Les Miles long enough to offer compliments along the lines of that Tennessee was heading in the right direction with Dooley.

Ward: The loss to LSU was crushing for Tennessee fans. The Vols had just pulled off a double-overtime win at home against UAB the week before, and confidence among the fan base was at a low point heading into the LSU game. Tennessee fans got to celebrate a huge upset win over LSU for a moment before they realized what had happened. I also thought in that moment the Vols had won, of course. Then that was taken away. I think that loss was crushing because fans really liked Dooley and that was the "signature" win for him early in his tenure. Instead, Dooley's staff had trumped Les Miles' mistake of mismanaging the clock at the end of the game. It was a disaster.

Smith: It's one thing to have 12 men on the field. But Dooley had 13 men on the field. 13! Who does that? Even Les Miles had to be surprised that somebody could possibly screw up the end of a game worse than him. The North Carolina loss isn't as bad because the Tar Heels basically exploited a loop hole in the rule book, but it's the kind of bad luck that only happens to coaches like Dooley.

The Vols would win their final 3 games of the 2010 season and earn a trip to the Music City Bowl on December 30th against North Carolina. Once again, lady luck would not be on their side.

Here is video of the Vols' loss in the Music City Bowl to North Carolina in 2010.





Dubin: I remember being at the Music City Bowl after the loss to UNC and I will never forget Dooley standing there after the loss and looking like a dad at the mall who can't find his kids. He was speechless, dumbfounded and just zapped.

With the Music City Bowl loss, the Vols would end the 2010 season at 6-7. In 2011 things got worse as the Vols finished 5-7, culminating with a historic 10-7 defeat at Kentucky, Tennessee's first loss to the Wildcats since 1984.

Here is video of the Vols loss to Kentucky in 2011.





Worley: Something seemed off that day. I don't know what it was, what the players were thinking, what some starters were thinking, what coaches were thinking, what some of the play calls were at the time... but something was off. We could never get anything going. We ended up losing somehow. It was one of more embarrassing losses I have been a part of. There was a rumor floating around that some guys didn't want to play in a bowl game so they weren't playing as hard. I heard that a few times but I don't think that was the case. It was just a day we couldn't get things to go right for us.

Brown: That game remains the one and only time I've been part of a court/field storming. And it all happened because Tennessee couldn't outscore an offense running the same six or eight plays over and over with a wide receiver playing quarterback. I remember seeing Kentucky fans tearing up chunks of the turf at Commonwealth.

Ward: The Kentucky loss has to be the turning point. Dooley lost the support of a lot of people, including fans, former players and financial people who are important to the program. Those people were still going to support Tennessee, and they wanted the Vols to win no matter who was coaching the team. But a lot of people realized after the Kentucky loss that Dooley was hurting the program. Kentucky's 2011 team was awful... I think Kentucky's staff would tell you they didn't think they were going to win. The loss to Kentucky came just one week after Tennessee had beaten Vanderbilt in overtime with Dooley proudly proclaiming in the locker room, "The one thing that Tennessee always does is kick the **** out of Vandy." The one thing at the time Tennessee wasn't supposed to do was lose to Kentucky --at least until the next week.

Smith: The Kentucky loss was definitely the first major sign that Dooley was in over his head. The Wildcats hadn't beaten the Vols in 26 years. And they finally ended the streak with a converted wide receiver at quarterback. Losing to Kentucky was bad enough in and of itself. But the way key players like Tyler Bray and Da'Rick Rodgers appeared disinterested really was an insult to the players and coaches who built that streak in the first place.

Haney: Losing to Kentucky was the one thing that a Tennessee coach couldn't do. Thou shalt not lose to Kentucky. Butch Jones probably had that sign made, and it's somewhere in the building by a urinal or something. I was born in Chattanooga in 1981, and Kentucky had only beaten Tennessee twice in my lifetime up until 2011 -- and not once since I was 3 years old. Tennessee had enough trouble trying to keep up with Florida ... Georgia ... South Carolina. When it suddenly couldn't beat Vanderbilt and Kentucky anymore? Yeah, that was a problem. It was going backward as a program, and it was obvious to everyone.

Low: Dooley lost his team in November 2011 when they lost to Kentucky. I talked to players, and after the game they were saying that Dooley wouldn't recover and that he'd be gone. Maybe UT should have cut bait with him right then, but that would have been a tough call after only two years. I knew after the 2011 season he had lost the team and that his firing was inevitable. Had (UT athletics director) Dave Hart been there longer he might have cut bait right then.

Brice: Sure, he could've saved his job still in 2012 but everyone knew that UK loss to that awful UK team foreshadowed bad things. Many people on campus will tell you it's when (Tennessee athletic director) Dave Hart knew he would have to fire him, much as when Mike Hamilton told me when the NCAA came to investigate Bruce Pearl and then that all unfolded, Hamilton knew he would have to fire Pearl.

Thompson: In 2011 Dooley didn't have a hint of respect from the players due to his methods as a head coach. The players not wanting to play in a "lesser" bowl game wasn't the issue. Players flat out didn't want to play for DEREK DOOLEY. So it wasn't the fact Dooley lost the team. He never had it.

Following that loss to Kentucky, Dooley went a memorable 38 days without public comment. No interviews, no social media posts, nothing. This was also at a time when most of his assistant coaches were resigning and some recruits to the Class of 2012 were de-committing.

Geist: You're the head coach at Tennessee, your team just lost for the first time to a team they've owned for three decades and you won't talk? That's arrogance. I think he felt he didn't need to explain himself to anyone and he wasn't going to. And he didn't.

Brown: I still can't believe he went that long without talking to the media. He should have had a "the-sky-isn't-falling press conference" the week following the Kentucky game, after which he said it was rock bottom and that in some sense it was good his players could get a taste of that disappointment. He could have just come out and said it wasn't acceptable and we'll work harder than ever this offseason to make sure we bounce back from it or something like that. Would that have been too difficult?

Ellis:I guess he didn't want to face all of that criticism. But that's why SEC coaches make the big bucks. The pressure of the job is intense. Coaches don't make it any easier on themselves by avoiding the spotlight. Dooley, in particular, took a hit by somewhat alienating local reporters during that span.

Brice: Dooley's silence upon first getting the job and the silence after that were, in my opinion, two factors that forever limited him and contributed to his downfall.

Budden: The one move that said a lot about the situation was when (Tennessee defensive coordinator) Justin Wilcox left to head to Washington. The year before you turn down Texas, and now you accept a job at a middle of the pack Pac-12 team? Of the seven assistants that left, that one said the most.

 

[dduncan4163]

Part VIII: Does Derek Dooley get a bad rap?

Dooley would be replaced by Cincinnati head coach Butch Jones. Ironically, the Vols win over Jones's Bearcats in 2011 would have to be considered one of Dooley's best moments at Tennessee. Considering where the program stood when he took over, does Derek Dooley deserve the criticism he has received over the years for his efforts as Tennessee's football coach? Opinions do vary...

Low: 25 years from now, history will not judge Derek Dooley well. He will go down as one of the worst head coaches in SEC history. But it's not all his fault. Dooley's last recruiting class was bad, but what started Tennessee down this path was Kiffin's 2009 class. It was ranked 10th-15th nationally, but that class was a total fraud. Trouble guys, busts, players that left... that class started it. Remember the guys Kiffin ran off? Quarterbacks Bryce Petty and Tajh Boyd... that started it all, and then it got worse under Dooley.

Brown: If anything, what Butch Jones has done in the two-plus years since replacing Dooley has only made Dooley look even more inept. The recruiting success and welcoming back of former players that Jones has done makes you wonder what Dooley and Company were doing while they were here. Jones has provided the stability Dooley could not.

Hargis: Most coaches take over a program that had been struggling, or else there likely wouldn't have been a coaching change to begin with, and it's what they do with that opportunity once they're in place that defines how good a coach they are. Derek Dooley will be remembered as one of the worst head coaches in the history of the SEC, a laughingstock among fans and media, and that is 100-percent on him and his lack of skills - both as an on-the-field coach who seemed ill-prepared for any in-game situation and for being unable to connect in any way with the coaches and players he would rely on for recruiting.

Fleming: He didn't get a bad rap. He knew what he was walking into and he had no plan on how to fix it. If you fail to plan, you plan to fail.


Kevin C. Cox



Worley: Everyone is quick to point fingers at him because of the three years he had, but you have to look at what was happening at Tennessee at the time. Hard to come in and set the groundwork when you are getting guys that weren't committed to you and don't even know who you are... so, I think he gets beat up more than he deserves. There are definitely some things we could have done better while he was here.

Bartholomew: The difficult time that my class went through brought us closer together. Dooley formed a "Unity Counsel" group that was called to lead the team. That group still keeps up with each other and you can see the leadership carry over with players like (Tennessee Defensive End/Linebacker) Curt Maggitt who was on the counsel with Dooley.

Phillips: It's one of my many pet peeves when people talk about a coach and say he forgot how to coach or the game has passed him by. Dooley wasn't hired by Nick Saban because he was a stooge. He hasn't lasted with the Dallas Cowboys because he can't coach. So to some extent, yes, I think he got a bad rap. Overall, I think Dooley is a bright guy who knows a lot of football and has been a successful position coach. I don't think he has what it takes to be a head coach.

White: He does not get a bad rap, he deserves it. He was simply not a good coach!! He should have never been hired in the first place. He may be the worst hire in the history of Tennessee sports. Maybe in the SEC for that matter. It is very ironic that when Coach Fulmer was fired, players, former players and staff were very upset! Players addressed their feelings on national media on how they were not happy about the firing. When Dooley was fired no one said a word. You do the math.

Dubin: He was awful and anyone who tries to defend him should be banished to Elba.
He was awful and anyone who tries to defend him should be banished to Elba.

Joe Dubin






Ramey: I think Dooley has the reputation he has because it's one that he earned, given the amount of evidence he left behind at Tennessee --- both on and off the field. Staff turnover, bad game-day coach, recruited and signed offensive linemen like other coaches sign punters. Yeah, the situation was bad. But Dooley did next to nothing, if anything, to improve the program he inherited.

Brice: I respect Dooley for trying to carve family time and wanting to do things that still allowed his coaches some freedom in the evenings, etc. But Tennessee was in a bad spot then and had been down for a sustained time. Recruiting was hard work; it's even harder now, which makes Butch Jones' work more impressive. Dooley had grown up in Georgia and worked at LSU. I've said this before but think about it: By and large, Georgia and LSU get who they want in-state. And there's a lot of talent. I'm not sure Dooley understood coming in how hellacious the recruiting battles are at Tennessee, especially when trying to pull up a program.

Elliott: Every time I go to the UT football complex now, I am struck by two thoughts. The first is how massive and impressive it is and the second is how much of it has Dooley's stamp on it. He was only UT's coach for three seasons but he happened to be the guy in charge when the bulk of the work was done on the $45 million facility that houses the coaches' offices as well. Dooley took the media on a 90 minute walking tour of the soon-to-be finished facility in which he showed off every detail and made it clear that many of the ideas were his. Sometimes it is fun to think of how many coaches and players will work and train in what is, essentially, Dooley's building.



Dooley was incompetence mixed with arrogance. He was the worst HC in UT history Thank God and Greyhound he's gone

GO VOLS

 

[dduncan4163]

Smart ass only looks good on competent people.

Yup he had such unearned arrogance it makes me sick.

 

[goooooovols]

Smart ass only looks good on competent people.

Sounds good boss, I'm the type that usually will give people the benefit of the doubt and look for the best...some people attack other's downfalls :salute:

I think he was going to fail regardless with the hand he was dealt thats all....we basically handed ourselves a death sentence when we fired CPF and hired CLF, regardless I enjoyed my vols during his tenure and those years will make this year that much sweeter! epper:

 

[dduncan4163]

Never forget what Rock Bottom feels like Nation

 

[allvol123]

Sounds good boss, I'm the type that usually will give people the benefit of the doubt and look for the best...some people attach others downfalls :salute:

I think he was going to fail regardless with the hand he was dealt thats all....we basically handed ourselves a death sentence when we fired CPF and hired CLF, regardless I enjoyed my vols during his tenure and those years will make this year that much sweeter! epper:

His years here were the worst in modern history for the Vols. How was that enjoyable? I despise his idiotic ass and hate he ever collected one paycheck from this school.

 

[allvol123]

Yup he had such unearned arrogance it makes me sick.

I know that feeling.

 

[dduncan4163]

Never forget

 

[dduncan4163]

Damn it's hard to believe it's been less than 4 years. Seems like an eternity ago to me.

Thank You Butch

 

[feathersax]

dduncan, thanks for the historical summary of DD at UT. While it was painful to read, it was a good account of the Dooley years. I admit to supporting that guy until the KY debacle, to the chagrin of other Vol fans. Like I told a GA fan from Athens last week: Derek Dooley was thrust into a position for which he was ill-prepared to manage; plus, he just wasn't head coach material. I did like to listen to Barbara. :hi:

 

[The Crimson Cried]

Rumination is when folks can't let go of the past and move on.

Flawed logic. I (as well as many others) occasionally talk about things that have had an effect on me both positively and negatively in the past. It does not equal not being able to let go. It equals being aware of how things in the past have affected me and being honest about it. It is therapeutic. Can I go and watch a movie with my wife and not think about Derek Dooley? No problem. Do I think about Derek Dooley 99.9999999 percent of the time? No. You get it.

 

[Volunteer_Kirby]

I'm still baffled the we hired a guy with a LOSING RECORD...FROM CONFERENCE-USA. UT should have found an interim head coach instead of settling with Doolander. It's got to be one of the worst hires ever for a major P5 school. And guess what? Kiffin isn't far behind that Dooley in that category.