50 dead, 40+ wounded in nightclub attack in Florida

[orangeluvr]

At this point, I think the FBI is going to take a beating since he (Mateen) has already been on their radar scope twice. I'm not sure what else can be done except what was outlined earlier in the thread.

If Obama couldn't get gun control passed after Newtown and the murder of children, I don't see him getting it passed now.

Least ye forget the repubs wrote and passed the first GC legislation called the Brady Bill. The Dems have never taken a gun away from anyone, if so site the case. :question:

 

[ClearwaterVol]

Trump is right.

Letting in 50,000 refugees could net a lot more carnage than what we have already witnessed.

Banning people with that one criteria in mind is not right. He's a scumbag. BTW, she is too.

This is a country founded with the idea that people shouldn't be grouped and discriminated against based upon their religious beliefs. It was founded with the idea that the people were the last line of defense against tyranny. We've got two candidates peddling fear to the American people and trying to make us ignore some of the most basic principles upon which our nation was founded.

 

[Vol8188]

What makes one a member of ISIS?

I would need more than just calling yourself an isis member, which is all he did. When the FBI spoke with him they found that hey had no ties to terrorist and was embellishing for attention.

 

[volinbham]

gay muslim democrat ISIS domestic terrorist murders 50 gay puerto rican democrats...Quite the headline..

Don't forget white - Robspics told us Arabs are considered white. When pointed out to him that this guy is of Afghan heritage he said he was from the Middle East so still white. When pointed out to him Afghanistan isn't the Middle East he found some maps.

So, this guy was white.

 

[Grand Vol]

I know personally that self-hate is common among LGBT folks. Typically people get past it as they come out and accept themselves, but not all.

There is a reason the suicide rate among LGBT teens is significantly higher then their peers. I think a lot of these suicide attempts are the result of self-loathing folks are unable to shed, so they direct their hate on themselves. A smaller percentage direct the hate outwards onto others. This may be an example of the latter.

That's a pretty damn big example if you are correct.

But then again, it could be a mix of both. Self hate along with religious motivation. A conflict within his mind that eventually made him snap and perform this hateful act.

 

[ClearwaterVol]

I never said the GOP was blameless in this aspect.

I wasn't accusing you. Just venting about something that I found sickening.

 

[Grand Vol]

Least ye forget the repubs wrote and passed the first GC legislation called the Brady Bill. The Dems have never taken a gun away from anyone, if so site the case. :question:

Perhaps you should educate yourself before looking stupid.

The Brady Bill was created and brought into Congress by Chuck Schumer. And passed in 1993 in a Democrat controlled House and Senate and signed into law by a Democrat President.

 

[ClearwaterVol]

That's a pretty damn big example if you are correct.

But then again, it could be a mix of both. Self hate along with religious motivation. A conflict within his mind that eventually made him snap and perform this hateful act.

I think this act probably had multiple motivating factors. The information we have thus far doesn't paint the picture of true religious conviction. Was it a factor? Probably, seems more like justification rather than motivation in my mind right now.

 

[RikidyBones]

What makes one a member of ISIS?

How many isis reward points do you think he had? I don't think he had a platinum level. Maybe silver. Tops.

 

[gcbvol]

That's a pretty damn big example if you are correct.

But then again, it could be a mix of both. Self hate along with religious motivation. A conflict within his mind that eventually made him snap and perform this hateful act.

From what is coming out it does appear to be a mix of factors. The specifics of those factors are still in question.

I'm not saying I think he was homosexual, but detailing why I believe it plausible.

 

[orangeluvr]

gay muslim democrat ISIS domestic terrorist murders 50 gay puerto rican democrats...Quite the headline..

Quite the biggot you are! Demoncrats are to blame for all the ills in the world ! :shakehead:

 

[volinbham]

I would need more than just calling yourself an isis member, which is all he did. When the FBI spoke with him they found that hey had no ties to terrorist and was embellishing for attention.

You could have just said you don't know what makes someone a member

When the FBI talked to him (2013 for the incident you raise above) ISIS was emerging.

From Comey's press conf.

Comey, the FBI director, said that the agency is "highly confident" Mateen was radicalized, at least in part, by viewing extremism on the internet.
"There are strong indications of radicalization by this killer and of potential inspiration by foreign terrorist organizations," Comey said.

So the recruiting efforts were successful.

ISIS may not have planned the attack with him and given the specific order but their strategy to recruit people like him and give them free reign to act in their name certainly was part of this atrocity.

 

[SpaceCoastVol]

Good. If you keep progressing like this, you'll be coloring within the lines soon.

You ARE an optimist.

 

[Grand Vol]

Banning people with that one criteria in mind is not right. He's a scumbag. BTW, she is too.

This is a country founded with the idea that people shouldn't be grouped and discriminated against based upon their religious beliefs. It was founded with the idea that the people were the last line of defense against tyranny. We've got two candidates peddling fear to the American people and trying to make us ignore some of the most basic principles upon which our nation was founded.

This is something I tend to agree with Trump on. There has to be some better criteria for screening such people before opening the floodgates. I know it won't be easy and it will take time, but good grief, we can't toss open the doors and just let anyone waltz in.

We've got people that have been waiting for visas and citizenship for years. Years mind you. I know a guy who married a Filipino local while overseas who couldn't get her a green card to bring her to the States. For almost eight years he was caught up in red tape. I lost contact with him and I don't know if he ever did get her approved.

If a US military member that's serving his country can't even get his wife approved to immigrate, who in the blue **** are we as a nation to blindly allow refugees we know nothing about in without question.

 

[W.TN.Orange Blood]

Don't forget white - Robspics told us Arabs are considered white. When pointed out to him that this guy is of Afghan heritage he said he was from the Middle East so still white. When pointed out to him Afghanistan isn't the Middle East he found some maps.

So, this guy was white.

These terrible white devils that are out there on the loose. Lock up your wife & kids so they be safe.

 

[Grand Vol]

From what is coming out it does appear to be a mix of factors. The specifics of those factors are still in question.

I'm not saying I think he was homosexual, but detailing why I believe it plausible.

I'm with you on "wait and see" with this, but am tossing out the possibility that a conflict of such proportions in someone's mind can cause them to have a mental breakdown. And in this case, seek out violence as the only option they believe they have.

 

[volinbham]

Saw CBS article where they are saying he was bi-polar. Great, now we may be discriminating against the mentally ill if we criticize this guy. Probably Monsanto's fault for GMOs that caused this.

 

[SpaceCoastVol]

The left looks at this and asks how did he manage this ?

The right asks why did he do it ?

The left realizes we cannot control the why. We need to deal with the how. The right wants to condemn the why, so it can blame people unlike them. 5something we cannot change.

This, above all else, is why the GOP is a soon to be footnote in history.

And the left's idea is that this is the only way to accomplish this kind of thing. It is amusing when the left talks of critical thinking, yet refuse to believe that there is any other way to accomplish mass murder. "Lineal" thinking is what you mean.

 

[KentheOrange]

Banning people with that one criteria in mind is not right. He's a scumbag. BTW, she is too.

This is a country founded with the idea that people shouldn't be grouped and discriminated against based upon their religious beliefs. It was founded with the idea that the people were the last line of defense against tyranny. We've got two candidates peddling fear to the American people and trying to make us ignore some of the most basic principles upon which our nation was founded.

This is true. However, this is the first time in our history that one of those religious beliefs means the extermination of all other religious beliefs.

Don't forget, the Crusades were fought against Muslims and their religious beliefs. We can thank the Muslims and their religious beliefs for the creation of our own Marine Corp.

It's not a simple problem and simple solutions are not going to work.

 

[ClearwaterVol]

This is true. However, this is the first time in our history that one of those religious beliefs means the extermination of all other religious beliefs.

Don't forget, the Crusades were fought against Muslims and their religious beliefs. We can thank the Muslims and their religious beliefs for the creation of our own Marine Corp.

It's not a simple problem and simple solutions are not going to work.

And both candidates have only offered simple solutions.

 

[samanderson]

its much easier for the left to accept if they can just list all these islamic terrorists as nuts or insane.

No, I can assure you we see the big picture. This a major clash of civilizations which is not unique with respect to history. It happened before in the 8th century when the Moors invaded Europe, and then again in the 11th and 12th centuries when the Crusaders launched their incursions into the Holy Lands to wrest them away from the Arabic Muslims. We have never liked them and they certainly have never liked us. We fully get all of that. We also understand, just as in those previous clashes, this one won't be played out in a few months or years. It will take a number of decades for things to get back anywhere near normal, primarily because many of the battles this time are being launched through the Internet rather than on horseback.

It behooves us all here to keep these fundamentals in mind as events continue to unfold now and into the very distant future. Doing so makes it easier to more accurately assess the details of those said events. :hi:

 

[W.TN.Orange Blood]

Obama is making a speech now. Talking about ISIS & how they're really on the run. I believe him as much as thinking Vandy will win the SEC East this year.

 

[Grand Vol]

Obama is making a speech now. Talking about ISIS & how they're really on the run. I believe him as much as thinking Vandy will win the SEC East this year.

National Security = gun control

This guy is a hoot.

 

[volinbham]

This guy is the worst straw man argument purveyor ever.

 

[volinbham]

Always madder at political opponents than our real enemies.