Looking ahead to next year

[Coach Jumper]

You sweat a lot but have a terrific voice! Anyone else hungry for meatloaf?

Can I sleep on it?..

 

[alexvol]

I have wondered if Westbrook has been happy for this whole year. I know her personality is not a ra ra type but she just looks frustrated to me. Anyone other that me think she may transfer. I hope she stays but i have been around and coached boy and girls in HS and believe something is going on with her. JMHO

If she is smart she will transfer.Holly has had a definite hand in her retrograde as a player.Go someplace where your talent can be developed.

 

[djtee]

Might be too soon to write this thread, but I'm doing it anyway....what are everyone's thoughts going into next season? To be honest, aside from the biggest issue of Holly likely still coaching this program, I'm extremely concerned about the roster and fear a really really ugly season. Here's what concerns me:

1. Coaching. I wont dive into this...every other thread on this board addresses it, but in summary, if Holly is running the show, it's going to be another long year.

2. Front court play. For as much as we criticize Russell, losing a 6-6 center who can finish inside and is good for 15/9 every night is massive. Our replacement options are KK, Harris, Green and the #73 recruit in the country. That scares me. Especially when there are players like Kalani Brown, Azura Stevens, Teaira McCowan, Brianna Turner, Ruth Hebard, etc. at other top programs who will dominate us inside.

3. Turnovers. We struggled horribly with turnovers this year. We have another freshman coming in at PG next year who everyone is hoping replaces our current highly touted freshmen point guards who struggled with turnovers. Who is to say Massengill wont have the exact same issues? Our team had about a 1:1 A/TO ratio, and that isn't going to cut it.

4. No experience. Our roster will have 2 seniors, 1 seldom used junior, 4 sophomores and 4 freshmen. The last time I can remember a roster that stacked with youth was 2008-09 when we were bounced by Ball State in the first round.

5. Lack of an offensive system. This is an issue every year, but for next year stems off of the front court play. The clear focus of this year's team was to get the ball to Russell and put her in a position to score. When that didn't work, we usually jacked up bad shots from the perimeter. Next year we wont have Russell. Will we finally implement an offense where there's ball movement and we'll have the luxury of seeing a pick being used? Doubtful, but we'll see.

6. Player motivation. Body language, effort, and player cohesion was awful today outside of our seniors IMO. That does not bode well looking ahead to next year and beyond. Such a stark contrast from big chunks of the first part of the year and the first half of the Notre Dame game. Can players play well together on the court and bring their best efforts night in and night out? If they're struggling with their shot, can they refocus on contributing on other ways?


If we can get a new coach, I think the outcome could be drastically different, but I fear the program could sink to a new low under Holly next season if our roster and coaching is what it's projected to be today.

Make no mistake Jazmine Massengill is not a small pg 6-0 6-1 but the difference between her and Westbrook is Massengill is quicker and a very good ball handler. She also knows that she will need to be able to hit the 3 and not turn the ball over like Westbrook and Hayes 238 turnovers that is unreal.

 

[Volfan2012]

I am wrong...Collins is #69 on the Hoopgurlz top 100. The awards she’s hauling in may indicate that she’s a better player than Hoopgurlz projects, but we’ll see how she pans out.

Depth looks solid IF players make strides and the freshmen are ready to play. Considering the ups and downs we had with freshmen this year, I’m understandably a bit nervous about expecting a lot from an incoming group that isn’t as highly touted.

She is top 10 at Prospect Nation and was first team Naismith. She averaged a double double this season and her team has won several State Championships since she has been there.

 

[Nuyoika]

Make no mistake Jazmine Massengill is not a small pg 6-0 6-1 but the difference between her and Westbrook is Massengill is quicker and a very good ball handler. She also knows that she will need to be able to hit the 3 and not turn the ball over like Westbrook and Hayes 238 turnovers that is unreal.

What is really unreal is w/ the rate that they turned the ball over some games they usually still got 10 or 15 or even 20+ more possessions than their opponent and still lost. Now that is unreal. Is Massengill a good passer? Does anyone know what her A/O ratio is?

 

[madtownvol]

7. How many players will we lose during the off season ?
They had front row and back door passes in watching this tragedy unfold. Many thinking they would bring
UT back to its glory days.
May be having second thoughts about
now. Sigh.

So you are calling the players quitters eh? After every painful loss, there is always someone blah, blah, blahing about transfers because adding more negative speculation is just so helpful. These players will all be back and all will be improved (how much remains an open question).

 

[bballnut90]

Not sure he's that in the know if he thinks Mimi Collins is the 73rd ranked player. She was just named as one of 5 finalists for Naismith Player of the Year.

Edit: Sorry. I hadn't made it through the thread to see VOLFANIND had already mentioned this.

Here is how she's ranked by different publications:

Amira "Mimi" Collins - 6'3" F/P - #50 BlueStar - #69 ESPN - #9 ProspectsNation

Kind of all over the place. I listed the Hoopgurlz ranking because that's what I check most frequently.

It's great that Mimi's a finalist for Naismith POY. Usually 1st team slots are reserved for players who are considered top prospects. My hope is that she's being sorely underrated by BlueStar and Hoopgurlz. I'm cautiously optimistic, but at the same time hesitant to assume she's going to come in and be a huge impact player from day 1.

 

[djtee]

What is really unreal is w/ the rate that they turned the ball over some games they usually still got 10 or 15 or even 20+ more possessions than their opponent and still lost. Now that is unreal. Is Massengill a good passer? Does anyone know what her A/O ratio is?

From what i hear her Assist Turnover Ratio is very good. Note i reached out to her today and her response, She is ready to go. And i truly think she will win the pg battle and start, Remember she played on a team loaded with big time players to come.

 

[SCspur]

Make no mistake Jazmine Massengill is not a small pg 6-0 6-1 but the difference between her and Westbrook is Massengill is quicker and a very good ball handler. She also knows that she will need to be able to hit the 3 and not turn the ball over like Westbrook and Hayes 238 turnovers that is unreal.

Uh no sir Massengill is not quicker than Westbrook. I have seen both up close and personal and while Massengill is the better ball handler and passer she is NOT the athlete Westbrook is.

 

[djtee]

Uh no sir Massengill is not quicker than Westbrook. I have seen both up close and personal and while Massengill is the better ball handler and passer she is NOT the athlete Westbrook is.

I have watched Massengill and Westbrook and yes Massengill is quicker then Westbrook and by far a better ball handler, And me be clear this is no knock against Westbrook but she is no pg and she knows it. Westbrook is better suited for the 2g spot. All she needs to do over the summer is work on her outside shooting and free throws. Trust me the new coach whoever it is will make that move from day one. Mark it down Massengill will be the starting pg for this team.

 

[bballnut90]

It still baffles me how fans consistently think their incoming freshmen will be big upgrades over existing players. There are exceptions to the rule, but those are far and few between. I don't see how fans are expecting an incoming freshman to beat out Westbrook and Hayes, two current freshmen who logged big minutes and were top 10 recruits. Westbrook was the top rated guard in her class, Hayes was a top 10 recruit. Massengill is the #26 recruit according to HG and is described as a combo guard rather than a point guard. I'm glad that fans are excited for incoming players, but realistically I just don't see Massengill beating out both EW and AH for PG duties.

 

[Nuyoika]

It still baffles me how fans consistently think their incoming freshmen will be big upgrades over existing players. Westbrook was the top rated guard in her class.

I was gonna say, Massengill must be the down right ridiculous to take minutes from Westbrook next year. Westbrook was not only the top rated at her position she was #2 overall. By some services I think #1.

 

[madtownvol]

It is worth watching the player interviews embedded in this story. What bodes well for nexy year is that the returners are ready to get after it:

Lady Vols bow out of NCAA tourney

“Our overall toughness … we’ve got to go stronger with the ball and go up with a little more authority,” Lockwood said. “That is a toughness piece. We have to rebound better … there have been games where we didn’t rebound with Tennessee toughness. We’ve got to regain some of that.

“And then the defensive piece. What we did in the first quarter, we’ve got to sustain that – being able to sustain a high level of effort and toughness. Because that is what defense is.”

The returning players all said they needed to get in the gym in the off-season.

“I am very motivated to get back in the gym,” said Hayes, who noted she needed to become a vocal leader and develop a consistent jumper, especially from the arc.

When Russell returned from the press conference, Jackson left her locker to hug the senior. Jackson will now enter her final off-season as a Lady Vol.

“I need to work on everything,” Jackson said. “I’m ready to work already. We couldn’t get the job done for (the seniors) this year, and we thanked them for everything they did. They gave their all.”

 

[djtee]

It still baffles me how fans consistently think their incoming freshmen will be big upgrades over existing players. There are exceptions to the rule, but those are far and few between. I don't see how fans are expecting an incoming freshman to beat out Westbrook and Hayes, two current freshmen who logged big minutes and were top 10 recruits. Westbrook was the top rated guard in her class, Hayes was a top 10 recruit. Massengill is the #26 recruit according to HG and is described as a combo guard rather than a point guard. I'm glad that fans are excited for incoming players, but realistically I just don't see Massengill beating out both EW and AH for PG duties.

It still baffles me when a coach is playing someone out of position and another pg who refuse to shoot a jump shot. And to add to that Westbrook and Davis leading the nation in turnovers. I`m only giving you the facts and by the way Holly will not be coaching this team.

 

[LA Vol]

Westbrook will start next year. She expected to be the starting PG this year and that's why she's here. Another coach might have sat her more when she was careless with the ball, but Holly coddled her a great deal. Only at the end of the season when her bad decisions and TOs were really hurting the team did Holly get in her face. Pat would have been all over her from day one, challenging her to play up to her potential and be a leader, and she would have been a better player for it.

 

[djtee]

Westbrook will start next year. She expected to be the starting PG this year and that's why she's here. Another coach might have sat her more when she was careless with the ball, but Holly coddled her a great deal. Only at the end of the season when her bad decisions and TOs were really hurting the team did Holly get in her face. Pat would have been all over her from day one, challenging her to play up to her potential and be a leader, and she would have been a better player for it.

That`s what i have been saying i remember but not sure what game it was but Andy Landers on ESPN said the team pg play was flat out unacceptable. I can under stand her and Hayes are freshmen, But to allow them to play out of control lake they did is crazy. You can`t just have Hayes just driving to the basket and throwing up wild shots or passing the ball when she should have shot it. Note when Oregon St beat Western Kentucky University there was a time out and wow the Western Kentucky University coach was in the face of two of her players. I understand Westbrook want to play pg but to me and many others the 2g would be better for her.

 

[bballnut90]

It still baffles me when a coach is playing someone out of position and another pg who refuse to shoot a jump shot. And to add to that Westbrook and Davis leading the nation in turnovers. I`m only giving you the facts and by the way Holly will not be coaching this team.

Not quite leading the nation in turnovers....but I agree that Hayes needs to work on her jumpshot and I think Westbrook is best suited as a 2. I'd love if Holly isn't around next year, but I'll be shocked if she isn't roaming the sidelines with her hands on her hips for at least one more season.

 

[Volfan2012]

I think we will be better at the point Massengill is a better point guard than either one of these girls. I can see her taking most of the minutes at point guard if Holly lets the best players play. Westbrook has to learn to shoot free throws she is 55 percent right now can't have any guard doing that. Hayes must be able to hit the open outside shot consistently.
The two guard will probably be Meme hopefully she improves again as much as she did from sophomore to junior. Green will challenge for minutes she is a scorer who has been her high school teams main player on offense she could make a difference.
I think center could be better defensively but we'll have to make up points here. We may can do it by cutting down on turnovers how many did we have a game trying to feed the post.
Davis needs to become an aggressive player bigger and stronger with a mindset to take it to the rim and score.
I am expecting Collins to win the four spot she can score and rebound works hard and is aggressive on the floor. She is not really a center needs to play the four has the ability to step out and make the outside shot.
We'll be better is all the present players improve their games and their shooting. We'll be better if the incoming freshmen Collins and Green are immediate scorers like they are for their high school teams.
We'll be worse if no one does anything this summer and come back the same players they are now. We'll be worse if the freshmen are not ready to contribute especially Green, Massengill, and Collins.

 

[SCspur]

I have watched Massengill and Westbrook and yes Massengill is quicker then Westbrook and by far a better ball handler, And me be clear this is no knock against Westbrook but she is no pg and she knows it. Westbrook is better suited for the 2g spot. All she needs to do over the summer is work on her outside shooting and free throws. Trust me the new coach whoever it is will make that move from day one. Mark it down Massengill will be the starting pg for this team.

I wholeheartedly agree that Massengill should be the starting PG. She has better handles, vision and knows how to manage a game better then Westbrook. I just think Evina is the better athlete. Having an elite PG is a step in the right direction and I think Massengill is better then both Hayes and Westbrook shooting wise and game management. The answer for Tenn next year is who will step up and take charge!

 

[djtee]

Not quite leading the nation in turnovers....but I agree that Hayes needs to work on her jumpshot and I think Westbrook is best suited as a 2. I'd love if Holly isn't around next year, but I'll be shocked if she isn't roaming the sidelines with her hands on her hips for at least one more season.

Well you might be correct about Holly around for one more year same here i hope not. But Holly knows she can`t blame no one but her self.

 

[LadyVol1908]

From what i hear her Assist Turnover Ratio is very good. Note i reached out to her today and her response, She is ready to go. And i truly think she will win the pg battle and start, Remember she played on a team loaded with big time players to come.

It’s beyond disturbing when fans reach out to future players. Especially when they spew negative remarks regarding their future coach. I can only imagine you trying your best to plant a bad seed in that young ladies head.

 

[T_Vol376]

It’s beyond disturbing when fans reach out to future players. Especially when they spew negative remarks regarding their future coach. I can only imagine you trying your best to plant a bad seed in that young ladies head.

Really beyond disturbing and out of line. If I was a player parent, I would have a problem with this. Wow.

 

[Tenacguy50]

I'll say what's probably already been said...As long as HW is here next year or 10 years from now...The Lady Vols BB program is toast.

 

[Tenacguy50]

I think we will be better at the point Massengill is a better point guard than either one of these girls. I can see her taking most of the minutes at point guard if Holly lets the best players play. Westbrook has to learn to shoot free throws she is 55 percent right now can't have any guard doing that. Hayes must be able to hit the open outside shot consistently.
The two guard will probably be Meme hopefully she improves again as much as she did from sophomore to junior. Green will challenge for minutes she is a scorer who has been her high school teams main player on offense she could make a difference.
I think center could be better defensively but we'll have to make up points here. We may can do it by cutting down on turnovers how many did we have a game trying to feed the post.
Davis needs to become an aggressive player bigger and stronger with a mindset to take it to the rim and score.
I am expecting Collins to win the four spot she can score and rebound works hard and is aggressive on the floor. She is not really a center needs to play the four has the ability to step out and make the outside shot.
We'll be better is all the present players improve their games and their shooting. We'll be better if the incoming freshmen Collins and Green are immediate scorers like they are for their high school teams.
We'll be worse if no one does anything this summer and come back the same players they are now. We'll be worse if the freshmen are not ready to contribute especially Green, Massengill, and Collins.

I don't care if Candace, Tamika, Chimique, Izzy all had eligibility remaining. Holly couldn't coach that group to the SEC championship. If HW is here next year, you'll see the same BS as the last 3 - 4 years.

 

[Vol67]

I actually think the overall youth combined w/ the 2 very good recruiting classes over the past 3 years is why Holly will stay. I honestly don't see any scenario when she would be fired. Period. However, I see your concerns. They will be very very young. They were inconsistent when they had experience so expecting them to not be plagued by inconsistencey as they continue to get younger is silly. If the talented freshman from this year as well as Green and Jackson progress over the summer they could have another season similar to this one. This season as whole wasn't bad but I do think the start may have made some think they wouldn't see some of the stuff they saw near the end.

Just like every team they will have questions that need to be answered. Who is the leader on the court? Who is responsible for setting the tone with their play and their voice? Unless they indentify who that is, I agree that next year could get rough early. On the upside, they have all the potential in the world and if they do in fact implement a motion offense and teach these kids how to pass, as well as principles for beating a zone, and what help side defense is they will be alright.

Holly doesn't have to have all the answers. Some people are great instructors (they can build you a process doc on how to do something like no other) but they are poor teachers (they don't have the ability to show or explain what they see in their head to a student in a way that the student can receive in the info and then reproduce the same or similar results) She gets 3 paid assistants though, so she must find someone who does have the answers and put them on her staff. You can't go year after year, recruiting class after recruiting class, different players, different offense (supposedly), yet still have the same problems. That is systemic and infers that either you don't know what is wrong or you haven't found a way to teach it. I have watched plenty of the videos that the LV staff does after practices which it sounds like the staff knows what is wrong, so where is the disconnect?

IF Holly stays the only way they make the tourney is if they have a cupcake schedule and it'll still be 50/50