Barnhart: Vols on right track says Dooley

#251
#251
emainvol said:
It doesn't matter how you describe it. To say that Lane Kiffin left this program in worse shape than what Saban inherited in Michigan St. shows a complete absence of understanding.
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the combo of Fulmer/Kiffin left UT in a place that was very similar to a program that had been hit by penalties. That is not a stretch at all
 
#253
#253
tvolsfan said:
Am I saying that Dooley was in a position to win right away? Absolutely not. Am I saying Dooley took a job where a competent could show signs of progression and indicate that he would get the team back to the top in the near future? Absolutely. He hasn't done that.
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no what you're doing is using a completely irrelevant stat to try and make him look bad. There are plenty others you can use and I'm sure a couple of posters will help if you get stumped
 
#254
#254
utvolpj said:
the combo of Fulmer/Kiffin left UT in a place that was very similar to a program that had been hit by penalties. That is not a stretch at all
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Sure, but it is a huge stretch to compare winning at Tennessee to winning at Michigan State when Saban took over.
 
#255
#255
utvolpj said:
the combo of Fulmer/Kiffin left UT in a place that was very similar to a program that had been hit by penalties. That is not a stretch at all
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All things considered (sanctions, regional or state standing, tradition) it absolutely is.
 
#256
#256
tvolsfan said:
What kind of extension did Shula get after 2005? Serious question. It certainly wasn't enough to keep him until 2007.



That's complete bull****. Saban took over a program that always has (and probably always will be) second tier program in its own state. Dooley was taking over the winningest program in college football over the 85 years prior to his arrival.
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im not a big fan of Dooley, but you cant be seriously suggesting that the Vols success in the past 85 years, in any way demeans the absolute train wreck that Dooley walked into.:no:
 
#257
#257
utvolpj said:
no what you're doing is using a completely irrelevant stat to try and make him look bad. There are plenty others you can use and I'm sure a couple of posters will help if you get stupmed
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Name recognition, history, and tradition have a lot to do with building programs. There's a reason it doesn't take as long to rebuild at Alabama or Oklahoma as it does at a school like South Carolina or UCLA.
 
#258
#258
emainvol said:
All things considered (sanctions, regional or state standing, tradition) it absolutely is.
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what was our "standing" when Dooley took over? We were on our 3rd coach in 3 seasons and were being laughed at. Hadn't won a meaningful game in years and our previous coach's recruiting class was on the verge of all-time bust status. Tradition? Funny how that gets thrown out now but laughed at when others do. How many titles was that good for in the last 13-14yrs?
 
#259
#259
emainvol said:
It doesn't matter how you describe it. To say that Lane Kiffin left this program in worse shape than what Saban inherited in Michigan St. shows a complete absence of understanding.
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Not sure I agree with that. We were a special kind of god awful after Kiffin left.
 
#261
#261
orange parmejohn said:
im not a big fan of Dooley, but you cant be seriously suggesting that the Vols success in the past 85 years, in any way demeans the absolute train wreck that Dooley walked into.:no:
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It's every bit as fair as comparing him to Dooley by using a record that ignores his first, very good year at Toledo or his last very good year at Michigan St. Or to claim that walking into a penalized program is somehow not even close to as bad as to being handed an All American candidate at QB. Or any number of other things. Hell, Alabama wasn't in very good shape when he got there either. We see how that has gone. LSU was a train wreck post-DiNardo. Point is, Saban has a history of turning around bad to absolutely dreadful situations, and Dooley has a history that includes an 8-4 season in the WAC, 4 losing seasons, a team that quit on him damn near every time things got tough last year, and a team that lost to a team with a WR at QB.

Yeah, bad comparison.
 
#263
#263
Negateer said:
Why would Peterman see the field when we have a potential AA taking the snaps?
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If you had recognized the context of that statement, you would have realized that it is in reference to Worley (a freshman, like Peterman will be) starting half of last season.

In my eyes, 8-4 is NOT a sign of improvement with a potential AA taking the snaps.
 
#267
#267
utvolpj said:
well hell you got me. That should be good for at least 4 more wins and an SEC title. Case closed- Dooley sucks :worship:
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Honestly, I don't need any more proof that he sucks, he has been doing a pretty good job of making the argument for me.
 
#268
#268
Orange_Crush said:
Really? You're playing the program stability card?

lol
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So, you also want to compare Saban and Dooley.

Serious question, how many of you honestly think that Dooley's career will even sit in the nosebleeds of the same ballpark in which Saban is playing?
 
#269
#269
emainvol said:
So, you also want to compare Saban and Dooley.

Serious question, how many of you honestly think that Dooley's career will even sit in the nosebleeds of the same ballpark in which Saban is playing?
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Serious question: You seriously want to talk as if Saban inherited a bigger mess than CDD did?
 
#272
#272
brandonco05 said:
Sure, he didn't
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Michigan State's record in the 4 years prior to Nick Saban's arrival? 19-27 (technically a lot worse than that, but they did win 5 games that they later forfeited)

1 Bowl Game
1 Coach
NCAA Sanctions


Tennessee's record in the four years before Dooley's arrival? 31-21

3 Bowl Games
2 Coaches
1 SEC Championship game appearance

No NCAA Sanctions upon Dooley's entry
 
#273
#273
emainvol said:
Michigan State's record in the 4 years prior to Nick Saban's arrival? 19-27 (technically a lot worse than that, but they did win 5 games that they later forfeited)

1 Bowl Game
1 Coach
NCAA Sanctions


Tennessee's record in the four years before Dooley's arrival? 31-21

3 Bowl Games
2 Coaches
1 SEC Championship game appearance

No NCAA Sanctions upon Dooley's entry
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Tennessee's roster bordered on the death penalty, not to mention the differences in strength of schedule.

I am neither arguing that Saban walked into a cake walk, nor that CDD will have the career that CNS has/will. But, as is par for the course with those seeking to trash CDD, you seem to minimize the state of the program that he inherited.
 
#274
#274
Orange_Crush said:
Tennessee's roster bordered on the death penalty, not to mention the differences in strength of schedule.

I am neither arguing that Saban walked into a cake walk, nor that CDD will have the career that CNS has/will. But, as is par for the course with those seeking to trash CDD, you seem to minimize the state of the program that he inherited.
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It was ****. Saban inherited ****. Some dude said Saban's situation wasn't even close to as bad. Dude was wrong.
 
#275
#275
emainvol said:
It was ****. Saban inherited ****. Some dude said Saban's situation wasn't even close to as bad. Dude was wrong.
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Cool. Then if we can agree that CDD inherited that steaming pile, it may be a small step to an agreement that the jury's still out on him. I hope he shows up and impresses. If he doesn't this year, I say bring in the jury and the hooded ax man.

:good!:
 
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