You think hiring a proven HC doesn't matter?

#551
#551
volgrad500 said:
If memory serves me correctly (and I'm reaching the age where that's questionable) he was pretty hamstrung at USC by the scholarship restrictions and NCAA stuff. I think.
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Agreed. People need to understand USC has a very rich history of playing great college football. Their tolerance for not doing well is almost like it is on The Hill. You either win or get gone. Kiffin was a pretty arrogant guy, still is, and Hayden fired him while he himself had plans in place to leave. Helton is not long for being HC there either. They'll be looking for a new HC this year or next.
 
#554
#554
Woodlawn VOL said:
What gets me is the amount of so called fans that already dismiss Pruitt being able to turn it around. When it truth it is way to early to even suggest that. For goodness sakes he is 5 games in, it's absurd. And what is more annoying is they continue to post the same blather every day. No doubt we have a ways to go, but I don't need somebody telling me how to feel and what to expect going into a game. Instead of discussing where we need to get better and where we see signs of improvement or no improvement it is just the same ol misery we are never going to get better. If you feel that way why do you stay here, at least give Pruitt time people before you put him out to the pasture. I think we are going to see improvement as the year moves forward and I still got hope we can win 6. That's my opinion, you don't have to like it and it may or may not turn out to be right but if all you got is your a homer or you in fantasy world just move on. I am a fan and I like this staff, I think our O-coordinator could do a better job but I will wait till the year is done before I flog him right now. Even Pruitt has said we have to do better with the play calling, I am looking for continued improvement all the way around. The players need fans and support and they are going to get it from me until the season is over. GBO!!!!!!!
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It is too early, but I'd like to see some positive signs.
He was interviewed this week and his staff sounds like a bunch of "buddies."
One guy was his roommate. Another coached with him in HS. Etc.
I could be making too much out of this but it sure didn't sound good.
He should have hired a proven OC. Playcalling? Does he not review the offensive gameplan? UTs run percentage on 1st and 2nd is ridiculous considering their lack of success. Their play action success is great. There is no excuse for the wretched play calling we've seen.
Lastly, He should have retained Warren.
 
#555
#555
Roustabout said:
It is too early, but I'd like to see some positive signs.
He was interviewed this week and his staff sounds like a bunch of "buddies."
One guy was his roommate. Another coached with him in HS. Etc.
I could be making too much out of this but it sure didn't sound good.
He should have hired a proven OC. Playcalling? Does he not review the offensive gameplan? UTs run percentage on 1st and 2nd is ridiculous considering their lack of success. Their play action success is great. There is no excuse for the wretched play calling we've seen.
Lastly, He should have retained Warren.
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I honestly thought about the friends thing when he first assembled his staff. He's been around a lot of coaches and he says that he picked ones that he confidence in.
We won't know which is true until we see him willing to fire someone or see them succeed. I HOPE he was right.
 
#556
#556
jakez4ut said:
the problem with all that is that the "experience pool" is a lot more shallow today than it was 10 years ago.

head coaching turnover rates are over 50% higer today than they were back then and we're not talking about a long time ago.

and as those turnover rates increase, you're seeing the talent pool at the lower levels also shrink. used to be you could find an Urban meyer that had shown really good, steady success at programs like BG and Utah (for 5+ years) and feel pretty confident in how that coach and staff runs a program, and how they acheive success...as a matter of process, not flas in the pan success.


today, coaches at that leve are being picked off by the P5 programs at a much higher rate than they were back then. so the experience level is watered down. you get a guy like Justin Fuente at Memphis, has two good years and boom, he's gone. his replacement, another 2-3 good years ,and he's on someone's short list.

it's harder today to find those guys, and p5 programs are taking more risks than they ever had to before. and the guys that are at good p5 programs, aren't necessarily buying in to the "grass is greener over here"...everyone is making millions of dollars at that level...

it's more about fit, situation and circumstance now than it probably ever has been, and i'm betting you're gonna start seeing some p5 programs excercise more patience as a result. you can't have a carosuel of coaches every couple, three, 4 years, because you're likely replacing the last guy with a guy just like him, from an experience standoint.
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My standard would have helped our power's at be to realize that Dan Mullen would have given us the better CHANCE at turning this thing around compared to any other coach other then Jimbo. Jimbo and Dan should have been choice 1 -10. You realize you don't have the money to compete with am? You immediately turn your focus to Dan and give him an offer he can't refuse. We fired Butch early, got a head start on almost everybody, and had plenty of time to pursue the best available. Problem is, our powers at be don't seem to have a good plan at identifying who most likely is the best out there. Hence this standard based on experience.

I get what you are saying with coach turnover and everybody looking for the next big thing, but options are still available, and we chose a very inexperienced high potential coach. We are gonna have some rough growing pains with this guy most likely, compared to a guy like Mullen. Hopefully he can win enough early to stick around then come into the prime years ( the time amount of experience normally proves whether a coach is really good or not ) where all his experience he has gained comes together and he produces an sec title.

Butch hit that time in years 3 through 5 at UT iirc. If you combine all his experience as a coach and compare it to all the really good ones ( I looked at college and NFL greats ), his prime coaching years were 2-5 at UT, I think. I need to check.

Anyway, I'll post the link to thread where I dive into all the experience of the really good coaches. To me, you begin to see a pattern, a timeframe, that is pretty consistent at showing when a coach is gonna hit those proving years ( where they prove one way or the other that they are gonna be really good or not ). It also shows that we hired a very green head coach, but one with tremendous potential. Start looking for an sec title in years 6 through 8, maybe 9 with Pruitt. Not impossible he gets us one in years 3 through 5 here, but the chances are best years 6 through 8, based on all his combined experience at that time.
 
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#558
#558
MWAVolfan said:
Its interesting how Florida has had two 4 win seasons under 2 different coaches and have been able to bounce back both times pretty much immediately. also, since 1990, every UF coach except Zook (Spurrier, Meyer, Muschamp and McElwain) were able to reach double digit wins by no later than year 2 and it may be presumptuous, but it looks like Mullin may be able to pull it off in year 1 if everything keeps going like it is now. All of those coaches took over mediocre to bad Florida teams. Meanwhile UT had its first 4 win season in program history.

Florida's recruiting ranks per Rivals look like this:

2019 (so far): 25 vs UT 10
2018: 17 vs UT 20
2017: 9 vs UT 15
2016: 14 vs UT 15
2015: 23 vs UT 5
2014: 8 vs UT 5

UF isn't out recruiting UT over time and when they do its by a small amount. So the idea that Florida has access to (and is actually getting) all this talent that UT somehow doesnt have access to is balony.

Since 1990, UF has had 6 coaches and UT has had 6 coaches.
Since 2000, UF has had 6 coaches and UT has had 5 coaches.
Since 2010, UF has had 4 coaches and UT has had 3 coaches.
In the last 10 seasons both teams have had 4 coaches and...
UF has had only 1 coach for more than 3 complete seasons since Spurrier left.

So the idea that UT is hampered more than other schools because of coaching instability and turnover is also balony.

Is it money?
Well, Mullen makes a little over 4 mil. McElwain made pretty much the same. Muschamp barely made it to 3 mill.
Comparitively, Pruitt is making just under 4 mil. Lyle made just over 4 mil . Dooley is the lone standout. He was paid more to leave UT that was paid to coach there..lol But we also found Dooley hanging around the dumpster behind Ferris hall and gave him the head coaching job after Lane bolted.

Bottom line though is that the money each school commits to coaching is not out of sync with one another.

So, if it isn't recruits, it isnt coaching turnover and it isnt moeny, what then is it? And why do people make these excuses for UT that they've been put into this hisorically unprecidented position that they cant possibly overcome quickly with the right guy at the helm? Why is it unrealistic to expect a good coach can turn things around pretty much immediately? Florida has had no magic bullet. No secret to success that is somehow unattainable at any other school. As far as I can see, they just have the expectation to win and win now (both the fan base and the Administration).
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Mullen makes 6 million which is why I wanted him to lay an egg this year. They cannot fire him as they did with McElwein
 
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