Yeah, I'm mad at Kiffin, but this is Hamilton's fault

[Wii60]

It is his job to know. He's not some fan. He's the AD.

When your hire walks on you like that, and at the same time attempts to wreak havoc on your program in such a way as to disable it for at least the next 2-3 years, then the responsibility for that failure rests with you.

Ask yourself this: do you think Dickey would've hired Kiffin? Or would he have went looking elsewhere?

I don't think Kiffin makes Dickey's list at all, for all the reasons we've seen over the last several hours.

Gotta love the irony of how Doug Dickey wouldn't have done this...

 

[Herman Hickman]

Gotta love the irony of how Doug Dickey wouldn't have done this...

No way a guy with the maturity of an infant gets the Tennessee head coaching job under either Woodruff or Dickey.

We learned the lesson the hard way with Bill Battle. Now we're getting the same deal--only with worse consequences.

EDIT: My bad. Woodruff did hire Battle. But at least he learned his lesson.

 

[Wii60]

No way a guy with the maturity of an infant gets the Tennessee head coaching job under either Woodruff or Dickey.

We learned the lesson the hard way with Bill Battle. Now we're getting the same deal--only with worse consequences.

Not going to be a jerk and rub it in, but Doug Dickey was the one who left us for Florida.

 

[billbattle]

Admittedly, I was a Hamilton supporter. I forgave him for the Fulmer contract fiasco, but this current situation has sealed the deal for me. A lousy 800 grand buyout clause, knowing full well that an early departure would virtually ruin this program. The contract should have been loaded on the front end, with a low buyout after 4 or 5 years. I'm not optimistic at all of getting a high profile coach in here. USC had to settle for Kiffen (name misspelled purposely) after all, just like we did last year.

 

[BurnieVeazey]

Admittedly, I was a Hamilton supporter. I forgave him for the Fulmer contract fiasco, but this current situation has sealed the deal for me. A lousy 800 grand buyout clause, knowing full well that an early departure would virtually ruin this program. The contract should have been loaded on the front end, with a low buyout after 4 or 5 years. I'm not optimistic at all of getting a high profile coach in here. USC had to settle for Kiffen (name misspelled purposely) after all, just like we did last year.

The low barrier for departure is the reason Hamilton has to go if the new hire doesnt bring this recruiting class together.
After talking to my friend in the Michigan AD department, compare Rich Rod's contract:

There is a $7 million buyout to Michigan, a real impediment to leaving.

I always thought Hamilton was a capable businessman, but obviously he isnt up to the task. $6 mill to Fulmer, inability to get coaches to sign actual contracts, and now this? And while we're at it, lets fire UT's legal staff as well.

 

[allvol]

I blame the current mess on Fulmer. Had he done a better job with the program, the Vols would not be in this mess today and he would still be coach. However, losing records will get you fired at UT.

 

[Cartervol]

The low barrier for departure is the reason Hamilton has to go if the new hire doesnt bring this recruiting class together.
After talking to my friend in the Michigan AD department, compare Rich Rod's contract:

There is a $7 million buyout to Michigan, a real impediment to leaving.

I always thought Hamilton was a capable businessman, but obviously he isnt up to the task. $6 mill to Fulmer, inability to get coaches to sign actual contracts, and now this? And while we're at it, lets fire UT's legal staff as well.

They've all let the Vol Nation down. They've done a piss poor job, clean house, clean slate and start all over, minus Hamilton.

 

[ksushalovesthevols]

Kiffin is able to get out of his contract 3 weeks before signing day? Really? 800k buyout? Gee, that's a lot for USC to pay.

That contract was way too soft. If he doesn't get a AAA hire in a day or two he needs to be run out of town.

More proof that they need to hire me. I'd never let this happen.

 

[TNHopeful505]

I honestly can't blame Mike Hamilton. Should he have given Lane a higher buy out? Yes. BUT. USC was the ONLY job outside of the pros that Lane would have taken. Had Pete Carroll not gone pro, Lane would still be here. He was not looking for jobs, but his dream job came open, and he took it. He may never get that opportunity again. So in some ways I don't blame him.

Mike Hamilton had no clue he would do that. He had no clue that USC would be after him, there were no reports that said LK was even in the running. So honestly, giving Kiffin a higher buyout wouldn't have stopped him from going to his dream job.

Mike has made a great hire in Tennessee basketball by hiring Bruce Pearl. He has done wonders for our program, getting us back to being a National Title/Final Four contender, even when the circumstances aren't great. Are we frustrated with him sometimes? Yes. But we expect perfection here at UT, which is just unrealistic when you're not a perrenial national power.

We wondered about the Lane Kiffin hire last year, and we questioned his judgement there as well. Why was he hiring this 33 year old who just got kicked out of the NFL? Yet, for the year Lane was here, he did these things:

1. Brought excitement to the program for the first time since the late 90's
2. Brought in a Top 10 recruiting class that will help us in the next 3 years.
3. Improved us to a winning record
4. Got us into a bowl game with the same players that failed to do so the previous year.
5. Will probably get several players into the NFL draft that otherwise may not have gone.
6. Got UT mentioned in the top 5 of almost every big name college recruit.
7. Improved our stats in almost every category.
8. Created a system that gave freshmen the chance to play early, and increased competition.

I mean, is Lane scum? I'm actually more angry at Orgeron for trying to steal our recruits and mess up their life right now. Lane did what was his goal, to get back to USC as Head Coach. Was it what we wanted? No. But it was eventually gonna happen, I just hate that it happened this year.

But no matter what happened, I do not see this being Mike Hamilton's fault. I feel like the next coach, no matter who it is, will have a huge buyout that will be an intimidating factor to any team looking to steal our coach. Mike Hamilton has made good hires, and I trust him to make the right one this time. Burn me at the stake if you will, but I simply cannot blame MH.

 

[posivol]

You have got to be kidding.. MH's fault... How would he know that Al Davis was right and Lane would lie to his face?

could have asked posivol

 

[posivol]

Could not agree more. First, you give the guy you fire $6M to walk away, and you allow some other school to - quite literally - rape your program for the
forseeable future for a mere $800K.

Hamilton had better hit a moon shot - an absolute rocket of a hire - or he might as well announce his resigning at the presser where he names some lesser candidate as the new HC. Oh yeah, and he better get it done within the next 5-7 days.

Hamilton is going to ride this, "I was blind-sided" angle for as long as he can, but he'd be foolish to think that this alone would save him.

+1

 

[ksushalovesthevols]

I honestly can't blame Mike Hamilton. Should he have given Lane a higher buy out? Yes. BUT. USC was the ONLY job outside of the pros that Lane would have taken. Had Pete Carroll not gone pro, Lane would still be here. He was not looking for jobs, but his dream job came open, and he took it. He may never get that opportunity again. So in some ways I don't blame him.

Mike Hamilton had no clue he would do that. He had no clue that USC would be after him, there were no reports that said LK was even in the running. So honestly, giving Kiffin a higher buyout wouldn't have stopped him from going to his dream job.

Mike has made a great hire in Tennessee basketball by hiring Bruce Pearl. He has done wonders for our program, getting us back to being a National Title/Final Four contender, even when the circumstances aren't great. Are we frustrated with him sometimes? Yes. But we expect perfection here at UT, which is just unrealistic when you're not a perrenial national power.

We wondered about the Lane Kiffin hire last year, and we questioned his judgement there as well. Why was he hiring this 33 year old who just got kicked out of the NFL? Yet, for the year Lane was here, he did these things:

1. Brought excitement to the program for the first time since the late 90's
2. Brought in a Top 10 recruiting class that will help us in the next 3 years.
3. Improved us to a winning record
4. Got us into a bowl game with the same players that failed to do so the previous year.
5. Will probably get several players into the NFL draft that otherwise may not have gone.
6. Got UT mentioned in the top 5 of almost every big name college recruit.
7. Improved our stats in almost every category.
8. Created a system that gave freshmen the chance to play early, and increased competition.

I mean, is Lane scum? I'm actually more angry at Orgeron for trying to steal our recruits and mess up their life right now. Lane did what was his goal, to get back to USC as Head Coach. Was it what we wanted? No. But it was eventually gonna happen, I just hate that it happened this year.

But no matter what happened, I do not see this being Mike Hamilton's fault. I feel like the next coach, no matter who it is, will have a huge buyout that will be an intimidating factor to any team looking to steal our coach. Mike Hamilton has made good hires, and I trust him to make the right one this time. Burn me at the stake if you will, but I simply cannot blame MH.

Complete conjecture on your part. Kiffin is arrogant and opportunistic. There's absolutely no reason to believe that he wouldn't have walked to ANY job that offered him more limelight (based on the current rankings and reputations and such) than UT.

 

[The Paterfamilias]

Could not agree more. First, you give the guy you fire $6M to walk away, and you allow some other school to - quite literally - rape your program for the
forseeable future for a mere $800K.

Hamilton had better hit a moon shot - an absolute rocket of a hire - or he might as well announce his resigning at the presser where he names some lesser candidate as the new HC. Oh yeah, and he better get it done within the next 5-7 days.

Hamilton is going to ride this, "I was blind-sided" angle for as long as he can, but he'd be foolish to think that this alone would save him.

You should be thanking Hamilton. Kiffin has proven nothing as a head football coach and was largely style over substance. As Mark Schlabach wrote for ESPN:

Losing Kiffin to USC might sting the Volunteers for a few days, they'll be much better off in the long run. Now they can hire a coach who can actually beat teams such as Alabama and Florida instead of only boasting about the possibility of defeating them.

Kiffin was an unproven commodity with a penchant to ruffle feathers and skirt the recruiting rulebook. I don't get all of the crying over losing a coach who has proven absolutely nothing. USC can look forward to 8-4, 9-3,10-2 seasons but Kiffin will not be able to duplicate the success that Carroll had.

 

[billbattle]

You should be thanking Hamilton. Kiffin has proven nothing as a head football coach and was largely style over substance. As Mark Schlabach wrote for ESPN:



Kiffin was an unproven commodity with a penchant to ruffle feathers and skirt the recruiting rulebook. I don't get all of the crying over losing a coach who has proven absolutely nothing. USC can look forward to 8-4, 9-3,10-2 seasons but Kiffin will not be able to duplicate the success that Carroll had.

For the first time in my long life I will pull for Notre Dame to beat the crap out of USC. My pulling for ND to beat anyone is a life-changing event.

 

[SCVoljl]

Does anyone else think the big time donors are lined up at Hamilton's office giving him money and saying, fix this NOW? This is such an embarassment to the University, and is devasting to our players and the next few years of the program. But if he could go out a throw a bunch of money at a big time person (like Bama did with Saban), we have a chance. But it's going to take some money......

 

[perico]

I honestly can't blame Mike Hamilton. Should he have given Lane a higher buy out? Yes. BUT. USC was the ONLY job outside of the pros that Lane would have taken. Had Pete Carroll not gone pro, Lane would still be here. He was not looking for jobs, but his dream job came open, and he took it. He may never get that opportunity again. So in some ways I don't blame him.

Mike Hamilton had no clue he would do that. He had no clue that USC would be after him, there were no reports that said LK was even in the running. So honestly, giving Kiffin a higher buyout wouldn't have stopped him from going to his dream job.

Mike has made a great hire in Tennessee basketball by hiring Bruce Pearl. He has done wonders for our program, getting us back to being a National Title/Final Four contender, even when the circumstances aren't great. Are we frustrated with him sometimes? Yes. But we expect perfection here at UT, which is just unrealistic when you're not a perrenial national power.

We wondered about the Lane Kiffin hire last year, and we questioned his judgement there as well. Why was he hiring this 33 year old who just got kicked out of the NFL? Yet, for the year Lane was here, he did these things:

1. Brought excitement to the program for the first time since the late 90's
2. Brought in a Top 10 recruiting class that will help us in the next 3 years.
3. Improved us to a winning record
4. Got us into a bowl game with the same players that failed to do so the previous year.
5. Will probably get several players into the NFL draft that otherwise may not have gone.
6. Got UT mentioned in the top 5 of almost every big name college recruit.
7. Improved our stats in almost every category.
8. Created a system that gave freshmen the chance to play early, and increased competition.

I mean, is Lane scum? I'm actually more angry at Orgeron for trying to steal our recruits and mess up their life right now. Lane did what was his goal, to get back to USC as Head Coach. Was it what we wanted? No. But it was eventually gonna happen, I just hate that it happened this year.

But no matter what happened, I do not see this being Mike Hamilton's fault. I feel like the next coach, no matter who it is, will have a huge buyout that will be an intimidating factor to any team looking to steal our coach. Mike Hamilton has made good hires, and I trust him to make the right one this time. Burn me at the stake if you will, but I simply cannot blame MH.

I hate quoting country music, but to quote George Strait:

"I've got some ocean front property in Arizona..."


The bottom line is that Mike Hamilton should go. I am no Fulmerite, but as impossible as it may seem, the program is now in worse shape than when Phil left it.

Mike Hamilton hired people who are now trying to convince our early enrollees not to attend class so that they can play football for USC. There had to be some serious character red flags that came up in the interview process, and Hamilton apparently completely disregarded them.

Kiffin was our coach, and I (and many of us here) supported him when the rest of the country was relentlessly bashing him.

Seriously, we ignored all the warning signs, gave Hamilton the benefit of the doubt, and stuck up for Lane when no one else would.

Kiffin always said that he wasn't concerned with making friends. I guess that included those who liked and trusted him as well as those who mocked him.



Seriously, I'm now having nightmares of Fulmer's "I love Tennessee too much" resignation speech. As much as I felt it was time for him to go, we are now twice the laughingstock of college football than we were when he was here.

Phil ain't coming back, but at least we knew that even if the opportunity arose (as unlikely as it was), he would not ditch us.

If it was not USC, it would've been someone else. If we were successful next year under Kiffin, NFL teams probably would've come calling and he'd be gone. Maybe the program would be in better shape, but we would still be nothing more than a stepping stone.

When the rest of the college world was bashing Kiffin, we had his back because of our pride in the university, and the misguided belief that bleeding orange actually meant something to outsiders.

 

[Holysmoke]

I have the worst pit in my gut today.

 

[perico]

could have asked posivol

I never bashed you, even though I didn't necessarily agree with you, but a lot of people owe you an apology.

 

[Vols420]

Mike Hamilton should diffenetly go. He is the one who brought in this ass clown and agreed to that contract.

 

[GoVolsGO1981]

I totally agree,.... Who allows a clause like that.. Thats a RED CHALLENGE THE PLAY FLAG!!! WTF??? Why would allow such a thing, with a line of candidates last year that would have jumped at the chance and now are questioning M H!!!

 

[ukvols]

In fairness to MH, nobody could have expected the USC job to suddenly pop open.

 

[Wii60]

In fairness to MH, nobody could have expected the USC job to suddenly pop open.

Expect the unexpected. You have to front load the buyout clause for this very scenario. A good AD would never be in this position.

 

[perico]

In fairness to MH, nobody could have expected the USC job to suddenly pop open.

It's Hamilton's job to avoid these type of situations.

He hired a guy who didn't think that this was the best he could do. He hired somebody who, from day 1, had his sights set on bigger and "better" things than Big Orange.

He hired someone who has assistants telling early enrolless not to attend class so that they can enroll at another school without losing eligibility.

He hired someone with questionable integrity, at best.