Why does it matter if we fire him now?

#51
#51
It really doesn't if they have their guy. I'm not convinced they do, and Butch is still here because incompetence is what they do..One thing is for sure we're going to find out one way or the other. Looks like another month of Butch ball, can't wait for the games or the infallible press conferences.
 
#52
#52
willinhf said:
Yeah. We are not going to hire a guy for a position that is already filled. If we were stupid enough to have an MOA or contract signed while Butch is still the coach, Butch would have one heck of a Labor lawsuit vs UTK.
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Wut?
Thunder Good-Oil said:
Freak trolls like a champ.
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Not trolling at all. And I'm not advocating he should coach another game. I'm just curious as to everyone's reasons for desperately wanting him out immediately versus the end of the year.


Thunder Good-Oil said:
There's nothing in Butch's contract that doesn't allow searching and hiring a replacement. The new hire can start out as a consultant.
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You mean it's not against the law to reach out to candidates to gauge their interest in the event of an opening? :)
willinhf said:
Some have fully decommitted. They are making decisions.

Also, the environment is not healthy inside the football program and the recruits will see that as well and run.

So yeah, quick action to start fixing now.
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Again, I don't see how an assistant coach makes any difference in recruiting for the next few weeks.
 
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#53
#53
JMSqb11 said:
Frankly, it matters because with Butch we aren’t getting to 6-6. With an interim we will.
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And how do you know this? Are you implying the team isn't going to play for Butch but would ball for one of the assistants? I've not seen "quit" from this team. They simply aren't very good, but I'm not seeing a lack of effort.
 
#54
#54
Freak said:
2. There's no evidence of that. He may already be fired effective at the end of the year.
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Do we really think that keeping a coach who has been fired effective at the end of the year is putting all his time into game planning for the next game? There is a reason that firings are “effective immediately” due to usual quality of work after termination.
 
#55
#55
It doesn’t probably. As long as the team is still playing hard, and I think they are, there’s no reason to fire him.

There is no disadvantage from a search standpoint since Currie can talk to agents of prospective coaches. We aren’t going to pull anybody in mid year even if they were available (Kelly, Gruden, ...)

You just can’t “hire” somebody for a position that isn’t vacant.

And we need to stop with the UF comparison. Apples and Oranges. Donkey Teeth got himself fired and UF just accepted his offer to fire him. I don’t think Butch is that stupid and frankly I’m shocked Mac IS that stupid.
 
#56
#56
Freak, what about my assertion that everyone in the AD is slightly more intelligent than a half eaten ham sandwich? I will hang up and listen.
 
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#57
#57
peyton4heisman said:
Freak, I am an emotionally beaten Vol at the moment. You might make the more logical argument, but it will never be enough to overturn the butthurt Butch has made me feel and therefore has little-to-no influence on my stance.. perhaps I'm not the best one from which to obtain a sound argument. I just want him gone and gone now because I feel like I let him walk my dog and he let it get hit by a car
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There are some really good ointments and miracle salves available.
 
#58
#58
CAVPUT said:
It doesn't. Actually better for the new guy if Butch and the staff remain engaged until we can actually hire a replacement.
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I agree, but this is also my concern. Who is Currie targeting? Has he even reached out to anyone? Most of the active coaches that wouldn't be a repeat of what we’ve had for the last 10 years and that would please the fan base really have no reason to leave their respective schools.
 
#59
#59
willinhf said:
Some have fully decommitted. They are making decisions.

Also, the environment is not healthy inside the football program and the recruits will see that as well and run.

So yeah, quick action to start fixing now.
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I would guess this is one of the reasons you're not seeing recruits visit right now.
 
#60
#60
The acceptance of failure is more embarrassing than the failure itself.
 

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#61
#61
CAVPUT said:
And how do you know this? Are you implying the team isn't going to play for Butch but would ball for one of the assistants? I've not seen "quit" from this team. They simply aren't very good, but I'm not seeing a lack of effort.
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I’ve seen this fan base quit. And quite frankly, making a change will inspire this fan base which will feed into the team.

Butch is the dark cloud hanging over the program. LSU didn’t quit on Les either last year but their players clearly looked completely different.

I find it funny the AD and Admin are worried about going bowling yet it is abundantly clear that won’t happen with Butch.

Firing him and naming an interim will inject energy into this program and fan base.
 
#63
#63
I have little clue and I doubt if most on here do.

Recruiting, this season W-L are secondary to making the right decision for the long term.
If TPB are doing due vigilance behind the scenes, which we won't know till after the fact or even then, then I'm good. If they're NOT doing their job behind the scenes then we're more fricked up than I want to imagine.
But, I'm old and have learned that mindful patience has payoffs.
 
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#65
#65
The biggest concern has been the offense and how stagnant it is. Butch has been stubborn to make any changes and his promotion of Scott has been proven to be a failure in his system. Earlier Butch decided to change his starting QB trying to get a spark @ that also failed.

Now it’s time to replace him and try to get a spark, It’s a drastic action, but one that could serve as extra motivation and get us 2-4 more wins this year. Butch has lost the fans and the longer we keep him, the more damage is done.
 
#66
#66
Freak said:
In your opinion, why is it imperative that we fire Butch immediately (during the season) as opposed to the end of the year? In other words, what does Tennessee gain in that scenario?

Let's just say I'm curious for research purposes.

Discuss.
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First year of early recruiting. Other than that nothing.
 
#67
#67
Freak said:
In your opinion, why is it imperative that we fire Butch immediately (during the season) as opposed to the end of the year? In other words, what does Tennessee gain in that scenario?

Let's just say I'm curious for research purposes.

Discuss.
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Gain my trust that they give a dang. He is not engaged and you can see it with his body language and we have engaged quite a bit. I have taught my kids to give their best effort in each and every endeavor and this guy has been giving little effort since he didn't really do his PC immediately after the Vandy game. They have made us the laughingstock of college football. The real proof will be when we see if we get a new coach eventually but to trot that idiot into Neyland with his pathetic offense after taking our money for this year smells of don't really care about you little guys. You don't know anything so sit in the little small azz seats we give you and enjoy. At Bryant Denny the other day, sitting in bleachers they cared enough to have a rail along the back of the seat so you did not need to buy a cushion and everyone could sit comfortably even thought it wasn't a stadium seat. They did not send our stuff as donors to us like they normally did. I know most of it is BS stuff but it really screams we don't give a dang about you idiot fans. I am about out of the donor crap and will just buy online once or twice a year when I want to go when I like the time of game ect. Having such a crappy teams gets you 12 pm games in September and they just don't care. Currie was there when they screwed Fulmer and he better get this fire then hire right or he can kiss his project goodbye and take Bev the Cincy idiot with him.
 
#68
#68
Reasons to fire Coach Jones now:
- It's obvious that Coach Jones, to some extent the staff, and to some extent the team...has checked out on this season. There are just enough players on the team that are still playing their hearts out to make us competitive with our remaining opponents, but the team is also undisciplined (see Gaulden) and poorly coached. By firing Coach Jones and naming an interim, there is a chance, however slim, that the team could rally and finish 6-6 or better. As it stands right now, the over/under for wins is 5. If you want to avoid a 4-8 season, firing Coach Jones is likely the best move.
- Gives the staff a chance to start looking for jobs now. Although they probably know they won't be back next year, by cutting the cord now it makes it easier for them to start thinking about their next job.
- Sends a message to the team that the AD won't sit back and let them founder under an inept staff. While some on the team are no doubt blindly loyal to Coach Jones, I also think the team realizes that Butch is a much better salesman than he is a coach, and by letting him go, you let the team know that you are committed to winning.
- It's the "Environmentally Responsible" thing to do. For every week that Butch remains on campus, there will be a hundred or so gallons of paint slathered on the Rock.
- John Currie needs that stupid trash can they have on the sideline, for all of the letters and emails he's been getting from fans who have seen enough.

Reasons to let Coach Jones finish out the season:
- Probably saves money on the buyout.
- Makes MIT Beaver look like a troll.
- Currie cleans up on the offshore betting website he secretly owns.
- Five posters on VN will prove to have been right, and will lord it over us for the next 10 years.
- Freak is getting rich on the average daily visits to VN, which is twice as high as it was when Grand Vol posted that video of him dancing at the Blue Oyster.
- Jon Gruden is still practicing skydiving with the Leap Frogs for his triumphant arrival in Neyland Stadium.

S'all I got. Go Vols.
 
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#69
#69
CAVPUT said:
It doesn't. Actually better for the new guy if Butch and the staff remain engaged until we can actually hire a replacement.
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I agree with this. If you can announce the replacement in the same PC as the firing, you eliminate the circus of the search process. If the fan base gets upset, that is just something you can't control. If the media doesn't like it, their job is to report not advise. But for players, it allows them to go through the transition with less distraction. Get it over quick once you make the move.
 
#70
#70
peyton4heisman said:
1.) it's a statement from our new AD that this product is not acceptable
2.) we don't fall as far behind other teams in the coaching search
3.) head start on recruiting
4.) Florida did it
5.) it would make me feel a little bit better
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Please stop mentioning Florida and saying they did it. He lied about made up death threats, totally different reason they fired him.
 
#71
#71
In the grand scheme of things, it probably doesn’t matter. But it begs the question, why do schools ever do it if it doesn’t matter?

My guess would be to avoid the venomous explosion with the fan base that we are currently seeing in Knoxville. I would say this issue has only been exacerbated in the modern era of social media.
 
#72
#72
OrangeInKy said:
I do. The interim and other staff may get to spread their wings more, also show what they can do for UT or other potential jobs. Gets the long lingering distractions out of the way and a renewed focus. Good for the players in many respects, and as many have said, would let commits and recruits know that change is on the way. So much more to lose by keeping him longer than letting him go, imo.
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I think you're saying that you believe we have a better chance to win with an assistant at the helm. I've got you down. :hi:

peyton4heisman said:
Freak, I am an emotionally beaten Vol at the moment. You might make the more logical argument, but it will never be enough to overturn the butthurt Butch has made me feel and therefore has little-to-no influence on my stance.. perhaps I'm not the best one from which to obtain a sound argument. I just want him gone and gone now because I feel like I let him walk my dog and he let it get hit by a car
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Fair enough. And a perfectly acceptable answer: it would make the fans feel better to get rid of him a few weeks early, just because. I feel the same way to some degree.

m1al said:
Honestly I believe there is no plan.

I have said and continue to believe the UT admin (AA/AD) are not serious about fielding a championship caliber program (in any sport) and NOTHING they are currently doing is remotely close to changing my mind. At this point I'm not sure firing Butch would begin to change my mind but it would be a good start.
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Fair enough. But assuming they are serious....

willinhf said:
Do we really think that keeping a coach who has been fired effective at the end of the year is putting all his time into game planning for the next game? There is a reason that firings are “effective immediately” due to usual quality of work after termination.
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I don't know if he's been fired or not, just a scenario. I don't have any reason to believe he's not working his ass off (obviously it's not helping us win, though). And I don't feel like the team has quit on him.
 
#74
#74
Freak said:
So you think it gives us a better chance to win more games down the stretch with an assistant coach at the helm?
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I do if they will give effort and as long as they are doing that then I don't care as much about the W and L's. Have to be able to game manage better than that idiot.
 
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