Why do people think firing coaches is the answer?

#126
#126
Why do people think firing coaches is the answer?

Are you referring to HEAD Coaches or Assistant Coaches? Or Both? My guess is that you were referring to Head Coaches.

Half way through the year, the one coach on our team that is most under pressure, IMO, is Offensive Coach Bajaklan. Butch keeps his job if his assistants do their jobs, and if Bajaklan doesn't start better reading defenses to accommodate our teams strengths and weaknesses, he will be the first coach to leave.

Firing coaches can be healthy but can also prolong a greater problem. I think most on VN like CBJ and want him to be around a while, so dismissing him would be wrong right now. Therefore, the (correct) sacrificial lamb could be Bajaklan. And maybe not this year, but soon if he cannot get points on the board against a very mediocre SEC East
 
#127
#127
VOLCLASSOF2014 said:
I honestly think this is one of the dumbest trends of this generation. Hire a coach, if he's not winning 8 games by year 2 then fire him or he's on the hot seat for year 3. If he's not in the SEC championship game by year 3 then fire him. Perhaps there's a bit of hyperbole there, but I don't get it. Now Dooley, you could see the obvious writing on the wall midway through year 3, maybe earlier, but as long as you're not seeing the team quitting and we're recruiting well, why would you even consider that? Yeah it may take 4 or 5 years but you'd be waiting that long or longer anyway if we fired our coach. I realize I'm probably talking to a small portion of the fan base, but still, it baffles me how anybody could be that stupid. Yeah, maybe we'll just have to suffer through this year, and wait til next year or maybe even 2016, but I don't see why people want to start all over again, and again, and again. Look at Mullen at Miss St and Spurrier at South Carolina. They got over that hump and it took longer than 2 or 3 years. Not all rebuilding jobs are the same. Unless we missed a bowl this year and next you won't hear me clamoring for Butch's head. Patience will pay off with this staff. Maybe an amendment or two needs to be made after next year, but give them a chance to get 2 or 3 classes of their guys first. GBO
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Fans like to win more than they lose.

Agree with calling for Jones to be fired. I don't expect a bowl game at this point in this season but if he can't cobble together 6 wins next year, it's time for some serious questions to be asked.
 
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#128
#128
JonGrudensAgent said:
Fans like to win more than they lose.

Agree with calling for Jones to be fired. I don't expect a bowl game at this point in this season but if he can't cobble together 6 wins next year, it's time for some serious questions to be asked.
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I know I'm expecting more than may be reasonable from UT's AD... but if they miss a bowl this year then there is no way six wins should save him next year. He SHOULD need to seriously step it up after two subpar years.
 
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#129
#129
Fijivol72 said:
Jones is a great recruiter and organizer. He has my trust but his game management and talent use is suspect. Is that youth or bad coaching? The defense has greatly improved (kudos), the offense sucks. If we are going to lose then gamble, go for it rather than play field position. This conservative mindset cost us the fl. game. Putting players in position to succeed is not this staff's strength.
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Agreed..That is Bajakians job to find mismatches, utilize our best players and make adjustments. So far in 19 games he hasn't shown any sign of being able to do that. Running a double reverse when you are already in FG is one example. On the fourth and half a yard was the worst fourth down call I have seen in a while. They need half a yard, line up in the I, don't bring in any kind of lead blocker since they were using a RB instead of a sneak then they have Scott, who is just in his second game and has had maybe 10 touches and isn't the back you want getting that tough yard. Hurd or even AJ should have been the ones at RB or really could have used a QB sneak with the way our Oline is. Definitely a head scratcher but has been like this since Bajakian has been here.
 
#130
#130
Pooods said:
Everyone knows there is a long line of top coaches wanting our team so they can res-erect the sleeping giant. I hear Jon Gruden has ties to the area!!!
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Any coach that is interested in a new team will look at the opportunity to succeed. UT got Dooley and to an extent Jones because others looked at the roster and schedule then decided it was too much of a career risk.

Worst case, Jones will leave a pretty good roster if he doesn't get it done on the field. That will help attract a great replacement... maybe someone like Briles or Stoops if he succeeds at making UK semi-relevant. Maybe a guy like Patterson will decide it is time to make a bigger splash.

People tend to think getting a new coach is all about the money being offered. It isn't. It is also about the risks. Dooley got a nice pay day that probably ended his head coaching career. Most coaches don't want their careers to end in failure... and know that long term it hurts them financially.
 
#131
#131
I think the folks the OP is referring to need to remember that after Dooley was fired, none of the "big name" coaches that were approached by UT wanted the job. And, the one that thought about taking it was nearly on the plane headed to Knoxville then turned it down in the 11th hour. Those coaches understood how decimated this program was, how difficult it is to win consistently in the SEC, and the expectations of the high-dollar donors & fan base.

That's the reality we live in at the moment. The best thing we can do (even if it's painful) is to give this coach (and whatever staff he's willing to risk his reputation with) the full four years he signed on for. That in itself will aid in the attractiveness of the job if another coaching search were to actually be necessary.
 
#132
#132
sjt18 said:
I know I'm expecting more than may be reasonable from UT's AD... but if they miss a bowl this year then there is no way six wins should save him next year. He SHOULD need to seriously step it up after two subpar years.
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I don't necessarily disagree with you on next season but a lot of variables will come into play such as injuries as a prime example. Can't say how next season plays out until next season though.

However, the key point of the your response is the UT AD.

If Hart can point to six wins, the threshold needed for a bowl game next season along with continued strong recruiting and minimal off field issues, I see no way Jones doesn't get to year 4.
 
#133
#133
VOLCLASSOF2014 said:
Just for discussion's sake I would like you to explain why you don't think we will under him. And what do you think our ceiling is?
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I don't think there's any substance behind his cliches and gimmicks. Our ceiling as a program is being in the playoff discussion on a consistent basis, winning it all every 40 years or so.
 
#134
#134
JonGrudensAgent said:
Fans like to win more than they lose.

Agree with calling for Jones to be fired. I don't expect a bowl game at this point in this season but if he can't cobble together 6 wins next year, it's time for some serious questions to be asked.
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With Jones' first recruiting class in its second year we might see SOME improvement early but the QB situation could pose difficulties. On the bright side, O Line play should be much better. On D hopefully someone will step up into AJ's leadership role.

Of course those in the fan base with low levels of intestinal fortitude will cry but those who make decisions see the futility of bailing out on Jones mid stream.
 
#136
#136
I think this thread cleared it up for those of you that say "no one" is calling for his job. If/when the Vols lose tonight, the mouth breathers will be out in full force.
 
#137
#137
Welcome to the generation of entitlement. They want it and they want it now. They deserve to have a winning team to root for as they get drunk and act like asses in the stands and on the internet forums where they are all knowing football experts.

If they don't get what they want when they want it, fire someone and start over.
 
#139
#139
MedicT said:
With Jones' first recruiting class in its second year we might see SOME improvement early but the QB situation could pose difficulties. On the bright side, O Line play should be much better. On D hopefully someone will step up into AJ's leadership role.

Of course those in the fan base with low levels of intestinal fortitude will cry but those who make decisions see the futility of bailing out on Jones mid stream.
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My two biggest concerns are the QB and the O line next year.

I am just not seeing the light at the end of the tunnel at either spot with the guys currently on the roster.

And those are two spots where experience counts so I don't expect recruiting to do much other than fortify depth there.

Long and short of it is I don't think Jones being fired is much worth discussing at this point but I also don't think he should be above criticism.

If someone wants to rake in 7 figure salaries and call their system infallible, then they should be able to handle a few tough comments on a message board when things don't go according to script with the process.
 
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#140
#140
Deputy Fife said:
We discuss what we see and offer our opinions, doesn't mean we want him fired. We realize he needs a real chance to prove us wrong.
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Your opinions suck giant goat balls and are driving away what few fans are left; write them in a letter and send them to Santa.
 
#142
#142
VOLCLASSOF2014 said:
I honestly think this is one of the dumbest trends of this generation. Hire a coach, if he's not winning 8 games by year 2 then fire him or he's on the hot seat for year 3. If he's not in the SEC championship game by year 3 then fire him. Perhaps there's a bit of hyperbole there, but I don't get it. Now Dooley, you could see the obvious writing on the wall midway through year 3, maybe earlier, but as long as you're not seeing the team quitting and we're recruiting well, why would you even consider that? Yeah it may take 4 or 5 years but you'd be waiting that long or longer anyway if we fired our coach. I realize I'm probably talking to a small portion of the fan base, but still, it baffles me how anybody could be that stupid. Yeah, maybe we'll just have to suffer through this year, and wait til next year or maybe even 2016, but I don't see why people want to start all over again, and again, and again. Look at Mullen at Miss St and Spurrier at South Carolina. They got over that hump and it took longer than 2 or 3 years. Not all rebuilding jobs are the same. Unless we missed a bowl this year and next you won't hear me clamoring for Butch's head. Patience will pay off with this staff. Maybe an amendment or two needs to be made after next year, but give them a chance to get 2 or 3 classes of their guys first. GBO
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I completely agree. I wonder how many of the people posting against Butch are actually fans of other teams. Thus far I see progress. If they are still winning only 6 or 7 by the end of the 2016 season, it may be time to consider making a change, but for now, it seems to me we are moving forward. Strong recruiting, a much better defense and special teams. The offense problems are mostly attributable to Dooley, the gift that keeps on giving (Hamilton was a "gift" too). And by the way, I am still very upset that the refs decided the Florida game, not the teams.
 
#145
#145
Here's a better question, why do you think we are the only fan base that wants coaches fired who aren't successful? Should Florida give Muschamp several more years? He had an 11-2 year after all, something that hasn't happened here in decades.

Another question, why do many on here think UT is the only major college football program that requires 10 years to rebuild? Every other program that has bounced back to success managed to accomplish it in 2-3 years - and they fired coaches along the way until they got to that timeframe of turnaround.

I do not want butch gone AT ALL but this same line of crap was used to argue for keeping Dooley around. Now he's gone and suddenly all his supporters hopped on the butch train. Interesting right? I love coach, but what I really love is UT and I honestly don't give a gdamn who the coach is so long as we win!
 
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#146
#146
JonGrudensAgent said:
My two biggest concerns are the QB and the O line next year.

I am just not seeing the light at the end of the tunnel at either spot with the guys currently on the roster.

And those are two spots where experience counts so I don't expect recruiting to do much other than fortify depth there.

Long and short of it is I don't think Jones being fired is much worth discussing at this point but I also don't think he should be above criticism.

If someone wants to rake in 7 figure salaries and call their system infallible, then they should be able to handle a few tough comments on a message board when things don't go according to script with the process.
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What exactly is the answer until the young guys get more experience and the promising new recruits get on campus? Do you think lack of talent and experience can just be schemed away by a coach? If that was realistic, no coach would put much emphasis on recruiting.

Football is not just a chess match. The pieces have to be able to perform and outperform the other coach's pieces.
 
#148
#148
VolFan4Life87 said:
Here's a better question, why do you think we are the only fan base that wants coaches fired who aren't successful? Should Florida give Muschamp several more years? He had an 11-2 year after all, something that hasn't happened here in decades.

Another question, why do many on here think UT is the only major college football program that requires 10 years to rebuild? Every other program that has bounced back to success managed to accomplish it in 2-3 years - and they fired coaches along the way until they got to that timeframe of turnaround.

I do not want butch gone AT ALL but this same line of crap was used to argue for keeping Dooley gone. Now he's gone and suddenly all his supporters hopped on the butch train. Interesting right? I love coach, but what I really love is UT and I honestly don't give a gdamn who the coach is so long as we win!
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Would you accept a coaching position if they told you you only have two years to make a championship contender out of a team that's been down for several years.
 
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#150
#150
JonGrudensAgent said:
My two biggest concerns are the QB and the O line next year.

I am just not seeing the light at the end of the tunnel at either spot with the guys currently on the roster.

And those are two spots where experience counts so I don't expect recruiting to do much other than fortify depth there.

Long and short of it is I don't think Jones being fired is much worth discussing at this point but I also don't think he should be above criticism.

If someone wants to rake in 7 figure salaries and call their system infallible, then they should be able to handle a few tough comments on a message board when things don't go according to script with the process.
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I have seen substantial improvement with Worley this year over last year, especially seeing as how he has no protection from the O-line. The same can happen with Peterman and/or Dobbs next year. I am a little more concerned with the O-line, as I think it would be good to have 1 or 2 more quality recruits, but there are a couple of guys (Blair, Moseley) who are not playing this year who may help out next year. And yes, Butch is highly paid, so he should not be immune to criticism, but the criticism is often due to unrealistic expectations, especially considering the lack of experience and depth on the team (for example, missing the 2 guys mentioned above).
 
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