Why do people think firing coaches is the answer?

#101
#101
Deputy Fife said:
I don't want him fired any time soon as it would set the program back even further and I have no trust in the administration and Hart to hire a competent replacement. We have to give him a real chance, no one is disputing that.

Having said that, I don't think we'll accomplish anything close to our ceiling as a program as long as he's our coach, hope I'm wrong.
Click to expand...

Just for discussion's sake I would like you to explain why you don't think we will under him. And what do you think our ceiling is?
 
#103
#103
VolsRule said:
dooley shouldn't have been fired???? :jawdrop:
Click to expand...

Lol re-read the OP. Not what I said. I said unless it was blatantly obvious he wasn't the guy, as in team quitting on him a la Dooley, I think it's silly to call for heads this early. Even Dooley's boys didn't entirely quit on him until probably Missouri or right after. And even Hart said himself Dooley would have gotten another year had he gone to a bowl. Now I'm glad he didn't lol, but anyone who thinks Butch is anything like Dooley has not been paying attention.
 
#104
#104
I don't see anyone calling for Butch to be fired. Butch wil get at least 4 years.


I've seen people wanting Bajakian fired, which I think should be explored.
 
#105
#105
Here's my opinion and anyone's more than welcome to disagree. As bad as things have looked, if I'm Butch I give Bajakian, Mahoney and everyone on offense another year. Here's why: This is everyone on that line's first year of starting minus Marcus Jackson who only had a handful of starts under his belt Freshman and Sophomore years. One of your best linemen to start the year was a walk-on who wasn't even projected to start. You have a Juco guy with a lot of potential but who wasn't quite ready yet in Blair. Plus you have two freshmen who are clearly not ready to play every week in the SEC. I think Thomas needs to drop 15 to 20 pounds and be able to cut that speed rush crap out. Robertson needs a little better conditioning as well to work on footwork. Both need to learn the system better. Give them all another year, adding the 4 or 5 recruits we'll have coming in, throw em in a pot, stir em up, and find out which 5 are best. I think next year we could throw something like this out there: LT: Blair/Richmond (if he comes), LG: Jackson, C: Crowder/Weisman, RG: Kerbyson/Weisman/Robertson RT: Thomas/Kerbyson/Jones. Plus a way more mobile QB in Dobbs, I think we can work with that. Will they be good? Probably not. Can they be sufficient enough to not lose us games every week? I think so.

Basically, it's just going to take getting better players and more experience in there with the O-Line. I don't know that a coach can do much else with them. Give them an offseason to clear their heads and I think they'll be alright. Bajakian... the only thing about Bajakian is this: Consistently playing to our strengths and Red Zone play calling. I think this line has him all out of sorts. Sometimes he looks brilliant, sometimes he goes full retard. My hope is another year of recruiting and experience while adding more playmakers in the backfield and playing a dual threat quarterback, which I think he desperately needs, will get him looking good again. All of our issues stem from the line though. If you can't block, it doesn't matter who your quarterback, running back, Wide Receivers or tight ends are. I think they have made Worley look bad at times (not that he's perfect), but he's shown to be good when he has time. Get that line fixed and I think we can be a ranked team at some point next year and maybe at the end of the year. I think Dobbs is our guy going forward after this year and maybe sooner if Worley can't go. I think he will rise to the challenge. Jmo
 
#106
#106
Jones is a great recruiter and organizer. He has my trust but his game management and talent use is suspect. Is that youth or bad coaching? The defense has greatly improved (kudos), the offense sucks. If we are going to lose then gamble, go for it rather than play field position. This conservative mindset cost us the fl. game. Putting players in position to succeed is not this staff's strength.
 
#107
#107
I don't want anyone fired only held accountable for the game plan,and use of talent.my loyalty is with the players and the University I care how the program looks to outsiders. Not many have witnessed winning seasons like some of us. Tennessee should always be 8-4 team at the least going forward with our recruiting budget facilities etc. A down year is 7-5
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: 1 person
#108
#108
Instant gratification, path of least resistance, one too many pop warner league concussions, low ACT scores..take your pick why people would even mention firing coaches right now.
 
#109
#109
FLVOL_79 said:
Instant gratification, path of least resistance, one too many pop warner league concussions, low ACT scores..take your pick why people would even mention firing coaches right now.
Click to expand...
I guess most presume because we complain about what we see rather than brag about where we are headed some think we want to fire the staff. I do think we could have upgraded the offensive staff by keeping coach Pittman.but I would much rather see this staff get it rolling rather than be fired.
 
  • Like
Reactions: 2 people
#110
#110
VolFootballlover said:
I guess most presume because we complain about what we see rather than brag about where we are headed some think we want to fire the staff. I do think we could have upgraded the offensive staff by keeping coach Pittman.but I would much rather see this staff get it rolling rather than be fired.
Click to expand...

I'm with you. CBJ locks down a couple of top 10 recruiting classes and we will all look back on these last few years and laugh...hopefully.
 
#111
#111
FLVOL_79 said:
I'm with you. CBJ locks down a couple of top 10 recruiting classes and we will all look back on these last few years and laugh...hopefully.
Click to expand...
yeah I had the same love hate with Phillip. He was a true VFL and loved UT. But without coach Cut he wasn't the same. I can't wait to see these players weep with joy one of these days when we get back.
 
#113
#113
VOLCLASSOF2014 said:
I honestly think this is one of the dumbest trends of this generation. Hire a coach, if he's not winning 8 games by year 2 then fire him or he's on the hot seat for year 3. If he's not in the SEC championship game by year 3 then fire him. Perhaps there's a bit of hyperbole there, but I don't get it. Now Dooley, you could see the obvious writing on the wall midway through year 3, maybe earlier, but as long as you're not seeing the team quitting and we're recruiting well, why would you even consider that? Yeah it may take 4 or 5 years but you'd be waiting that long or longer anyway if we fired our coach. I realize I'm probably talking to a small portion of the fan base, but still, it baffles me how anybody could be that stupid. Yeah, maybe we'll just have to suffer through this year, and wait til next year or maybe even 2016, but I don't see why people want to start all over again, and again, and again. Look at Mullen at Miss St and Spurrier at South Carolina. They got over that hump and it took longer than 2 or 3 years. Not all rebuilding jobs are the same. Unless we missed a bowl this year and next you won't hear me clamoring for Butch's head. Patience will pay off with this staff. Maybe an amendment or two needs to be made after next year, but give them a chance to get 2 or 3 classes of their guys first. GBO
Click to expand...
You could see the writing on the wall when Dooley couldn't get his team ready for a 2-9 Kentucky team with bowl eligibility on the line.
 
#114
#114
VolFootballlover said:
I guess most presume because we complain about what we see rather than brag about where we are headed some think we want to fire the staff. I do think we could have upgraded the offensive staff by keeping coach Pittman.but I would much rather see this staff get it rolling rather than be fired.
Click to expand...

Thank you. I'm tired of hiring coaches too. I want this staff to figure it out but I can't keep seeing regression. That's a huge red flag for me and I won't ignore it like I did with the last guy.
 
#115
#115
DD4ME said:
Worst case we only win 4 this year is everyone still felling like just time is needed?
Click to expand...

That's not the worst case. Our offense could absolutely lay an egg against Vandy, whose defense isn't bad enough to say that won't happen for sure.
 
#117
#117
ptclaus98 said:
That's not the worst case. Our offense could absolutely lay an egg against Vandy, whose defense isn't bad enough to say that won't happen for sure.
Click to expand...

I wasn't going to even name the nuclear option. That scenario is the only one where I feel pretty certain some coach on staff gets the boot.
 
#118
#118
I expected to lose

I did not expect to be unable to score touchdowns

The 2014 vols stand a real chance of going 13 quarters of conference play without reaching the end zone
 
  • Like
Reactions: 1 person
#120
#120
VOLCLASSOF2014 said:
I honestly think this is one of the dumbest trends of this generation. Hire a coach, if he's not winning 8 games by year 2 then fire him or he's on the hot seat for year 3. If he's not in the SEC championship game by year 3 then fire him. Perhaps there's a bit of hyperbole there, but I don't get it. Now Dooley, you could see the obvious writing on the wall midway through year 3, maybe earlier, but as long as you're not seeing the team quitting and we're recruiting well, why would you even consider that? Yeah it may take 4 or 5 years but you'd be waiting that long or longer anyway if we fired our coach. I realize I'm probably talking to a small portion of the fan base, but still, it baffles me how anybody could be that stupid. Yeah, maybe we'll just have to suffer through this year, and wait til next year or maybe even 2016, but I don't see why people want to start all over again, and again, and again. Look at Mullen at Miss St and Spurrier at South Carolina. They got over that hump and it took longer than 2 or 3 years. Not all rebuilding jobs are the same. Unless we missed a bowl this year and next you won't hear me clamoring for Butch's head. Patience will pay off with this staff. Maybe an amendment or two needs to be made after next year, but give them a chance to get 2 or 3 classes of their guys first. GBO
Click to expand...

There are tons of reasons why this happens more today. You need only look at Johnny Majors tenure in Knoxville. He started in 1977 and did not get his first SEC title until 1985. His career was a rollercoaster for fans. One season good, the next season a disappointment.

But, at no time in his tenure was there ever a consideration to fire Majors. Was this because of his family name? Perhaps it was. I don't think it got serious until it became obvious that Phillip Fulmer could lead and be successful with a team at a greater level than Majors.

As to why things have changed, i think it is all related to the access of the internet. Prior to the internet, the only time you ever heard opponent discussion was on the news in snippets and in the newspaper. Today, message boards provide a place where fans gather to blast each other, coaches, players. Nobody likes hearing people talk badly about your team on a daily or hourly basis. It puts alot more pressure on coaches to succeed quickly.

I think, as a fanbase, we have to be more knowledgable of the situation and less reactive to what other fans say.
 
  • Like
Reactions: 1 person
#121
#121
Everyone knows there is a long line of top coaches wanting our team so they can res-erect the sleeping giant. I hear Jon Gruden has ties to the area!!!
 
#122
#122
VOLCLASSOF2014 said:
I honestly think this is one of the dumbest trends of this generation. Hire a coach, if he's not winning 8 games by year 2 then fire him or he's on the hot seat for year 3. If he's not in the SEC championship game by year 3 then fire him. Perhaps there's a bit of hyperbole there, but I don't get it. Now Dooley, you could see the obvious writing on the wall midway through year 3, maybe earlier, but as long as you're not seeing the team quitting and we're recruiting well, why would you even consider that? Yeah it may take 4 or 5 years but you'd be waiting that long or longer anyway if we fired our coach. I realize I'm probably talking to a small portion of the fan base, but still, it baffles me how anybody could be that stupid. Yeah, maybe we'll just have to suffer through this year, and wait til next year or maybe even 2016, but I don't see why people want to start all over again, and again, and again. Look at Mullen at Miss St and Spurrier at South Carolina. They got over that hump and it took longer than 2 or 3 years. Not all rebuilding jobs are the same. Unless we missed a bowl this year and next you won't hear me clamoring for Butch's head. Patience will pay off with this staff. Maybe an amendment or two needs to be made after next year, but give them a chance to get 2 or 3 classes of their guys first. GBO
Click to expand...


The answer is we like all other major universities have a number of fans that are either drunks or a little on the slow side. Changing the coaching staff is the last thing our program needs.
 
#123
#123
Life lessons:

You have to be smarter then an inanimate object.

Don’t apply logic where logic doesn’t apply.

You can’t argue with stupid.
 
#124
#124
It worked for Bama, Ole Miss, and Auburn. This is not Mississippi State where we let somebody float for 5 or 6 years to slowly build up a roster then start all over the year after that group leaves.
 
#125
#125
VOLCLASSOF2014 said:
I honestly think this is one of the dumbest trends of this generation. Hire a coach, if he's not winning 8 games by year 2 then fire him or he's on the hot seat for year 3.
Click to expand...
You'd be right.... if there were a bunch of programs out there letting coaches post 2 or 3 losing seasons before reaching that magical 8 win level who then went on to long successful tenures. The trend is established because it has proven to work. Coaches who don't start winning within the first couple of years almost always- don't. So while you may think it is "dumb"... is it dumber than doing something that doesn't work just because it makes you feel better?

If he's not in the SEC championship game by year 3 then fire him. Perhaps there's a bit of hyperbole there, but I don't get it.
Click to expand...
If Jones had gotten it done vs Vandy last year or either UGA or UF this year... he would have bought himself A LOT of slack. He didn't.

So what is YOUR standard for progress? You're OK with another losing season this year, right? Maybe six next year and again no significant wins? What do you expect from UT's HC?

Now Dooley, you could see the obvious writing on the wall midway through year 3, maybe earlier, but as long as you're not seeing the team quitting and we're recruiting well, why would you even consider that?
Click to expand...
Why would you be more tolerant of a coach that recruited great players then couldn't win with them than one that lost games some other way? If they've recruited well through 3 years but not demonstrated the ability to coach then why not hand the team to someone who CAN coach and start winning?

Yeah it may take 4 or 5 years but you'd be waiting that long or longer anyway if we fired our coach.
Click to expand...
You mean like Ole Miss did? Or Bama? Or TAM? Or Vandy?

All of those teams hired new coaches and saw progress on the field within two years... real progress as in wins. Two of them inherited rosters that were at least as depleted as Jones.

I realize I'm probably talking to a small portion of the fan base, but still, it baffles me how anybody could be that stupid.
Click to expand...
Stupid? High expectations aren't stupid. "Hoping" that things will just work out while NOT having high expectations... now that's stupid.

Yeah, maybe we'll just have to suffer through this year, and wait til next year or maybe even 2016, but I don't see why people want to start all over again, and again, and again. Look at Mullen at Miss St and Spurrier at South Carolina. They got over that hump and it took longer than 2 or 3 years.
Click to expand...
BOTH of those coaches improved the teams' win total in THEIR FIRST YEAR over the year before their arrival. In the 3 years prior to Spurrier's arrival at USCe they were 16-19. In his first 3 seasons they were 21-16. In his first year he broke streaks of futility vs UT and UF. Prior to his arrival, USCe had not beaten UT since 92... or UF ever as best I can tell.

Mullen went 5-7 in his first year vs 4-8 the year before. In year two he won 9 games. In the 3 years before his arrival, MSU was 15-22. His first 3 years- 21-17.

And of course there's a reason you didn't mention Ole Miss... they pretty much disprove your whole premise that a program cannot be turned around in 3 years.

Not all rebuilding jobs are the same.
Click to expand...
Nope. They're not. But they all have one thing in common- on the field progress as measured in WINS.

Unless we missed a bowl this year and next you won't hear me clamoring for Butch's head. Patience will pay off with this staff. Maybe an amendment or two needs to be made after next year, but give them a chance to get 2 or 3 classes of their guys first. GBO
Click to expand...
What then? They get 2 or 3 classes of "their guys" before we expect what? If you are talking about winning the East or seriously competing for it... then OK. If you are talking about getting to that 8 win plateau... sorry but no. They've proven they can recruit. In my mind they've proven at least on the defensive side of the ball that they can develop players. They still have to prove that they can C-O-A-C-H when it counts- game day.
 
New posts
You must log in or register to reply here.
Advertisement



Back
Top