Who will be the qb this year?

butchna

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This staff is going to have to show that they can develop an SEC-level QB. You can recruit all the high school talent that you can get, but if you can't take that talent from the high school level to the DI level, then it's all for nothing.
They’ve been here two seasons. 😏
 
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sjt18

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Even in that USCe game they had a chance to win that was dropped by Brandon Johnson (tough catch, tough throw, bad play call). You keep blaming him, but that offensive line was maybe the worst in UT history.
Sims started for UT a few years ago. Like JG he could throw and did OK when he had all day to throw. But that OL was at least as bad or worse than any JG has played behind. He was sacked and hurried often. Bray entered half way through the season. He showed he could make a quick read and get the ball off. Suddenly D's couldn't commit to pressure like they did before. He burned them too often. Suddenly... that "terrible" OL didn't look so bad any more.

He hasn't been the only problem. He's been the "key" problem. If he had played better then other things would have looked and perhaps become better. Just the ability to make quick decisions and deliver on quick throws... changes the whole dynamic of UT's O over the last 3 years. That one ability opens up run lanes. It makes safeties hesitate before run filling.

There is no better example of his inability to anticipate throws than the IU game. Go back and watch it again. Even the announcer who was teed up to praise JG talked about him being late and having to "see" a play before throwing rather than anticipating.

It isn't personal. I'm not anti-JG. Why would any Vol fan want a good kid to fail when it would be better for the Vols if he didn't? He hasn't been the only problem. But most of the other problems have been what you would expect... an inexperienced OT misses a block... a Fr LB gets sucked up leaving a run lane... a young, undeveloped WR can't get off coverage. Those problems and many more have hurt UT over the past 3 years. But those players were about where you would expect development wise... and were sometimes replaced when they didn't improve. There has been no one to replace JG and he has lagged in development.

There could be a lot of reasons for his slow development. But to me it appears to be an innate inability to "think fast" and to anticipate.... abstract thinking.

He didn't help them by holding it too long, but he consistently didn't have any time to throw. You keep claiming people are saying he had great stats or something, and you are just looking silly because no one is saying that.
Are you kidding? You've cited "stats"... but you are minor leagues. Pulaski just recently said that sports are all about stats.... in the context of claiming JG has been a good QB.

Me and several others are just pointing out he had better stats than anyone else on his team's including Dormady, Chryst, Maurer, and Shrout. You brought up Tee Martin, but you have to see that JG hasn't been surrounded by the talent that Tee was on both sides of the ball. Plus, Tee wasn't a fantastic QB, but he was very clutch, which certainly matters.
So would UT have won more games in 2017 had JG thrown 30 more balls away lowering his completion % to 51% rather than taking 30 sacks? Would UT have been a better team had he attempted and missed more downfield throws after making a good read rather than being baited into checking down for 5 yard gains on 3rd and 9?

You mentioned JG hasn't lived up to the standard for a UT QB, but who else has while he's been here (other than Dobbs, but JG didn't even play that year) ?
No one. Folks who get triggered by the JG criticism are seldom able to see anything else. I've criticized Maurer. I said Chryst wasn't the answer BEFORE fall camp that year after watching some of his old Stanford games. I have pretty consistently said that UT needs better QB play than they've gotten from anyone in the last 3 years if they're going to win.

However, the best half of QB play UT has had in those 3 years was Maurer vs UGA. Now he was done once UGA regrouped and adjusted. He just wasn't prepared in a way that let UT adjust too. But he threw the ball well and moved the O. His ability not only to hit quick throws and lead guys into catches put UGA on their heels.

I'm not saying he's the answer or will ever play another down for UT. But he showed abilities in that one half that are missing from JG's game... and would make him a complete QB if he mastered them.

Our QB situation has been a mess for several years, but he's the only one that's put up even mediocre stats. Doesn't make him good, but it does make him the "best" we have to offer. Maybe one of the others this year can change that, but he's our starting QB until otherwise noted.
Again, stats without context do not prove one guy is better than another. There are incompletions that have more value than a completion because they force a DC's hand. It is always better to throw a ball away than take a sack.

The one thing JG was clearly better at last fall was management of the run game. I criticized him between the 2018 and 2019 seasons for failing to do it well. He didn't do it well to start last season but that was a CLEAR strength by the end of the year. It was obvious even before the coaches mentioned it.

I cannot say who the "best" is. I can only observe. It appeared that before Maurer's injury the coaches were ready to ride with him... mistakes and all. If he could catch up with JG in management of the O... he offers some things throwing the ball that JG doesn't. He throws very well on the run and off platform. He has good instincts and can improvise when things break down. JG has never done that well.

Shrout's main advantage is something Pruitt mentioned two years ago... he anticipates throws well. You can watch two plays from the USCe game last fall that illustrate this. He and JG threw the exact same deep route to MC. JG was late (as he usually is on throws over 20 yds). MC made the catch but it was contested and he was tackled immediately. Shrout threw the same route later in the game on time and on target... MC walked it in for a TD. Pruitt mentioned that as a strength... unsolicited before Shrout had any kind of grasp on the playbook.
 
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rdk4121

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Sims started for UT a few years ago. Like JG he could throw and did OK when he had all day to throw. But that OL was at least as bad or worse than any JG has played behind. He was sacked and hurried often. Bray entered half way through the season. He showed he could make a quick read and get the ball off. Suddenly D's couldn't commit to pressure like they did before. He burned them too often. Suddenly... that "terrible" OL didn't look so bad any more.

He hasn't been the only problem. He's been the "key" problem. If he had played better then other things would have looked and perhaps become better. Just the ability to make quick decisions and deliver on quick throws... changes the whole dynamic of UT's O over the last 3 years. That one ability opens up run lanes. It makes safeties hesitate before run filling.

There is no better example of his inability to anticipate throws than the IU game. Go back and watch it again. Even the announcer who was teed up to praise JG talked about him being late and having to "see" a play before throwing rather than anticipating.

It isn't personal. I'm not anti-JG. Why would any Vol fan want a good kid to fail when it would be better for the Vols if he didn't? He hasn't been the only problem. But most of the other problems have been what you would expect... an inexperienced OT misses a block... a Fr LB gets sucked up leaving a run lane... a young, undeveloped WR can't get off coverage. Those problems and many more have hurt UT over the past 3 years. But those players were about where you would expect development wise... and were sometimes replaced when they didn't improve. There has been no one to replace JG and he has lagged in development.

There could be a lot of reasons for his slow development. But to me it appears to be an innate inability to "think fast" and to anticipate.... abstract thinking.

Are you kidding? You've cited "stats"... but you are minor leagues. Pulaski just recently said that sports are all about stats.... in the context of claiming JG has been a good QB.

So would UT have won more games in 2017 had JG thrown 30 more balls away lowering his completion % to 51% rather than taking 30 sacks? Would UT have been a better team had he attempted and missed more downfield throws after making a good read rather than being baited into checking down for 5 yard gains on 3rd and 9?

No one. Folks who get triggered by the JG criticism are seldom able to see anything else. I've criticized Maurer. I said Chryst wasn't the answer BEFORE fall camp that year after watching some of his old Stanford games. I have pretty consistently said that UT needs better QB play than they've gotten from anyone in the last 3 years if they're going to win.

However, the best half of QB play UT has had in those 3 years was Maurer vs UGA. Now he was done once UGA regrouped and adjusted. He just wasn't prepared in a way that let UT adjust too. But he threw the ball well and moved the O. His ability not only to hit quick throws and lead guys into catches put UGA on their heels.

I'm not saying he's the answer or will ever play another down for UT. But he showed abilities in that one half that are missing from JG's game... and would make him a complete QB if he mastered them.


Again, stats without context do not prove one guy is better than another. There are incompletions that have more value than a completion because they force a DC's hand. It is always better to throw a ball away than take a sack.

The one thing JG was clearly better at last fall was management of the run game. I criticized him between the 2018 and 2019 seasons for failing to do it well. He didn't do it well to start last season but that was a CLEAR strength by the end of the year. It was obvious even before the coaches mentioned it.

I cannot say who the "best" is. I can only observe. It appeared that before Maurer's injury the coaches were ready to ride with him... mistakes and all. If he could catch up with JG in management of the O... he offers some things throwing the ball that JG doesn't. He throws very well on the run and off platform. He has good instincts and can improvise when things break down. JG has never done that well.

Shrout's main advantage is something Pruitt mentioned two years ago... he anticipates throws well. You can watch two plays from the USCe game last fall that illustrate this. He and JG threw the exact same deep route to MC. JG was late (as he usually is on throws over 20 yds). MC made the catch but it was contested and he was tackled immediately. Shrout threw the same route later in the game on time and on target... MC walked it in for a TD. Pruitt mentioned that as a strength... unsolicited before Shrout had any kind of grasp on the playbook.
JG was pretty bad in the IU game no doubt, but as you alluded to with him managing the run game, I thought that's what really helped us win that game down the stretch. He managed the game well in the 4Q. Shrout gets the ball out quick, regardless of the outcome, sometimes he anticipates people that aren't even there. That timing will come with experience, which is why I think he's doing much better in practice this year. I honestly thought Maurer looked the worst of the 3, mostly because he was so inexperienced. He threw maybe the best pass I've ever seen at UT to Callaway, but outside of that, he was more down than up imo. He had his moments, but his overall feel for the game, and being prone to mistakes, not to mention the injuries, left plenty to be desired. He's got plenty of time and a lot of talent, but like you mentioned earlier, he probably shouldn't have been playing anyway.

Trey Smith, Pruitt, and Chaney have all mentioned how much better he's looked since he's been in the second year of an offense for the first time in 5 years. I think he'll actually do better this year, and worst case for him he can manage the game and allow the offensive line to pave the way for our running game and make smart decisions in the passing game. Our defense should be really good, so the offense just needs to be smart and not put the defense at a disadvantage.
 
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lexkyvol

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If want a critical post here you go.

Maurer is not a good “screen” qb but he’s especially bad at WR screens to the flat. The reason is he tends to rush his upper body on WR screens especially to his right where he has to flip his hips and throw quickly. WR screens to his left are better only because his hips are already in line with the WR.

He’s not good when a defense gets immediate pressure from the middle because it takes away his space to step up and find a lane to throw or run. The fastest way to get him rattled is consistent middle pressure from A or B gap.
Surely this cannot be it! Good Gawd, there are much more flaws than this. Accuracy is def one of them. And now u bout to tell me about his one deep ball vs uga. one pass! i guess all those throws into double coverage were the coaches or wrs fault. the pick where palmer stumbled was overthrown. he cannot read a defense. anyone who knows qbs can tell this by watching him play. his qb coach knows this as well which is why i am gonna make this prediction: barring horrific play from both JG and Shrout, BM never sees the field again at UT!
 

sjt18

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JG was pretty bad in the IU game no doubt, but as you alluded to with him managing the run game, I thought that's what really helped us win that game down the stretch.
I think that's true. I think it helped win those games. It won't beat the likes of UF, UGA, or Bama.

I have always thought the QB race would come down to how much ground one of the other 3 could or would catch up with him in management of the O.

Shrout gets the ball out quick, regardless of the outcome, sometimes he anticipates people that aren't even there. That timing will come with experience, which is why I think he's doing much better in practice this year. I honestly thought Maurer looked the worst of the 3, mostly because he was so inexperienced. He threw maybe the best pass I've ever seen at UT to Callaway, but outside of that, he was more down than up imo. He had his moments, but his overall feel for the game, and being prone to mistakes, not to mention the injuries, left plenty to be desired. He's got plenty of time and a lot of talent, but like you mentioned earlier, he probably shouldn't have been playing anyway.
Agree with pretty much all of that. I think Maurer showed more than you in the short passing game... but not enough to argue much. If he does well here or elsewhere it will be because he's creative and throws well off platform. He's by far the best of those 3 doing that.

I could easily fall in love with Shrout's game. I like a big arm.

Trey Smith, Pruitt, and Chaney have all mentioned how much better he's looked since he's been in the second year of an offense for the first time in 5 years. I think he'll actually do better this year, and worst case for him he can manage the game and allow the offensive line to pave the way for our running game and make smart decisions in the passing game. Our defense should be really good, so the offense just needs to be smart and not put the defense at a disadvantage.
I think that might get you consistent wins again over Vandy, USCe, UK, and Mizzou... the teams UT should pretty much always beat. I don't think that formula works on teams with equal or greater talent. You have to have a QB who is a threat.... someone who can pressure an opposing D.

I've said consistently that I do not think the things that have held him back are a function of his time in a system or with an OC. It isn't accurate to say this is the first time he's been in the same O. Not saying it was a "good" O but he spent a RS year plus a year where he became the starter in Jones' system. The OC changed... the playbook, terminology, and philosophy did not.

I will be glad to be wrong. A second year with Chaney definitely can't hurt. But if you go back and watch plays like the deep throw to Callaway vs USCe followed by watching Shrout throw the same ball... it just didn't have anything to do with knowledge of the system. Shrout had no more and threw a perfect ball. Maurer threw a ball to DWA in one of his starts where he anticipated and dropped the ball right into a gap in the D. Perfect touch and timing. I simply have not seen JG do that in his time at UT. Maurer hit some slants that JG doesn't even attempt.

I want UT to win so I'd love to see JG get better. I just don't think the things that hold him back are a product of the system.

The one exception I can think of is the throw JG hit to JJ in the back of the end zone. Something that might be a "key" is that JG was under tremendous pressure. He seems to do somewhat better when he does not have time to "think".
 
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Go back and find my quotes. Once again you’re putting words in my mouth. He is completely responsible for his second int because it was a terrible decision. However the first one, no matter how those who disagree twist it, RK gave up on the route and didn’t go up and fight for that ball. Video doesn’t lie. I even provided a still shot of him watching JM pick it off with no sense of urgency, yet you guys denied it. Idk what happened, maybe RK got caught mid stride and couldn’t recoup. All I know is there was no attempt to high point that ball by the receiver and THATS what he was known for coming out of HS and if I had been his coach he would’ve gotten an earful. However, that being said I would’ve given Brian an earful as well because there was a gap of 15 yards or so that RK was running wide open between the corner and safety if he’d pulled the trigger earlier than he did. That was over a year ago and RK and Maurer both have gotten better. So no need to rehash. Just don’t put words in my mouth that are untrue because I never said he wasn’t responsible for either. I said he could’ve used some help on the first one and the 2nd was all on him.
Sorry but I am the one who argued with you about this throw. RK was running full speed away from the ball and had to completely stop and try and come back to it because it was under thrown, btw Keyton had his defender completely beat. The interception was on the QB not Ramel Keyton. Sorry.
 

norrislakevol

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I really don't know if JG having a better OL will help him or not. Some of his best throws have came when a guy was bearing down on him. No pressure means that he can hold the ball even longer. Hopefully he has learned not to do that though with a better understanding of the offense.

One thing that will never change is his inability to feel backside pressure. You either have that or you don't, and not being able to do that is a turnover waiting to happen.
 

1vol8

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Sorry but I am the one who argued with you about this throw. RK was running full speed away from the ball and had to completely stop and try and come back to it because it was under thrown, btw Keyton had his defender completely beat. The interception was on the QB not Ramel Keyton. Sorry.
No need to be sorry. We just disagree. It’s what forums are here for. If everyone agreed they wouldn’t be nearly as entertaining. But that was over a year ago and there’s no need to bring it up at this point. It wasn’t just you that argued with me. Speaking of which, does anyone know whatever happened to chargervol? Haven’t seen him in a while
 

butchna

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Sorry but I am the one who argued with you about this throw. RK was running full speed away from the ball and had to completely stop and try and come back to it because it was under thrown, btw Keyton had his defender completely beat. The interception was on the QB not Ramel Keyton. Sorry.
I liked early 1Vol8 measurables like “moxie” and visual “lack of urgency” that people “who may just not know football” can’t pick out of the average video.
 

DustyRockSolid

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I liked early 1Vol8 measurables like “moxie” and visual “lack of urgency” that people “who may just not know football” can’t pick out of the average video.
Oh yeah. Those are the attributes trained professionals are looking for. Only a few NFL qbs can compare to BM. Did your untrained uninformed eye know that?
 

LittleVol

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I've said this before, but I can't forget Peyton's first year when Qbs 1 and 2 went down with injuries and we played 4 of 'em. We played 3 last year plus wildcat.

In this year of CV19, we better have 4 or more doing all they can to stay ready.
Yep. I think you will see all 4 play. And even a Dee Beckwith or Jimmy Holiday take wildcat snaps
 

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