What will be an acceptable record in 2012

#76
#76
tvolsfan said:
Some peoples' expectations are pathetic. I understand we're not winning it all next year but some people need to raise their standards. I saw someone said 8-4 or 9-3 is acceptable in 2013. If it's 2013 and Dooley hasn't done any better than 8-4, he should be on his way out.
Click to expand...

for those of you who agree with this post will the the ones on here in 2 years saying thw same thing. Clearly you all don't understand the severity of our situation. In 2013 we STILL will not have a full roster. If we go 8-4 in 2012, or 2013, I would consider that a success. These,next 2-4 yrs. Are not a restocking, not a rework, it is a complete REBUILD. We'll first have to get a full roster, 3-5 yrs. Then overachieve with a lack of talent, theb maybe is 5-7 years we will be back in the mix. JmO
Posted via VolNation Mobile
 
#77
#77
lego126 said:
for those of you who agree with this post will the the ones on here in 2 years saying thw same thing. Clearly you all don't understand the severity of our situation. In 2013 we STILL will not have a full roster. If we go 8-4 in 2012, or 2013, I would consider that a success. These,next 2-4 yrs. Are not a restocking, not a rework, it is a complete REBUILD. We'll first have to get a full roster, 3-5 yrs. Then overachieve with a lack of talent, theb maybe is 5-7 years we will be back in the mix. JmO
Posted via VolNation Mobile
Click to expand...

Probably one of the smartest and most realistic posts I've seen on here in a while.

It takes quite a while to rebuild. It has for just about every college football power that has needed to do it (USC, Texas, Oklahoma, Alabama; Notre Dame, Michigan, Miami, FSU, and Nebraska still aren't done with their projects). All those schools I named have better recruiting bases too, except maybe Nebraska.
 
#78
#78
If he hasn't gotten to ATL by 2013, he should be gone. 2012 should be a 9-3 type team at worst.
Posted via VolNation Mobile
 
#79
#79
lego126 said:
for those of you who agree with this post will the the ones on here in 2 years saying thw same thing. Clearly you all don't understand the severity of our situation. In 2013 we STILL will not have a full roster. If we go 8-4 in 2012, or 2013, I would consider that a success. These,next 2-4 yrs. Are not a restocking, not a rework, it is a complete REBUILD. We'll first have to get a full roster, 3-5 yrs. Then overachieve with a lack of talent, theb maybe is 5-7 years we will be back in the mix. JmO
Posted via VolNation Mobile
Click to expand...

2012's roster will be plenty talented enough to go 6-2 in the league. Expecting late 90s success from this staff is simply unrealistic. Not a single thing they've done shows they can get anywhere near that type of talent in here or coach them without screwing it up.
Posted via VolNation Mobile
 
#81
#81
volwarrior33 said:
2012's roster will be plenty talented enough to go 6-2 in the league. Expecting late 90s success from this staff is simply unrealistic.
Click to expand...
No it isn't and if there are members who can't reach that level then they need to be cut loose.
Not a single thing they've done shows they can get anywhere near that type of talent in here or coach them without screwing it up.
Click to expand...

Why don't you expound on your wealth of experienced wisdom that brings you to this conclusion?

You demonstrate a nearly total lack of understanding when it comes to teams, team building, coaching, leadership, team dynamics, etc. Asking any coaching staff to show someone with your level of discernment anything is like asking a mechanic to prove that an engine rebuild is going to work before putting the pieces back together.

Do you have any knowledge of talent or recruiting beyond a book mark to Rivals? Maybe even that is better than using your own evaluation skills considering you didn't think Poole had done anything to make anyone believe he was an SEC level RB. Others who had the ability and experience to closely watch and evaluate his skills were more optimistic... you should learn to trust them.
 
Last edited:
#82
#82
LWSVOL said:
that would be unrealistic expectations for a very long time. I don't expect to see 90s success again in my lifetime.
Click to expand...

IMO If we ever respected Phillip Fulmer, we can't accept anything less than better than he did his last 7-8 years from a coach. If we do, he was fired in vain, and this has all been a colosal waste of time IMO.
 
Last edited:
#83
#83
lego126 said:
for those of you who agree with this post will the the ones on here in 2 years saying thw same thing. Clearly you all don't understand the severity of our situation. In 2013 we STILL will not have a full roster. If we go 8-4 in 2012, or 2013, I would consider that a success. These,next 2-4 yrs. Are not a restocking, not a rework, it is a complete REBUILD. We'll first have to get a full roster, 3-5 yrs. Then overachieve with a lack of talent, theb maybe is 5-7 years we will be back in the mix. JmO
Posted via VolNation Mobile
Click to expand...

The situation doesn't change my expectations as an alumnus and fan of Tennessee as a program. UT has top flight facilities and is the top 10 as far as money spent. I expect us to be ranked 4 out of 5 years, compete for the SEC East at least 3-4 times in every decade, and reach a BCS bowl twice a decade.
 
#84
#84
lego126 said:
for those of you who agree with this post will the the ones on here in 2 years saying thw same thing. Clearly you all don't understand the severity of our situation. In 2013 we STILL will not have a full roster. If we go 8-4 in 2012, or 2013, I would consider that a success. These,next 2-4 yrs. Are not a restocking, not a rework, it is a complete REBUILD. We'll first have to get a full roster, 3-5 yrs. Then overachieve with a lack of talent, theb maybe is 5-7 years we will be back in the mix. JmO
Posted via VolNation Mobile
Click to expand...

We currently have 47 players on scholarship who are Freshmen or Sophomores, signing 26 this year and 25 for 2012 thats 98 so if we lose 13 guys the next two years thats 85 in 2012, not seeing the 5 yrs to get back to a full roster. We also have a lot of freshmen with talent getting experience and that will pay off, 2012 or 2013 we will be COMPETING for the SEC east title.
 
#85
#85
Joe Vols said:
IMO If we ever respected Phillip Fulmer, we can't accept anything less than better than he did his last 7-8 years from a coach. If we do, he was fired in vain, and this has all been a colosal waste of time IMO.
Click to expand...

he got us to Atlanta 3 times, his last 8 years.. not sure he was going to get things changed or the support to even attempt so the change was for the best. My one fear through all the years was when it was time for him to go, would the replacement hire get screwed up and then would we have a succession of screwed up hires.

well, it ended up being a screw up. if this ends up being a screw up, Tennessee could be in line for a long time frame of poor football, by Tennessee standards.

As far as getting better than 3 trips to atlanta in a decade, IMO, going to be most difficult. The reason is, I could see it being hard to get coaches that will year end and year out put out the efforts required to recruit to Knoxville. Gran couldn't hack it, too hard for him. Too hard for Wilson. Both went to jobs where recruiting is not near the effort as here.

That is why having a "Tennessee" person as head coach works so well. They buy into the effort required. Unfortunately, doesn't seem to be someone out there ready for the job.

Throwing money at someone will not necessarily make them work harder either. SO going out and getting a 5 million dollar coach won't get Tennessee back getting top recruits, necessarily.

That's my take Joe. Many years around this program has framed those thoughts. doesn't mean I'm right, but that is my views.
 
#86
#86
sjt18 said:
No it isn't and if there are members who can't reach that level then they need to be cut loose.

Why don't you expound on your wealth of experienced wisdom that brings you to this conclusion?

You demonstrate a nearly total lack of understanding when it comes to teams, team building, coaching, leadership, team dynamics, etc. Asking any coaching staff to show someone with your level of discernment anything is like asking a mechanic to prove that an engine rebuild is going to work before putting the pieces back together.

Do you have any knowledge of talent or recruiting beyond a book mark to Rivals? Maybe even that is better than using your own evaluation skills considering you didn't think Poole had done anything to make anyone believe he was an SEC level RB. Others who had the ability and experience to closely watch and evaluate his skills were more optimistic... you should learn to trust them.
Click to expand...

I've been around recruiting offices at the SEC level in the past. While I haven't offered players or "scouted" the players the way a member of a recruiting service would, I was around an SEC recruiting office daily for a few years. That exposed me to the recruiting process in a different way than most here have experienced it imo. In fact I still have many friends in that role.

While Poole is certainly an average-to-above average SEC back he had done absolutely nothing to warrant moving ahead of Bryce Brown on the depth chart, like many people here suggested. The way many people talked about him, he was clearly better than Brown and on Hardesty's level. Seven games into the season, he has not proven anything close to that.
 
#87
#87
LWSVOL said:
he got us to Atlanta 3 times, his last 8 years.. not sure he was going to get things changed or the support to even attempt so the change was for the best. My one fear through all the years was when it was time for him to go, would the replacement hire get screwed up and then would we have a succession of screwed up hires.

well, it ended up being a screw up. if this ends up being a screw up, Tennessee could be in line for a long time frame of poor football, by Tennessee standards.

As far as getting better than 3 trips to atlanta in a decade, IMO, going to be most difficult. The reason is, I could see it being hard to get coaches that will year end and year out put out the efforts required to recruit to Knoxville. Gran couldn't hack it, too hard for him. Too hard for Wilson. Both went to jobs where recruiting is not near the effort as here.

That is why having a "Tennessee" person as head coach works so well. They buy into the effort required. Unfortunately, doesn't seem to be someone out there ready for the job.

Throwing money at someone will not necessarily make them work harder either. SO going out and getting a 5 million dollar coach won't get Tennessee back getting top recruits, necessarily.

That's my take Joe. Many years around this program has framed those thoughts. doesn't mean I'm right, but that is my views.
Click to expand...


Going out and spending the money, got Alabama back in the hunt, and on Top, and that's what Hambone failed to do in settling on Dooley after 3 days..
I think your post is spot on
 
#88
#88
volwarrior33 said:
I've been around recruiting offices at the SEC level in the past. While I haven't offered players or "scouted" the players the way a member of a recruiting service would, I was around an SEC recruiting office daily for a few years. That exposed me to the recruiting process in a different way than most here have experienced it imo. In fact I still have many friends in that role.

While Poole is certainly an average-to-above average SEC back he had done absolutely nothing to warrant moving ahead of Bryce Brown on the depth chart, like many people here suggested. The way many people talked about him, he was clearly better than Brown and on Hardesty's level. Seven games into the season, he has not proven anything close to that.
Click to expand...

LOL....Poole is on pace to gain over 1000 yards with the weak portion of the schedule to come. Hes averaging nearly a yard a carry more then Hardesty, similar TDs while playing behind an offensive line and qb that has not one guy who should be starting in D1. Not saying Pooles better then Hardesty but acting like theres no comparison, I dont get it. Af for Bryce Brown, lol... never saw anything from the guy aside from rivals ranking him no.1 but I guess rivals is the gospel.
 
#89
#89
PaVolsfn said:
LOL....Poole is on pace to gain over 1000 yards with the weak portion of the schedule to come. Hes averaging nearly a yard a carry more then Hardesty, similar TDs while playing behind an offensive line and qb that has not one guy who should be starting in D1. Not saying Pooles better then Hardesty but acting like theres no comparison, I dont get it. Af for Bryce Brown, lol... never saw anything from the guy aside from rivals ranking him no.1 but I guess rivals is the gospel.
Click to expand...

if Bryce had the same number of carries as Montario last year, he would have come up about 100 yards short of what Hardesty did. I'm not sure Brown was the # 1 player in country, but he is going to be a good running back if he stays healthy.

he showed that last year and the numbers support that.

I think Poole is also a really good back. Has been real impressive as you stated
 
#90
#90
LWSVOL said:
he got us to Atlanta 3 times, his last 8 years.. not sure he was going to get things changed or the support to even attempt so the change was for the best. My one fear through all the years was when it was time for him to go, would the replacement hire get screwed up and then would we have a succession of screwed up hires.

well, it ended up being a screw up. if this ends up being a screw up, Tennessee could be in line for a long time frame of poor football, by Tennessee standards.

As far as getting better than 3 trips to atlanta in a decade, IMO, going to be most difficult. The reason is, I could see it being hard to get coaches that will year end and year out put out the efforts required to recruit to Knoxville. Gran couldn't hack it, too hard for him. Too hard for Wilson. Both went to jobs where recruiting is not near the effort as here.

That is why having a "Tennessee" person as head coach works so well. They buy into the effort required. Unfortunately, doesn't seem to be someone out there ready for the job.

Throwing money at someone will not necessarily make them work harder either. SO going out and getting a 5 million dollar coach won't get Tennessee back getting top recruits, necessarily.

That's my take Joe. Many years around this program has framed those thoughts. doesn't mean I'm right, but that is my views.
Click to expand...

Tough shoes to fill IMO. That was an excellent post. I can see what you're saying and can tell you have put a lot of thought and heart into your post. I'm not sure what is good enough myself. I think, at least right now I will be happy beating Alabama, Georgia, LSU, and Florida our share of the time. After what we've been through I will also know not to take it for granted. Being born in 69, the Vols have been competative as long as I've been watching them.
 
#91
#91
volwarrior33 said:
I've been around recruiting offices at the SEC level in the past. While I haven't offered players or "scouted" the players the way a member of a recruiting service would, I was around an SEC recruiting office daily for a few years. That exposed me to the recruiting process in a different way than most here have experienced it imo. In fact I still have many friends in that role.

While Poole is certainly an average-to-above average SEC back he had done absolutely nothing to warrant moving ahead of Bryce Brown on the depth chart, like many people here suggested. The way many people talked about him, he was clearly better than Brown and on Hardesty's level. Seven games into the season, he has not proven anything close to that.
Click to expand...
That is crazy. Look at the line Poole is running behind. I know last years wasn't great, but compared to this year, they were all americans. I'll take Poole over Brown any day of the week. You put this guy on a descent offense and he would be one of the best backs in the country. Brown has not proved one thing other than he is a quitter.
 
#92
#92
ddean1357 said:
That is crazy. Look at the line Poole is running behind. I know last years wasn't great, but compared to this year, they were all americans. I'll take Poole over Brown any day of the week. You put this guy on a descent offense and he would be one of the best backs in the country. Brown has not proved one thing other than he is a quitter.
Click to expand...

There's a lot to like about Tauren Poole, and he's doing a great job this year. But he's not as talented as Brown or Hardesty.
 
#93
#93
lego126 said:
for those of you who agree with this post will the the ones on here in 2 years saying thw same thing. Clearly you all don't understand the severity of our situation. In 2013 we STILL will not have a full roster. If we go 8-4 in 2012, or 2013, I would consider that a success. These,next 2-4 yrs. Are not a restocking, not a rework, it is a complete REBUILD. We'll first have to get a full roster, 3-5 yrs. Then overachieve with a lack of talent, theb maybe is 5-7 years we will be back in the mix. JmO
Posted via VolNation Mobile
Click to expand...

Volwark said:
Probably one of the smartest and most realistic posts I've seen on here in a while.

It takes quite a while to rebuild. It has for just about every college football power that has needed to do it (USC, Texas, Oklahoma, Alabama; Notre Dame, Michigan, Miami, FSU, and Nebraska still aren't done with their projects). All those schools I named have better recruiting bases too, except maybe Nebraska.
Click to expand...
Absolutely ridiculous. We were in as bad a situation as possible 3 weeks from signing day last year and still managed to pull in a top 10 class. We have talent to build on and a lot of things going for us. We don't have depth, but it's not like we're Vanderbilt. The idea that it would take a good coach 7 years is laughable, in every way. And those schools you mentioned, USC, Oklahoma, Alabama, and Nebraska all improved immensely soon after they got the right coach. Rich Rod is getting there, and if Kelly is the right guy, ND will, too. Miami was good for many years and then kept an awful coach way to long. It didn't take Davis long to fix things there at all after probation ended. FSU being on the list is borderline insanity. This is the first year with a new coach. And Texas took a while because Mack Brown is overrated as hell. We're not in a great spot right now, but the idea that we're 7 years away is a sign that some of us have embarrassing (and not at all realistic) expectations.
 
#96
#96
PaVolsfn said:
We currently have 47 players on scholarship who are Freshmen or Sophomores, signing 26 this year and 25 for 2012 thats 98 so if we lose 13 guys the next two years thats 85 in 2012, not seeing the 5 yrs to get back to a full roster. We also have a lot of freshmen with talent getting experience and that will pay off, 2012 or 2013 we will be COMPETING for the SEC east title.
Click to expand...

i hope you're right. I said 3-5 yrs to get back to full roster, and 5-7 before the full roster can be effective.
Posted via VolNation Mobile
 
#97
#97
LWSVOL said:
he got us to Atlanta 3 times, his last 8 years.. not sure he was going to get things changed or the support to even attempt so the change was for the best. My one fear through all the years was when it was time for him to go, would the replacement hire get screwed up and then would we have a succession of screwed up hires.

well, it ended up being a screw up. if this ends up being a screw up, Tennessee could be in line for a long time frame of poor football, by Tennessee standards.

As far as getting better than 3 trips to atlanta in a decade, IMO, going to be most difficult. The reason is, I could see it being hard to get coaches that will year end and year out put out the efforts required to recruit to Knoxville. Gran couldn't hack it, too hard for him. Too hard for Wilson. Both went to jobs where recruiting is not near the effort as here.

That is why having a "Tennessee" person as head coach works so well. They buy into the effort required. Unfortunately, doesn't seem to be someone out there ready for the job.

Throwing money at someone will not necessarily make them work harder either. SO going out and getting a 5 million dollar coach won't get Tennessee back getting top recruits, necessarily.

That's my take Joe. Many years around this program has framed those thoughts. doesn't mean I'm right, but that is my views.
Click to expand...

Great, great post as always, LWS. I've come to realize how important a "Tennessee" person is for the role - exactly because the recruiting work which must be done. That is why Saban et al. will not come here for any amount of money.

Regarding Fulmer's support - was Hambone the catalyst for its erosion? After Pearl, he got delusions of grandeur didn't he?
 
#98
#98
utgibbs said:
Great, great post as always, LWS. I've come to realize how important a "Tennessee" person is for the role - exactly because the recruiting work which must be done. That is why Saban et al. will not come here for any amount of money.

Regarding Fulmer's support - was Hambone the catalyst for its erosion? After Pearl, he got delusions of grandeur didn't he?
Click to expand...
Posted via VolNation Mobile. I think you are correct about Hammy. Seems like he wanted to leave mark on the athletics program, no matter the outcome, he just wanted it to be HIS MARK.
 
Last edited:
#100
#100
I said 5 wins at best this year and i'll settle for 6 next year.

I'm not a negitive person at all. I'm just being realistic.

Of course 8 wins would gain CDD a raise i think but that's a few years down the road.
 
New posts
You must log in or register to reply here.

VN Store



Back
Top