What message does it send?

#26
#26
I don't know why some are so upset about Baggett leaving.

If you think, or know, so little of him and his career that he would quit over a 20 yr old wr, after whining to his boss and asking for help, there should be no reason for you to miss him.
Give me a break.
 
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#27
#27
pl3 said:
I don't know why some are so upset about Baggett leaving.

If you think, or know, so little of him and his career that he would quit over a 20 yr old wr, after whining to his boss and asking for help, there should be no reason for you to miss him.
Give me a break.
Click to expand...

I'm afraid a lot of folks around here aren't aquainted with reasonable thinking.
 
#28
#28
pl3 said:
I don't know why some are so upset about Baggett leaving.

If you think, or know, so little of him and his career that he would quit over a 20 yr old wr, after whining to his boss and asking for help, there should be no reason for you to miss him.
Give me a break.
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Because he's not quitting over a 20 year old.

In that scenario, he's quitting because the leadership has failed.
 
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#31
#31
Fed said:
Because he's not quitting over a 20 year old.

In that scenario, he's quitting because the leadership has failed.
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So he can't handle the kid, goes to his boss, boss sides with kid, then he quits?

Sounds like a 12 year old reaction. Baggett wouldn't have acted that way.

Now, if there are problems or riffs within the staff being on the same page, that's an entirely different issue. It's my understanding that that is the case here, and this DR stuff is being blown up because he's a magnet for this stuff, brings some of it on himself, and some fans need scapegoat/s.
 
#32
#32
volumnus said:
Both have been credible in the past.
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When ratings were good yes.....These guys are desperate.....LOL......And they are feeding on emotions and insulting a good coach CBB basically stating he can't handle a kid.....without Mom or Dad....Give me a break...

this is bogus....
 
#33
#33
This is nothing that winning some games won't cure. We didn't hear anything about this stuff after the Cincy win when we were putting up Playstation type stats.

Every coach deals with Superstars differently. Fulmer did it, especially with guys like Haynesworth. For crying out loud, Haynesworth got into a fight with Will Ofenhuesle on teh practice field, Fulmer kicked him out of practice, AH was so mad he went to the weight room, grabbed a weightlifting bar and came storming back out ready to start swinging it at Ofenheusle. Was the program in shambles then?
 
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#34
#34
BruinVol said:
What message would it send if a position coach wouldn't conform to a coordinator and wasn't dealt with?
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I believe he was dealt with... and suspect that Rogers either was or will be.

It sounds like that whole situation was dysfunctional.

But you make a good point. If CCB was uncooperative with the OC then could CDD have sided with DR because he was in the right?
 
#35
#35
FWIW, Dooley booted Janzen Jackson. He told B Brown "No thanks" when UT could have used help at RB. He benched a Fr All American.

"Discipline" has been good enough that we don't have Vols on police blotters every week like we did with Fulmer.

I suspect there's more to it than what this particular story reports.
 
#36
#36
Bigun said:
This is nothing that winning some games won't cure. We didn't hear anything about this stuff after the Cincy win when we were putting up Playstation type stats.

Every coach deals with Superstars differently. Fulmer did it, especially with guys like Haynesworth. For crying out loud, Haynesworth got into a fight with Will Ofenhuesle on teh practice field, Fulmer kicked him out of practice, AH was so mad he went to the weight room, grabbed a weightlifting bar and came storming back out ready to start swinging it at Ofenheusle. Was the program in shambles then?
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Many would argue that stuff like this is what started the deterioration of the program under Fulmer.
 
#37
#37
I have a hard time believing that a 19-20 year old kid that plays football forced a MAN that has coached for 36 years into retirement. This is stupid, bottom line. Baggett retired from football, he isn't going anywhere else. He wasn't ran off by a kid who is unruly. Baggett will be sitting on his coach at home counting his money, drinking coffee, eating popcorn and watching football. Sounds like my American dream. Congrats to him. Enjoy retirement. He has coached many and some Hall of Famers.
 
#38
#38
sjt18 said:
I believe he was dealt with... and suspect that Rogers either was or will be.

It sounds like that whole situation was dysfunctional.

But you make a good point. If CCB was uncooperative with the OC then could CDD have sided with DR because he was in the right?
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The two are separate IMO. I think CB is no longer here because of not being able to conform to JC as the primary reason. Just reading comments from certain posters gives me that impression.
Posted via VolNation Mobile
 
#39
#39
To deny there has been dissension in the coaching staff is truly delusional. The players see it and it encouraged them to act the same way. Chuck Smith was let go for it last year. CDD chose Wilcox, and rightly so. CB and CJC did not see eye to eye and CDD covered for DR. CB honorably retires. Remains to be seen if CB was right or wrong and I am sure HH plays into the problems. But there is no excuse for DR and TB's attitudes regardless of the dissension. That falls squarely at CDD's feet. He coddled JJ, he coddled these guys. Yet, strangely did not coddle Darren Myles. He would have gained more support regardless of the W/L record if he had stayed on course with the way he started after the Bar Knoxville mess. The program needed a hardazz approach after the Fulmer Cup and Liar Surfer Dude years. I am sure the UTAD thought that was what they were getting that after the interviews for the job. Wrong it appears. So when it plays out the other way, that he is just like the other wimps (Saban included) that play discipline problems and sacrifice their programs for wins - is it a big surprise to anyone that much of the fanbase gets PO'd? Really - is it a big surprise? A lot of us want it done right and not get the rep of the Bama's of the world. And more importantly, a lot of us write decent sized checks and attend the games no matter the circumstances. That is now subject to change. Book it.

How CDD responds to this crisis determines the future of the program for many years beyond today, whether he coaches beyond 2012 or not. And it is a crisis of confidence in the UTAD and the future of the program. Do not deny it. 100 years since UT had two losing seasons in a row. Losing to a badly outmanned Kentucky in the way they did by not playing the way the General stated. Disgusting. Yet there was CDD making his brags when he was hired that he would do it just like the General said it. Right. No second half offense. Never coming back from being behind. On and on.

No winning, no running the program the right way - no money. That's something they understand over there.
 
#40
#40
Everytime a coach quits or gets fired he always sucked. 3 days ago Baggett was in the top 3 position coaches on this roster. Now he's awful. Gotta love it.

WR have been the best offensive unit on the team both years, and arguably the best unit on the entire team. But Baggett is the problem?
 
#41
#41
Dooley had better get a grip on how to fix this mess. If not the board of trustees or AD after next season will get a grip on some walking papers with this staffs names all over them.
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#42
#42
DrunkJohnny said:
Everytime a coach quits or gets fired he always sucked. 3 days ago Baggett was in the top 3 position coaches on this roster. Now he's awful. Gotta love it.

WR have been the best offensive unit on the team both years, and arguably the best unit on the entire team. But Baggett is the problem?
Click to expand...

I would have said JC was the problem but it only takes the kids seeing one respected coach not buying in and the whole thing breaks down. IF CB did that then removing him could be a real positive. The team needs to see a united staff.

Its similar to 5 talented players in hoops that don't believe in each other trying to play a slightly less talented team that really believes in each other and plays as a cohesive group. As long as the talent gap isnt significant I will take the cohesive group. We will see if DD replaces CB with somebody that isn't significantly lower in coaching ability. I am sure they won't measure up but uniting the staff could be much better.
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#43
#43
DrunkJohnny said:
Everytime a coach quits or gets fired he always sucked. 3 days ago Baggett was in the top 3 position coaches on this roster. Now he's awful. Gotta love it.

WR have been the best offensive unit on the team both years, and arguably the best unit on the entire team. But Baggett is the problem?
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I have not flip flopped on this.

WR play this year was not great. After Hunter went down, there was really very little development of the young guys to step in. As a group, they blocked poorly this year.

He may be a great coach who just found himself in an untenable situation. It happens. The greatest leaders are NEVER universal to every place or situation.

Moore, Jones, and Stocker were the bulk of the receiving last year. They were not developed by CBB. Rogers and Hunter are no test for greatness. Mickey Mouse could "coach up" athletes of that caliber. The test is if you can take an Arnett, Z Rogers, or one of the other guys and see tangible improvement. There were flashes but none of the guys after DR became a dependable factor.
 
#44
#44
pl3 said:
So he can't handle the kid, goes to his boss, boss sides with kid, then he quits?

Sounds like a 12 year old reaction. Baggett wouldn't have acted that way.

Now, if there are problems or riffs within the staff being on the same page, that's an entirely different issue. It's my understanding that that is the case here, and this DR stuff is being blown up because he's a magnet for this stuff, brings some of it on himself, and some fans need scapegoat/s.
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You keep using that same old tired argument on all the threads discussing this matter. Why don't you give it a rest.
 
#45
#45
AllVolYall said:
You keep using that same old tired argument on all the threads discussing this matter. Why don't you give it a rest.
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Maybe one you boneheads will understand if its repeated enough. Sounds like you are co-dependent on the soap opera aspect. Sorry for the buzz kill.
 
#46
#46
With 11 in the NFL I'm sure Charlie had more than one WR or player speak to him with a bit of more enthusiam than was needed but I'm sure HE handled it. Only met him once but I did not get the impression that he could not take care of himself.
 
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#47
#47
My wife and teenage son occasionally argue.... Guess what... My wife isn't always right.

I always counsel my son to show the proper respect. That is a work in process and a life lesson for him. But there are times when he is simply right and she is wrong. It is a VERY difficult position to be in. You need to support the wife/coach... but what do you do when they are wrong?
 
#48
#48
sjt18 said:
I have not flip flopped on this.

WR play this year was not great. After Hunter went down, there was really very little development of the young guys to step in. As a group, they blocked poorly this year.

He may be a great coach who just found himself in an untenable situation. It happens. The greatest leaders are NEVER universal to every place or situation.

Moore, Jones, and Stocker were the bulk of the receiving last year. They were not developed by CBB. Rogers and Hunter are no test for greatness. Mickey Mouse could "coach up" athletes of that caliber. The test is if you can take an Arnett, Z Rogers, or one of the other guys and see tangible improvement. There were flashes but none of the guys after DR became a dependable factor.
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I guess Lane Kiffin should've hired Mickey Mouse. As I have stated multiple times, and you have ignored multiple times Denarious Moore doubled his production from his junior to senior year.

Can Mickey Mouse recruit those athletes? Guess we are about to find out.
 
#49
#49
sjt18 said:
My wife and teenage son occasionally argue.... Guess what... My wife isn't always right.

I always counsel my son to show the proper respect. That is a work in process and a life lesson for him. But there are times when he is simply right and she is wrong. It is a VERY difficult position to be in. You need
to support the wife/coach... but what do you do when they are wrong?
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Good point!

But as most good coaches they will not shoot themsevles in the foot until they have an answer to the issue...Look I dont think JJ thought he would be dismissed...talking about hurting...DR is a young player that will learn...I believe he is getting his ear bent by his family...cant prove it but I have saw (not heard) some before game conversations with MOMA along the sidelines..they have the same chip on their shoulder as DaRick carries...Family needs to support the coach and TEAM...but Winning does change all of these little things
 
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#50
#50
DrunkJohnny said:
I guess Lane Kiffin should've hired Mickey Mouse. As I have stated multiple times, and you have ignored multiple times Denarious Moore doubled his production from his junior to senior year.

Can Mickey Mouse recruit those athletes? Guess we are about to find out.
Click to expand...

You maybe correct, but I wonder about his production before Bray replaced Simms
 
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