What equals success in 2016? What must Butch do?

#26
#26
Roustabout said:
2016.
UT could do that this year. They will be favored on all remaining schedule. A bowl win would be 9.

Matching that next year likely means UT loses to UF and Bama again.
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I don't see any team on the schedule next year having more talent than us, that includes UF and UA. Don't see anyone on the schedule next year that we should not be favored to beat, that includes UF and UA. Those two games are at home. If we don't get it done next year then I don't know when it would happen. Most teams blow one game even if they're champion caliber so there's always that. But if we win less than 11 it's only due to being outcoached or outplayed, of UF getting lucky yet again.
 
#28
#28
I'd agree with your short list, Eddie: Win the East, Beat Florida. I would only add to that, 10+ wins (including post season).

Florida is becoming a litmus test. It is beginning to remind me of how beating Navy is the litmus test of Army head coaches. Winning seasons are nice, but without beating Navy the coach won't last too many years. Florida is starting to have that feel for our program.

Winning the East should follow beating Florida like 'God bless you' follows a sneeze. We seem to be shifting back to the days when Florida and Tennessee took turns winning the East, at least it is our fervent hope that Tennessee is almost back there.

Double digit wins are the measuring stick of absolute progress. We will hopefully end 2015 with 9 wins (including bowl). Getting to 10 in 2016 keeps the upward trajectory.

I would like to tack "defend Neyland" on to the end. That means beating Florida (already in the goals), Alabama, Mizzou and Kentucky, plus the Group of 5 and FCS cupcakes. Putting Bama in our win column would be a really nice cap to our first Atlanta season in almost a decade.

Ok, back to 2015...we still have a lotta fun football to go before spending too much time looking ahead.

Go Vols!
 
#29
#29
Aerie Vol said:
Lol. You trollin? Or just that crazy? Yeah...no moral victories....

Because there's absolutely NO difference in getting blown out every game and being on pay-per-view every week as compared to CBS games and national recognition while being in every game until the very last play.

AV
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A win is a win, no matter how many points you win by. A loss is a loss no matter how many points you lose by.

Moral victories don't win championships.
 
#30
#30
With all the talent returning as Jrs and Srs there are no excuses to not be in Atlanta next year. Anything less than 10 wins will be a failure IMO. Florida is MUST WIN, there is no excuse in the world.
 
#32
#32
IndianapolisVol said:
I'm just tired of the moral victories. To me, that's like a participation trophy. Anyone who says we should be winning 9-10 games per year is INSANE. If Butch truly wants an elite program we better be a championship contender every year. 9-10 wins every year would make bama fans sick, for example.

As of now, Butch is 15-17, same as Dooley at this point during his tenure. 1-8 vs Alabama, Florida and Georgia. And he's doing it with elite talent, which is why I worry.

He coaches too conservative, has proven that when given the opportunity to make an elite hire that he will just go off and hire another friend (DeBord) and he's doing so at the expense of the program.

Wonder what excuse he will be using next season.
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To continue with this line of BS is ridiculous.... If you can't see the difference in the program now versus Dooley's reign then perhaps you should give up football altogether and start watching My Cat From Hell or something.
 
#33
#33
Carl Pickens said:
To continue with this line of BS is ridiculous.... If you can't see the difference in the program now versus Dooley's reign then perhaps you should give up football altogether and start watching My Cat From Hell or something.
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The records are nearly identical. Losing by 30 and losing 6 are still losses. One doesn't carry greater weight than the other unless you, as a fan, invest in moral victories.

A loss is a loss, as a win is a win. Being close only counts in horseshoes and hand grenades.
 
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#34
#34
IndianapolisVol said:
A win is a win, no matter how many points you win by. A loss is a loss no matter how many points you lose by.

Moral victories don't win championships.
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127.

That's how many coaches won't win the championship this season.

Moral victories this season position you to not be one of the 127 next season. Anyone who doesn't see that is amazingly shortsighted.

BTW - "A loss is a loss" is dangerously close to Yogi territory, and while factually true, there remains a difference...

in our loss to bubba and Miami's loss to Clemson.

AV
 
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#36
#36
GahLee said:
The records are nearly identical. Losing by 30 and losing 6 are still losses. One doesn't carry greater weight than the other unless you, as a fan, invest in moral victories.

A loss is a loss, as a win is a win. Being close only counts in horseshoes and hand grenades.
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Dooley had 3 seasons (minus one game), and ended up 15-21.

After 3 seasons, Butch will end up 20-17, possibly 21-17 with a bowl win.

It happens to be very convenient for energy vampires to pick this moment, after we have just run the gauntlet of our 2015 season and before we benefit from the easier part of the schedule, to draw comparisons.

But by the end of three seasons, there will be no rational comparison between the two coaches. Not only will Butch have 5 or 6 more wins and 4 fewer losses in the same time span, the trajectory of his three seasons will be pointing steadily upward (5 wins, then 7, then 8 or 9?), while Dooley was on a slow downward spiral (6 wins, then 5, then 4...).

There is no likeness in the two periods, for rational people. Utterly different results, unless you truly believe we're going to crash in November against Kentucky, USCe, Mizzou, Vandy, and North Texas.
 
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#38
#38
We have only 4 games next year where we will be facing teams with equal or greater talent.
TAMU, Bama, UF, UGA.
Success would mean splitting those and winning all 8 others where we have better talent.
 
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#39
#39
VFL-82-JP said:
Dooley had 3 seasons (minus one game), and ended up 15-21.

After 3 seasons, Butch will end up 20-17, possibly 21-17 with a bowl win.

It happens to be very convenient for energy vampires to pick this moment, after we have just run the gauntlet of our 2015 season and before we benefit from the easier part of the schedule, to draw comparisons.

But by the end of three seasons, there will be no rational comparison between the two coaches. Not only will Butch have 5 or 6 more wins and 4 fewer losses in the same time span, the trajectory of his three seasons will be pointing steadily upward, while Dooley was on a slow downward spiral (6 wins, then 5, then 4...).

There is no comparison for rational people. Utterly different results, unless you truly believe we're going to crash in November against Kentucky, USCe, Mizzou, Vandy, and North Texas.
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You're assuming we win out, I wouldn't put a dime on that. Even if we do, there isn't a team left on our schedule that resembles an even decent football team. They're all pathetic.

So, UT now measures itself on how we beat the sad sacks of the conference and our 3 annual non-conference bums?
 
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#40
#40
I think the debate about Butch, amongst calmer heads, isnt whether things are better or not but, rather, will he get Tennessee to the mountain top (SEC title)
 
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#41
#41
99gator said:
I think the debate about Butch, amongst calmer heads, isnt whether things are better or not but, rather, will he get Tennessee to the mountain top (SEC title)
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Exactly. The fact that he's even remotely comparable to that heap of trash is damning.

The expectation level isn't be better than an all-time blunder of a hire, it's competing for and winning championships. Period.
 
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#43
#43
In 2016, Jones will have enough talent and experience to win 10 or 11 games.......I expect him to win 7 or 8.
 
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#45
#45
KBVol said:
In 2016, Jones will have enough talent and experience to win 10 or 11 games.......I expect him to win 7 or 8.
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Pretty much. But he will end on a win streak and will be able to sell that for another season. Rinse and repeat.
 
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#49
#49
BruinVol said:
10 wins to make everyone happy

7 wins to keep his job
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Bruin is right. 7 wins keeps Butch's job. Like it or not folks.

Now, on to my thoughts this year. We are not done losing in my opinion. Between mizz, sc, and Kentucky, we will lose one more game.

All you people expecting us to win out are in for a big surprise. We will make a bowl game, but chances are we are not winning out.
 
#50
#50
9 or 10 regular season wins. Good chance we get to 9 with the bowl game this year. Just got to keep building though. 9 or 10 in the SEC will be considered good seasons for any SEC coach aside from Saban going forward.
 
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