Well we're back to normal

#76
#76
zjcvols said:
Probably. But Springer player his worst game. Born and Schofield and Williams had games where they were bad too.

You can win with 5* freshmen. That’s not the issue. And our first six is talented. After the six, nobody has stepped up in SEC play. JJJ is also really inconsistent as well. So it’s not just “oh look we are having 1 and done guys now and we suck!” We still are a top 25 team.

By the way, we tried that groom and develop team last year and went 17-14. Give me the talent.
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The talent like UK/Duke/MSU all have?
 
#78
#78
Conference games

eFG%- 10th
OREB%- 14th
FT%- 13th
Offensive Rating per 100- 11th

Are these good
 
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#79
#79
zjcvols said:
Considering two of the programs are consistently better than us yes give me their talent every year.
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You’re mentioning last year for us, I’m mentioning this year for those programs...there’s a reason UK fans are sick of Cal, and it isn’t for a lack of bringing in talent lol.
 
#80
#80
zjcvols said:
Considering two of the programs are consistently better than us yes give me their talent every year.
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You’d get sick & tired of Calipari’s system like most of the UK fans I know.
 
#81
#81
VolFreakJosh said:
You’d get sick & tired of Calipari’s system like most of the UK fans I know.
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Our fan base has the worst case of “grass is greener” than anyone I know...if during the CCM years or Tyndall year you asked if you’d take consistent NCAAT appearances, program viewed as Top 20 nationally, landing some 5* recruits over UK & Duke among other national powers, and zero NCAA issues whatsoever every fan would’ve begged for it...now they have it and they’re miserable and want something else.
 
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#82
#82
bleedingTNorange said:
Our fan base has the worst case of “grass is greener” than anyone I know...if during the CCM years or Tyndall year you asked if you’d take consistent NCAAT appearances, program viewed as Top 20 nationally, landing some 5* recruits over UK & Duke among other national powers, and zero NCAA issues whatsoever every fan would’ve begged for it...now they have it and they’re miserable and want something else.
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Tennessee won’t hire anyone with a better resume than Barnes.

I don’t know what kind of fantasy land they’re living in but if they think it’s that easy to replace a HOF coach with someone else then they’re highly mistaken.

The whole “We’re too good for Barnes” argument is laughable.
 
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#83
#83
bleedingTNorange said:
You’re mentioning last year for us, I’m mentioning this year for those programs...there’s a reason UK fans are sick of Cal, and it isn’t for a lack of bringing in talent lol.
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I know many UK fans are sick of Cal, but they're ridiculous for that. I hate the dude but he's had great success there
 
#85
#85
VolFreakJosh said:
He’s always had the best players to work with.
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Yeah but they didnt just appear there, its part of his job to get them there, and he's done that well, and he develops players better than his reputation (at least among TN fans) would have you think. His in game coaching can leave something to be desired sometimes but it seems like Kentucky fans are more concerned with the one and done approach than anything else
 
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#86
#86
Vol49er said:
Yeah but they didnt just appear there, its part of his job to get them there, and he's done that well, and he develops players better than his reputation (at least among TN fans) would have you think. His in game coaching can leave something to be desired sometimes but it seems like Kentucky fans are more concerned with the one and done approach than anything else
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Because the One & Done approach doesn’t work anymore.

A lot of teams are starting to get great players now.

It’s not just the blue bloods anymore.
 
#87
#87
VolFreakJosh said:
Because the One & Done approach doesn’t work anymore.

A lot of teams are starting to get great players now.

It’s not just the blue bloods anymore.
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I guess you could say that, but there are just a handful of teams that would not trade their programs success over the time Cal has been there with Kentucky's success. I admit that the last 4 years have featured non "one and done" teams winning the NC. I think the best model is to take 1 or 2 one and dones a year to mix with developed players, similar to Duke's team that won it all with Jahlil Okafor
 
#88
#88
Ugh I dont want to defend Cal anymore haha, I just think Kentucky fans are foolish to want to can him. I saw on their board that a lot of them wanted Nate Oats, which is crazy to me. He's a good coach, but firing Cal to hire Oats would be a humongous bet
 
#89
#89
whobethis16 said:
5 guys had as many or more TOs than FGs, including the senior leader and the starting PG. This is unacceptable. 3 straight possessions Ole Miss ran the same trap, 3 straight turnovers. This team, which is the most talented in the Barnes tenure, is the least fun to watch. Too erratic, no flow on offense, too many pathetic showings.
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It's not the most talented in the Barnes era
 
#90
#90
Roustabout said:
Keon looked the more assertive, but did not finish. Someone earlier in the year was talking about “potential.” These guys are very good players, but no NBA team is picking Keon 7th based on the body of work we’ve seen. A 7th pick would take over and dominate games.

So, either these guys were overrated or Barnes and staff are quenching development.

Defense? You saw the difference in individual defense versus team defense and the havok it can wreak. I didn’t see final stats but there were around a dozen 2nd half turnovers, at least half directly attributable to the half court zone trap. Barnes thinks he has 4 PGs and he doesn’t even have one.
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Maybe he needs you to tell him since you know what he's thinking
 
#91
#91
1985Vols said:
For a coach that makes $166,000 a game, I think he should refund his salary for tonights performance because that was one of the worst performances by any Tennessee basketball team, ever
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Tennessee vs. Georgetown - Team Statistics - November 30, 2012 - ESPN

SEC Men's Basketball: Tennessee Volunteers vs. Virginia Cavaliers - Box Score - Dec 5, 2012 (secsports.com)

Men's Basketball vs Tennessee on 12/10/2011 - Box Score - Austin Peay State University Athletics (letsgopeay.com)
That Austin Peay team was 12-20.

These box scores say hello. Can even throw in Wade's last full season.
 
#93
#93
Roustabout said:
Keon looked the more assertive, but did not finish. Someone earlier in the year was talking about “potential.” These guys are very good players, but no NBA team is picking Keon 7th based on the body of work we’ve seen. A 7th pick would take over and dominate games.

So, either these guys were overrated or Barnes and staff are quenching development.

Defense? You saw the difference in individual defense versus team defense and the havok it can wreak. I didn’t see final stats but there were around a dozen 2nd half turnovers, at least half directly attributable to the half court zone trap. Barnes thinks he has 4 PGs and he doesn’t even have one.
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Not really true. NBA teams draft on potential. Players get drafted that high every year with similar resumes. Patrick Williams went #4 in this past draft and has similar numbers to Keon. Okoro didn't exactly dominate at Auburn either.
 
#94
#94
Vol49er said:
I guess you could say that, but there are just a handful of teams that would not trade their programs success over the time Cal has been there with Kentucky's success. I admit that the last 4 years have featured non "one and done" teams winning the NC. I think the best model is to take 1 or 2 one and dones a year to mix with developed players, similar to Duke's team that won it all with Jahlil Okafor
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Villanova...one of their championship years consisted of all 5 starters getting to the NBA, and they weren't one and dones.
 
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#95
#95
bleedingTNorange said:
It’s funny, UK fans think UT fans b!tching about Barnes are ridiculous for that 🤷🏻‍♂️
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I almost included a disclaimer, but yes, I think either program would be insane to move on from either coach (and neither program would, and I dont even think the majority of either fanbase wants to, just loud minorities of fans). They've both been very successful
 
#96
#96
VolGee4 said:
Villanova...one of their championship years consisted of all 5 starters getting to the NBA, and they weren't one and dones.
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Villanova is so interesting to me. Jay Wright is obviously an excellent coach, but would it surprise you to know that in the last eleven years an NCAA Tournament was held, they've made it past the first weekend just three times? And yet all three of those times, they made the Final Four, and twice won the NC (if you restricted it to the last ten years, they either lost before the second weekend or won the national championship, nothing in between). I dont really have a point in saying all this, just think it is interesting
 
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#97
#97
Vol49er said:
I know many UK fans are sick of Cal, but they're ridiculous for that. I hate the dude but he's had great success there
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UK fans are just a different breed. When Cal was hired, I predicted the under-30 fans would embrace him and his model, but that the over-30 crowd would tire of it in relatively little time. Those fans just grew up so attached to the players and invested in their lives and careers over 3-4 years that the mercenary model was going to wear thin, quickly, especially if it didn’t translate to championships. The 2012 title, and even the 2014 runner-up bought him some equity with those fans, but they are falling out of love with having to memorize an entirely new roster every year and having nothing to show for it in recent memory.

Tubby Smith, for all his warts, has as many titles as Cal and never missed the NCAAT in his 10 seasons, which Cal is about to do for the second time in 12 years.
 
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#99
#99
bleedingTNorange said:
We likely rank Top 5 in P5 over the last 4 years in wins, that’s pretty damn good.



Again, you weren’t cutting slack to coaches making less money, so why does this theory only work one way in that if they make more money they’re suddenly a better coach? He’s making $5m because we wanted him to stay here and that was the cost, not sure why you don’t get this.
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Not sure why you don’t get that with a higher salary comes higher expectations. This is true regardless of the job.
 
#100
#100
Thunder Good-Oil said:
So, just to be clear. You’re suggesting that Barnes is making too much money. Could you elaborate?
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Based on results, yes he is overpaid. What do we have to show for his $5M salary other than 1 Co- SEC Championship in 2018? Nate Oates is making 1/2 that amount and is getting ready to win an SEC title outright in his second season.
 
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