We’re #1 in Something....

#26
#26
zeppelin128 said:
When did the woo appear? I've always known the woo (first Neyland game in 2000).
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You'll get varying answers on this but I've been going to games regularly since the early 80's and the 1st I recall it was maybe in '97 by a few band members. It gained a little steam in '98 but you can watch games from that era and not hear it. By '99/'00 it was here to stay.
 
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#28
#28
Volfan76 said:
College sports are getting ridiculous...it's to the point that you can't leave your football team to get and keep themselves in shape...this is in no way Butch's fault.
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If I told my 13 year old son "Hey, get off Fortnite and go outside and cut the grass or I won't hold you accountable for the grass." You think the grass will get cut?
 
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#29
#29
sjt18 said:
I don't know if you were one of them... but I had a lot of people here attack me for saying that the 3 and then 4 year pattern of excessive injuries related to Jones' scheme, S&C philosophy, player rotation, player development, player selection, and techniques.

If it happens for a year then you can claim it is just an aberration. When it happens every year (ending promising careers in the process) then you MUST look at the coach. That's ESPECIALLY TRUE when the coach claims to have done an assessment an found nothing that needs to be changed as Jones did.
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I was catching **** for the same thing.

I said that poor conditioning, positioning, flexibility and technique were behind the injuries. Sure, you will always have fluke injuries. Jennings wrist injury comes to mind. But you don’t finish in the top two, two years in a row unless something is fundamentally wrong.
 
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#30
#30
Don't break your arms, patting yourselves on the back for taking guesses without any analysis to show whether they're right. I mean you, SJT and Roustabout. :)

I'm not attacking you. Just pointing out that you have no clothes on.
 
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#32
#32
Boca Vol said:
You'll get varying answers on this but I've been going to games regularly since the early 80's and the 1st I recall it was maybe in '97 by a few band members. It gained a little steam in '98 but you can watch games from that era and not hear it. By '99/'00 it was here to stay.
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Just like I thought, millennial BS. :)
 
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#33
#33
Roustabout said:
Hey SJT, I think we found one of the *******s. ^
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Heh, you didn't "find" me, I walked right into the thread and pointed out you're not wearing any clothes. :)

So here's the challenge: get a list of the injuries for either the '16 or '17 season (or both, that'd be awesome).

Start with the first injury. Gather any reports you can find telling what happened. All the Ws: where (practice field? locker room? weight room? dorm room?) ... when (spring camp? off-season? fall camp? in season practice? during a game?) ... what (twisted ankle? knee? shoulder? concussion?) ... why and how?

That last part, that's the most important, though all the other Ws help to isolate on it. How did it happen, and why? Was it lack of fitness? poor execution of a football move the player should have known how to do better? impact with another player? if so, under what conditions? freak accident, like planting your foot and your knee trying to bend backwards from the way it should (think of Chubb)?

And on, and on.

Once you've figured out THE proximate cause of that injury, once you have it categorized, good job. Now start on the second one on the list.

Go all the way through the season's injuries. Once you've done that, find the patterns. Was there any one factor that popped up frequently? Two or more common themes?

Only after you've done that analysis will you know (not guess, know) why the Vols suffered so much more than our "fair share" those two years.

Until then, you have no clothes on. Pardon me for letting you know. You have no clothes on.



p.s. The "how and why" part will go MUCH better if you have training in medicine or sports physiology. Getting down to the proximate cause is tough enough with in-depth training; sometimes near impossible for us laymen.
 
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#35
#35
VolsFan-TX said:
From SDS article:

"Tennessee led the nation in this category in 2017 with 58 starts lost due to injury or suspension. Florida ranked third in the nation and second among Power 5 programs with 49 starts lost. South Carolina ranked eighth overall on his list with 42 starts lost while Kentucky ranked 15th in the nation with 37 lost starts."

Injury-bitten: Tennessee led nation in starts lost due to injury/suspension


Tennessee led nation in missed starts two straight years | Times Free Press
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Wasn't half of Florida's team suspended last year or something like that for the credit card thing? If so that's crazy. Like I've said, I believe the issues were playing a small player system in a big player conference. The offense and defense that jones ran works fine when you have small agile players versus either small players or slow players. It works in smaller conferences just fine. When you have small fast players or try to do it with larger players that aren't as fast against sec competition that is big and fast, it's just not going to work for an extended period of time. Even if you outsmart or outrun them, the tackles are going to wear you out and injure you more than in other systems.
 
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#36
#36
VFL-82-JP said:
Don't break your arms, patting yourselves on the back for taking guesses without any analysis to show whether they're right. I mean you, SJT and Roustabout. :)

I'm not attacking you. Just pointing out that you have no clothes on.
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I still believe we would have won the East in 2016 and would have been at least 8-4 last season if it wasn't for the injuries. Butch would still be the coach had he managed that facet of the program.
 
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#37
#37
Jones recruited smaller players and we were less physical overall, from S@C to prectices. He taught a finesse offense, and we lost our ability to run in from the freakin 1 yard line. Jones is gone, everyone needs to give it a rest, quit talking about him it's Pruitts show now. We are recruiting bigger players, have a new S@C philosophy and I guarantee are players are going to be driven to work out and not live at the slushie machines after a few reps. Things are changing on the Hill, and finally it's for the good. GBO!!!!!
 
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#38
#38
volroadwarrior said:
I still believe we would have won the East in 2016 and would have been at least 8-4 last season if it wasn't for the injuries. Butch would still be the coach had he managed that facet of the program.
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Woulda, shoulda, coulda, that is the whole Butch Jones saga. JONES IS GONE, and thank goodness none of what you say would have happened didn't. I wouldn't change that outcome now if I could. GO Coach Pruitt and staff.
 
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#39
#39
If anyone does an analysis even close to what JP suggested, please share.
If I understood the article correctly, if a player started even 1 game last year, then was unable to return, the rest counts as missed starts?

So Jack Jones accounts for 11 misses?
Jennings 11 more? Add in Kirkland and TKjr and that's 43 of the misses?

For some reason, I just thought we had more starters get hurt.
 
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#40
#40
volroadwarrior said:
I still believe we would have won the East in 2016 and would have been at least 8-4 last season if it wasn't for the injuries. Butch would still be the coach had he managed that facet of the program.
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With this lineup...

UT-_Vandy2016.png


It was more than injury that kept Butch from being able to orchestrate a win against a 5-6 Vanderbilt in 2016.

It's way past time the fan base stopped pretending that Butch was even a decent coach.
 
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#41
#41
BeardedVol said:
With this lineup...

UT-_Vandy2016.png


It was more than injury that kept Butch from being able to orchestrate a win against a 5-6 Vanderbilt in 2016.

It's way past time the fan base stopped pretending that Butch was even a decent coach.
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Not rushing to defend him, but he now works for the NCs
 
#44
#44
TNnative said:
More importantly, who started the woo? My time machine is fired up, so I can go back in time and hunt his prissy butt down.
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I'm almost positive it came from the band. You may need to go interrogate the majorettes or flag members from 20 years ago...
 
#45
#45
BigOrangeMojo said:
We were #2 in 2016 but according to many on here, we did not have a culture/accountability problem or a S&C problem....
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Very true. I remember saying the same thing, and several posters were saying how I was just being negative.

Nope.
 
#46
#46
508mikey said:
Not rushing to defend him, but he now works for the NCs
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As an analyst (gopher) with no impact or input on the team in any way.

His lack of any HC offers after being fired is more telling of his coaching ability, than his new "job".
 
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#47
#47
TNnative said:
More importantly, who started the woo? My time machine is fired up, so I can go back in time and hunt his prissy butt down.
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Not my fault, before my time! I was a Kentucky fan kind of (kid surrounded by family Kentucky fans) before I went to Neyland with a friend. Converted me quickly to the good guys.
 
#49
#49
Volfan76 said:
College sports are getting ridiculous...it's to the point that you can't leave your football team to get and keep themselves in shape...this is in no way Butch's fault.
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No S&C coach for a year... Made work outs optional... Don't be stupid. The guy was a phoney through and through.
 
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#50
#50
Difficult looking back on it how a fellow who was all about the analytics could not grasp the data was telling him his team had an inordinate amount of injuries over several seasons. If he did not recognize it, then he missed the root cause as there's no evidence he corrected it at all.
 
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