Ukraine Protests

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#801
#801
hog88 said:
At this moment, no you are correct. Short of war there is nothing that the US can do. Putin knew this and that is why he felt free to take advantage of the situation.
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As would be the case under any president.
 
#804
#804
Gramps said:
I read your post that you were implying this was a Clinton initiative . My apologies.

The home loans being laxed during Clinton was done in 1999. It was the Gramm–Leach–Bliley Act ,also known as the Financial Services Modernization Act of 1999

This was a Republican bill. Introduced in the senate by by Phil Gramm (Republican of Texas) and in the U.S. House of Representatives by Jim Leach (R-Iowa). The third lawmaker associated with the bill was Rep. Thomas J. Bliley, Jr. (R-Virginia), Chairman of the House Commerce Committee from 1995 to 2001.

During debate in the House of Representatives, Rep. John Dingell (Democrat of Michigan) argued that the bill would result in banks becoming "too big to fail." Dingell further argued that this would necessarily result in a bailout by the Federal Government Dingell was spot-on.

The final votes passed by the Senate 90–8 and by the House 362–57. The legislation was signed into law by President Bill Clinton on November 12, 1999.

Both the Dems and Repubs have sponsored and passed laws that has brought us to the disastrous point we are in today. Our country debt has been going out of control since the early 1980's. Both sides of the aisle has helped put us there. In reality, there is basically no difference in the two party, other than their rhetoric in pandering for votes.
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Great post

Thanks
 
#805
#805
lawgator1 said:
Be specific. What could any president do to stop this?
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Hell, why even have a president? It appears to me that you think he was elected as the Observer in Chief.

Obama....the president that s**t just happens to. The world passes him by while he's on vacation.

EDIT: I almost forgot....

140226141903-obamacare-surcharge-620xa.jpg
 
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#806
#806
lawgator1 said:
Ok, so what different would a President Romney do that would result in a different calculation by Putin?

Answer: Absolutely nothing.
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Hard to say - would depend on what Romney had done up until this point.

If you believe Putin makes all his moves completely independent of how he expects other leaders to react then you are more naive than I thought.
 
#807
#807
volinbham said:
Hard to say - would depend on what Romney had done up until this point.

If you believe Putin makes all his moves completely independent of how he expects other leaders to react then you are more naive than I thought.
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He's not naive. LG is a desperate Obama apologist. He goes to great lengths to defend BHO idiocy.
 
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#810
#810
lawgator1 said:
As would be the case under any president.
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This is where you have you have a severe disconnect. If Putin thought for a moment that Obama (any POTUS) would act, had a track record of strong decisive actions he just might not have started the whole thing.

If you look at Obama's track record, he is a lot of bluster and bluff with little to no substance so why would any world leader be fearful of the US?

Syria - red line = no action
Benghazi = No action
Iran deal fall through = no action
and so on and so on
 
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#811
#811
W.TN.Orange Blood said:
President Obama prefers public speeches. President Putin prefers to let his actions speak for him. Obama talks big. Putin says FU.
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Yup

hog88 said:
This is where you have you have a severe disconnect. If Putin thought for a moment that Obama (any POTUS) would act, had a track record of strong decisive actions he just might not have started the whole thing.

If you look at Obama's track record, he is a lot of bluster and bluff with little to no substance so why would any world leader be fearful of the US?

Syria - red line = no action
Benghazi = No action
Iran deal fall through = no action
and so on and so on
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Anybody who doesn't clearly see this is the case is being willfully ignorant. World leaders watch actions. They don't listen to speeches.
 
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#812
#812
DC_Vol said:
Yup



Anybody who doesn't clearly see this is the case is being willfully ignorant. World leaders watch actions. They don't listen to speeches.
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Agree. Obama is the weakest president we have had on foreign policy since Carter.
 
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#814
#814
John Kerry to Meet with Ukrainian Officials in Kiev

This is a genius move for Obama. If Kerry can get a simultaneous audience with both sides of the conflict, then 'The Sandman' (Kerry's nickname in the administration) can work his magic. The monotone man from Massachusetts will induce a boredom driven coma which will give more reasonable people a chance to work out a suitable solution.
 
#815
#815
volinbham said:
Hard to say - would depend on what Romney had done up until this point.

If you believe Putin makes all his moves completely independent of how he expects other leaders to react then you are more naive than I thought.
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I'm saying he would not expect any president to do anything other than exactly what Obama has done.

And still, days into this, no one here has articulated anything any other president would have done differently.

Know why? Because there is nothing.
 
#816
#816
Still waiting for anyone to list a single thing any president could do to stop this.

Still waiting ....
 
#817
#817
lawgator1 said:
Still waiting for anyone to list a single thing any president could do to stop this.

Still waiting ....
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See Hog's post...#810. Spot on. Obama's got a track record of making speeches, drawing lines, and then having his bluffs called.

Had he wanted to stop this, he would have needed to act like a leader in previous instances.
 
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#818
#818
lawgator1 said:
Still waiting for anyone to list a single thing any president could do to stop this.

Still waiting ....
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I don't think the answer you are asking is not what would any president would do now, it"s what they would have done to get to this point.
The question in my mind is if Obama had backed up his red line remarks would Putin have started this to begin with. Putin does not fear Obama. Obama's past actions show he is talk with no show, therefore Putin is going to do whatever he wants to.
 
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#819
#819
What did GW Bush do when Putin invaded Georgia, other than call the Mayor of Atlanta to ask what was going on?
 
#821
#821
Gramps said:
I don't think the answer you are asking is not what would any president would do now, it"s what they would have done to get to this point.
The question in my mind is if Obama had backed up his red line remarks would Putin have started this to begin with. Putin does not fear Obama. Obama's past actions show he is talk with no show, therefore Putin is going to do whatever he wants to.
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The enormous and obvious problem with that assertion (aside from the fact that it is rank speculation) is that it assumes that Putin would think that a harsher president on foreign policy would act to stop him in Crimea.

As no president, no matter how tough he might have been leading up to this, would ever act to stop the Russians in Crimea, it makes no difference.

In order for prior actions of Obama to have "invited" this, or otherwise made Putin think he could to it with impunity, you would have to believe that some other president would actually be perceived as ready to have done something other than what Obama is doing.

The entire argument fails because there is nothing any president could do in this situation.

And so, still, I am waiting for any coherent argument as to what any president could do to stop this. And I am going to be waiting I suspect forever because there is nothing any president could do to stop this.
 
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#822
#822
lawgator1 said:
Still waiting for anyone to list a single thing any president could do to stop this.

Still waiting ....
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You don't want an answer. You've clearly stated that the office of POTUS is powerless to influence how this goes down regardless of who is in there. With that mindset you will never accept that influence could be wielded.

Further, this mindset absolves the current office holder from any criticism since events are 100% out of his control.
 
#824
#824
lawgator1 said:
The enormous and obvious problem with that assertion (aside from the fact that it is rank speculation) is that it assumes that Putin would think that a harsher president on foreign policy would act to stop him in Crimea.

As no president, no matter how tough he might have been leading up to this, would ever act to stop the Russians in Crimea, it makes no difference.

In order for prior actions of Obama to have "invited" this, or otherwise made Putin think he could to it with impunity, you would have to believe that some other president would actually be perceived as ready to have done something other than what Obama is doing.

The entire argument fails because there is nothing any president could do in this situation.

And so, still, I am waiting for any coherent argument as to what any president could do to stop this. And I am going to be waiting I suspect forever because there is nothing any president could do to stop this.
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Nothing could have been done, LG. Obama should stop making his speeches, too. Nobody on the world stage gives a rat's ass what Obama thinks. His words are meaningless.

Wait no speeches...what will he put on iPods as gifts to other foreign leaders?? LOL. Obama.

Happy now? The victim president strikes again!
 
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#825
#825
volinbham said:
You don't want an answer. You've clearly stated that the office of POTUS is powerless to influence how this goes down regardless of who is in there. With that mindset you will never accept that influence could be wielded.

Further, this mindset absolves the current office holder from any criticism since events are 100% out of his control.
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It sounds as though you are agreeing with me that no president could stop this.
 
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