Ukraine Protests

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#1,001
#1,001
lawgator1 said:
I'm still waiting for a coherent argument as to what we should do here differently and why....
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You must have missed the last 200 posts. There have been plenty of coherent arguments.

Interestingly enough,

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#1,003
#1,003
I've been closely studying the current videos showing "Russian" (i.e., unidentified) forces in Crimea and Russian forces executing their completely scheduled war exercises. I feel like I can say with confidence that we could take them. They look like Walmart shoppers (minus being grossly overweight): look intimidating as you're guarding your wife who's attempting to raid the sales, shooting out mean looks, only to buckle when someone else says, "Excuse me."
 
#1,005
#1,005
vol4eva said:
Russia lost 60 billion in stock value today. If this continues, it's only a matter of time until significant protests arise in Russia.
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Already have, but Emperor Vlad suppresses them. I also hear he drinks protester blood.
 
#1,008
#1,008
volprof said:
Good post, although I disagree with several things you mention. Namely, your last paragraph assumes that, for one, this model is desirable and even sustainable. Given what I call the "penis inadequacies" of current international politics, often dictated by nation-states, however, you're right in that this model is desirable. Key question I suppose is if Putin's approach is sustainable. Which leads me to my last issue here: you say there are few avenues he can lose. I think it's too soon to make such a claim. You may be right, but I think there is suggestion that the current Russian approach may not be able to sustain itself unless significant changes are made.
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Depends greatly on the "desire and sustainability" from the outside observer. Ultra-nationalists like Putin tend to be able to keep the attention of their populations by focusing the point of the "threat" against their geopolitical foes. And in doing such can sustain themselves for longer than typically is possible as long as the people aren't affected. If this comes out in Russia's favor, Putin can point to how he stuck it to those greedy Europeans and Americans and how Russia is now much safer since their influence is diminished.

But a key factor here is the military approach to this. By doing as much in the Ukraine, Putin has showed it is something that's never off the table and this consideration has to be taken into account in all future negotiations when dealing with the Russians. It's never easy to continue military operations of the type without significantly harming your national treasury or even world image, but the fact he did it means any future political opponent(s) will have to be wary of Russian military intervention.

As for the win situation here with Putin, he cannot back down now without losing great face politically at home. Unless the threat of outright general war over the Ukraine comes into play (which there is nothing right now to suggest it will) he has no need to back down. But even a UN sponsored peacekeeping force in the Crimea and eastern Ukraine has the effect of a political win for Russia since they are no longer spending their own money on a military deployment yet are free to exert influence as they see fit. Eastern Ukraine and the Crimea have significant pro-Russian populations so keeping the EU and US influence out by way of the UN is a political victory. And if the UN is not able to maintain the peace, they can point to it and say "told you so" while moving their troops back in for "protection."

Lot's of win scenarios here for Putin. Far less for the Ukrainian people, the EU and US. Best we can achieve is a political stalemate which again, can be perceived by the Russian people as a win.
 
#1,009
#1,009
volprof said:
I've been closely studying the current videos showing "Russian" (i.e., unidentified) forces in Crimea and Russian forces executing their completely scheduled war exercises. I feel like I can say with confidence that we could take them. They look like Walmart shoppers (minus being grossly overweight): look intimidating as you're guarding your wife who's attempting to raid the sales, shooting out mean looks, only to buckle when someone else says, "Excuse me."
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wut
 
#1,011
#1,011
DC_Vol said:
Hahahaha :blink:
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During the last major snowstorm on campus a couple weeks ago, some enterprising and devilish students constructed what I affectionately labelled a "snow penis." You should have seen it: 3 feet tall and balls that would have made a bull proud. It was magnificent.

My point is that we're obsessed with the phallus. Most likely, the culprits of said snow penis were heterosexual males. Of course that's speculation, but it doesn't matter. The 90s craze with "Big Johnson" shirts demonstrate as much. Men, who tend to control things, are obsessed with penises. And we're obsessed with our sexual performance and capabilities. The jostling of the nation-state, in my opinion, is an unconscious reflection of this infatuation. Call me crazy.
 
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#1,013
#1,013
volprof said:
I've been closely studying the current videos showing "Russian" (i.e., unidentified) forces in Crimea and Russian forces executing their completely scheduled war exercises. I feel like I can say with confidence that we could take them. They look like Walmart shoppers (minus being grossly overweight): look intimidating as you're guarding your wife who's attempting to raid the sales, shooting out mean looks, only to buckle when someone else says, "Excuse me."
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You could be correct

The Soviets forced millions into military service during WWII to defend Mother Russia. They then forced them to sacrifice themselves to the German guns on the Eastern Front, mostly because the Russian soldiers feared being killed by their own Comrades more than they feared being killed by the Germans.

I highly doubt their current military is like that of WWII or the Cold War, but I always thought that was interesting when people talk about how great fighters the Russians can be
 
#1,014
#1,014
Why can't Putin and a rep for UUkraine simply play a game of "Risk" with the outcome deciding the victor?
 
#1,018
#1,018
CountVolcula said:
You could be correct

The Soviets forced millions into military service during WWII to defend Mother Russia. They then forced them to sacrifice themselves to the German guns on the Eastern Front, mostly because the Russian soldiers feared being killed by their own Comrades more than they feared being killed by the Germans.

I highly doubt their current military is like that of WWII or the Cold War, but I always thought that was interesting when people talk about how great fighters the Russians can be
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I can't really blame the Soviet soldiers being so brave. It was better to die from Wehrmacht bullets than KGB ones.
 
#1,022
#1,022
Dave1967 said:
If Russia can manage to occupy the Ukraine without any international pressure I would be very nervous if I were Latvia,Lituania,Estonia,Belarus or Georgia.
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Latvia, Lithuania and Estonia are members of NATO. Very unlikely Putin will directly challenge these countries.

Belarus is already under Russian influence and control.

Georgia was invaded by Putin during the Bush Administration.
 
#1,024
#1,024
Ukrainian soccer federation has cancelled the scheduled upcoming friendly against the US this week. So there's that to worry about as well.
 
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