Too much ice

#9,476
#9,476
BeardedVol said:
Lol so you just wanted to enlighten the board with a video of a random guy who holds the same opinion on the subject as you?
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Also, why would this be a bad thing? Please explain the reason to question doing so.

If one believes that someone did a good job of describing and supporting a viewpoint, especially on a volatile and contentious subject, why would it be a bad thing to do so?
 
#9,477
#9,477
Majors said:
I listed to it all. The 7 min mark is the money shot.
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Where he says you must comply and allow every act of authorities to happen without ever getting in the way?

The fact is the gun shouldn't even be brought up on the discussions. It is funny to hear the right wing description of it though. Bessent was particularly entertaining

Then you have video of poorly trained agents feeling as though they can assault anyone without repercussions. That's the real issue yet we're supposed to sit by and simply watch according to the video.

Better trained agents doing a real public service would have at worst made Pretti spend the night in jail. What we got was a perfect example of the current admin and their leadership
 
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#9,478
#9,478
MercyPercy said:
They feared for their lives after pepper spraying his face at point blank range, tackling him to the ground, beating him up and removing his firearm that he never touched.

Incredible.
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If you were tied up with someone who was fighting you, and you found out they had a gun, you would not fear for your life/safety? Serious question.

Why would them having been pepper-sprayed make them LESS dangerous with a gun? Being blind and angry makes someone LESS dangerous with a firearm?

And why would fighting with them make you think they are LESS dangerous to you with a gun?

And did the agents know that/when he had been disarmed?

Please answer in the form of expert testimony that ANY of the above should NOT cause reasonable belief in the agents' mind that they were in imminent danger.
 
#9,479
#9,479
hjeagle1vol said:
This one’s wrapped up anyway. Lunatic gets ribs broken while attacking federal agents and goes back for revenge. Clearly his rage cost him his life.
Now that Tampon Tim has bent the knee to Trump and Homan let’s get this cleaned up, put the fraudsters and insurrectionist in prison, and move on to Chicago.
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The DHS denied that ever happened. Why do you pick and choose who you believe when it’s convenient?
 
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#9,480
#9,480
Orange_Crush said:
If you were tied up with someone who was fighting you, and you found out they had a gun, you would not fear for your life/safety? Serious question.

Why would them having been pepper-sprayed make them LESS dangerous with a gun? Being blind and angry makes someone LESS dangerous with a firearm?

And why would fighting with them make you think they are LESS dangerous to you with a gun?

And did the agents know that/when he had been disarmed?

Please answer in the form of expert testimony that ANY of the above should NOT cause reasonable belief in the agents' mind that they were in imminent danger.
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He was sprayed before they ever knew about the gun. He wasn't initially fighting he was helping the woman who just got assaulted. Getting grabbed from behind by multiple people will trigger a response and it's what the agents count on
 
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#9,481
#9,481
utvolpj said:
Where he says you must comply and allow every act of authorities to happen without ever getting in the way?

The fact is the gun shouldn't even be brought up on the discussions. It is funny to hear the right wing description of it though. Bessent was particularly entertaining

Then you have video of poorly trained agents feeling as though they can assault anyone without repercussions. That's the real issue yet we're supposed to sit by and simply watch according to the video.

Better trained agents doing a real public service would have at worst made Pretti spend the night in jail. What we got was a perfect example of the current admin and their leadership
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Well said. Obfuscation and distraction are the words that come to mind. Pay no attention to what you really saw.
 
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#9,482
#9,482
hjeagle1vol said:
This one’s wrapped up anyway. Lunatic gets ribs broken while attacking federal agents and goes back for revenge. Clearly his rage cost him his life.
Now that Tampon Tim has bent the knee to Trump and Homan let’s get this cleaned up, put the fraudsters and insurrectionist in prison, and move on to Chicago.
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Still didn't watch the video huh?

What is it about you guys and fake stories?
 
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#9,486
#9,486
Orange_Crush said:
If you were tied up with someone who was fighting you, and you found out they had a gun, you would not fear for your life/safety? Serious question.

Why would them having been pepper-sprayed make them LESS dangerous with a gun? Being blind and angry makes someone LESS dangerous with a firearm?

And why would fighting with them make you think they are LESS dangerous to you with a gun?

And did the agents know that/when he had been disarmed?

Please answer in the form of expert testimony that ANY of the above should NOT cause reasonable belief in the agents' mind that they were in imminent danger.
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They had multiple dudes on him and the gun was removed. He never attempted to use his gun. They shot him in the back multiple times after it was removed. Any way you slice it, all you're doing is trying cover for this, at best, extremely ill-advised and negligent use of force by the agents due to your own personal politics. They could have easily shot each other in the instance. It was completely unprofessional and the only folks that think it's a good shoot are MAGA sycophants, so maybe let that one marinate.
 
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#9,488
#9,488
utvolpj said:
He was sprayed before they ever knew about the gun. He wasn't initially fighting he was helping the woman who just got assaulted. Getting grabbed from behind by multiple people will trigger a response and it's what the agents count on
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Like I said, IF the description of events were true. I haven't been able to make and determination on when the first shot was fired in comparison to when they knew he was armed. I doubt you do either.

An ICE agent was engaged with a girl. While he was engaged with the girl, Pretti grabbed him from the side/behind--thus instigating contact with a federal LEO. They were pepper sprayed. having assaulted an officer, the officer tried to arrest him, at which time he resisted and began fighting.

You may think all of that is justified because the ICE officer shoved a girl that was interfering with his duties, but I assure you that is how it will be presented to the court, and the video will bear it out.
 
#9,490
#9,490
MercyPercy said:
They had multiple dudes on him and the gun was removed. He never attempted to use his gun. They shot him in the back multiple times after it was removed. Any way you slice it, all you're doing is trying cover for this, at best, extremely ill-advised and negligent use of force by the agents due to your own personal politics. They could have easily shot each other in the instance. It was completely unprofessional and the only folks that think it's a good shoot are MAGA sycophants, so maybe let that one marinate.
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You failed to answer any of my questions in favor of using emotional vagaries and attributing motives to me. I'll try again.


Orange_Crush said:
If you were tied up with someone who was fighting you, and you found out they had a gun, you would not fear for your life/safety? Serious question.

Why would them having been pepper-sprayed make them LESS dangerous with a gun? Being blind and angry makes someone LESS dangerous with a firearm?

And why would fighting with them make you think they are LESS dangerous to you with a gun?

And did the agents know that/when he had been disarmed?

Please answer in the form of expert testimony that ANY of the above should NOT cause reasonable belief in the agents' mind that they were in imminent danger.
Click to expand...
 
#9,491
#9,491
Orange_Crush said:
Like I said, IF the description of events were true. I haven't been able to make and determination on when the first shot was fired in comparison to when they knew he was armed. I doubt you do either.

An ICE agent was engaged with a girl. While he was engaged with the girl, Pretti grabbed him from the side/behind--thus instigating contact with a federal LEO. They were pepper sprayed. having assaulted an officer, the officer tried to arrest him, at which time he resisted and began fighting.

You may think all of that is justified because the ICE officer shoved a girl that was interfering with his duties, but I assure you that is how it will be presented to the court, and the video will bear it out.
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It’s pretty easy and was actually done by evening Saturday. Several of the videos were taken to slow motion and marked where the agent retreating had the firearm. Then played back at speed and you see him leaving at the same point and hear the shot later. That’s clearly been resolved. What happened to the agent carrying the gun accidentally fired it?
 
#9,492
#9,492
utvolpj said:
Where he says you must comply and allow every act of authorities to happen without ever getting in the way?

The fact is the gun shouldn't even be brought up on the discussions. It is funny to hear the right wing description of it though. Bessent was particularly entertaining

Then you have video of poorly trained agents feeling as though they can assault anyone without repercussions. That's the real issue yet we're supposed to sit by and simply watch according to the video.

Better trained agents doing a real public service would have at worst made Pretti spend the night in jail. What we got was a perfect example of the current admin and their leadership
Click to expand...
Exactly! Except change "Better Trained to Trained"
 
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#9,493
#9,493
Orange_Crush said:
Like I said, IF the description of events were true. I haven't been able to make and determination on when the first shot was fired in comparison to when they knew he was armed. I doubt you do either.

An ICE agent was engaged with a girl. While he was engaged with the girl, Pretti grabbed him from the side/behind--thus instigating contact with a federal LEO. They were pepper sprayed. having assaulted an officer, the officer tried to arrest him, at which time he resisted and began fighting.

You may think all of that is justified because the ICE officer shoved a girl that was interfering with his duties, but I assure you that is how it will be presented to the court, and the video will bear it out.
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In court the fact they will be presented with was an unarmed man restrained by multiple agents was shot double digit times in the back
 
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#9,496
#9,496
NorthDallas40 said:
It’s pretty easy and was actually done by evening Saturday. Several of the videos were taken to slow motion and marked where the agent retreating had the firearm. Then played back at speed and you see him leaving at the same point and hear the shot later. That’s clearly been resolved. What happened to the agent carrying the gun accidentally fired it?
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I didn't mention when he'd been disarmed. I said that I haven't been able to ascertain (1) when one of the agents knew that he was armed, or (2) if/when the initial agent yelled "gun!" as training would dictate. Again, my questions were centered on whether the initial firing agent reasonable thought that Pretti was armed at the time he shot. The "disarmed" point is misdirected, as it's obvious that the disarming agent didn't shoot him, and right now, he's the only one that I KNOW knew Pretti was disarmed.
 
#9,498
#9,498
utvolpj said:
In court the fact they will be presented with was an unarmed man restrained by multiple agents was shot double digit times in the back
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Again, they will be presented with someone who'd assaulted an officer, fighting with multiple officers while armed. The grand jury will be asked if the officer's feeling of immediate danger was reasonable.
 
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