To Protect and to Serve II

#5,602
#5,602
hog88 said:
That's bull! I don't care who you are or if you have a warrant or not, you break into a persons house you take your chances.
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I'm with you here, for the most part. At issue is the "no knock" provision in search warrants. It's a good idea gone bad. The intent is to allow LE to execute a warrant without announcing their office and allowing the occupants to open the door, in theory to prevent the destruction of evidence inside the structure, or to interrupt a determined, armed reaction.

The reality is that it has been, in some cases, abused, and it has also resulted in shootings that should never have occurred. You come through my door at 2 am, you are going to be met with gunfire. Auditory exclusion is real, and I likely won't hear "Police...Search Warrant" when you come through the door.

I served many a search / arrest warrant on high-risk locations and subjects back when I was on the SRT. Some of them were "no knock", but we had a very strict protocol for deciding if we would ask for the no-knock provision. I learned from a good unit commander, who laid it out for me like this: "If you are expecting to be met with gunfire, why are you going in? Smoke 'em out." Solid advice.

We arrested a murder suspect out of Jacksonville on a phone call once. JSO had advised us that the guy was a known gang member; carried guns; had shot at cops before; and "would not be taken alive." We had a no-knock warrant, and just knew this was going to end with a gunfight. We managed to set up a good, tight perimeter at about 4 am; did a comm check; and our team commander called the guy on his cell phone. Told him we were there; he was not going to get away; if he wanted a fight to come on out; but we would guarantee his safety if he walked out and followed our instructions. 15 minutes later, he's in cuffs, not a shot fired, and no one hurt. They don't all end that way, but that was a powerful lesson for me.

I've made more than my share of stupid mistakes, so I don't claim the high ground here, but yes...sometimes we are our own worst enemy.
 
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#5,603
#5,603
GreyWolf1129 said:
I'm with you here, for the most part. At issue is the "no knock" provision in search warrants. It's a good idea gone bad. The intent is to allow LE to execute a warrant without announcing their office and allowing the occupants to open the door, in theory to prevent the destruction of evidence inside the structure, or to interrupt a determined, armed reaction.

The reality is that it has been, in some cases, abused, and it has also resulted in shootings that should never have occurred. You come through my door at 2 am, you are going to be met with gunfire. Auditory exclusion is real, and I likely won't hear "Police...Search Warrant" when you come through the door.

I served many a search / arrest warrant on high-risk locations and subjects back when I was on the SRT. Some of them were "no knock", but we had a very strict protocol for deciding if we would ask for the no-knock provision. I learned from a good unit commander, who laid it out for me like this: "If you are expecting to be met with gunfire, why are you going in? Smoke 'em out." Solid advice.

We arrested a murder suspect out of Jacksonville on a phone call once. JSO had advised us that the guy was a known gang member; carried guns; had shot at cops before; and "would not be taken alive." We had a no-knock warrant, and just knew this was going to end with a gunfight. We managed to set up a good, tight perimeter at about 4 am; did a comm check; and our team commander called the guy on his cell phone. Told him we were there; he was not going to get away; if he wanted a fight to come on out; but we would guarantee his safety if he walked out and followed our instructions. 15 minutes later, he's in cuffs, not a shot fired, and no one hurt. They don't all end that way, but that was a powerful lesson for me.

I've made more than my share of stupid mistakes, so I don't claim the high ground here, but yes...sometimes we are our own worst enemy.
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Sadly, the truth is that anyone that comes to your door at 2:00 a.m. has evil intentions for the homeowner.
 
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#5,604
#5,604
GreyWolf1129 said:
I'm with you here, for the most part. At issue is the "no knock" provision in search warrants. It's a good idea gone bad. The intent is to allow LE to execute a warrant without announcing their office and allowing the occupants to open the door, in theory to prevent the destruction of evidence inside the structure, or to interrupt a determined, armed reaction.

The reality is that it has been, in some cases, abused, and it has also resulted in shootings that should never have occurred. You come through my door at 2 am, you are going to be met with gunfire. Auditory exclusion is real, and I likely won't hear "Police...Search Warrant" when you come through the door.

I served many a search / arrest warrant on high-risk locations and subjects back when I was on the SRT. Some of them were "no knock", but we had a very strict protocol for deciding if we would ask for the no-knock provision. I learned from a good unit commander, who laid it out for me like this: "If you are expecting to be met with gunfire, why are you going in? Smoke 'em out." Solid advice.

We arrested a murder suspect out of Jacksonville on a phone call once. JSO had advised us that the guy was a known gang member; carried guns; had shot at cops before; and "would not be taken alive." We had a no-knock warrant, and just knew this was going to end with a gunfight. We managed to set up a good, tight perimeter at about 4 am; did a comm check; and our team commander called the guy on his cell phone. Told him we were there; he was not going to get away; if he wanted a fight to come on out; but we would guarantee his safety if he walked out and followed our instructions. 15 minutes later, he's in cuffs, not a shot fired, and no one hurt. They don't all end that way, but that was a powerful lesson for me.

I've made more than my share of stupid mistakes, so I don't claim the high ground here, but yes...sometimes we are our own worst enemy.
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Posts like this are why I respect you. Common sense is anything but common..you have had some good mentors and superior officers in life...and have been smart and willing enough to learn from them. If all cops used as much restraint and common sense..and respect for ALL civilians as you do...the cop bashers on here would actually have NOTHING to complain about pertaining to police. They could still complain about laws, there are many stupid and unnecessary laws...but They would have a hard time finding fault in the tip of the spear thst enforces those laws. Good job, wish all cops had as much wisdom and restraint as you. Sadly, as I have said before...that 1% that are unhinged paint an ugly picture for the rest of y'all in the age of instant information transfer....

Edit...I am a superintendent now for almost 10 years, but still do sidejobs remodeling bathrooms kitchens, building decks pergola gazebos etc...have spent years self employed doing only that...believe me when i say that 1 dirty contractor stealing people's hard earned cash, or doing shoddy work, etc gives all contractors a bad name, too..it's the reason things like Angies list exist...I know what it feels like to be not trusted and looked down upon based on the actions of another person in my field, it really sucks. My FIL, 30 year contractor, and I both will lose money in order to satisfy a customer on the very rare chance that they are unsatisfied with a job. Even if i told them "that tile probably won't look good with those cabinets, etc...i have had to pay my help and lose money a couple times like that, when i knew it wasn't my mistake, or a lapse of good craftsmanship..that's just how we roll, honest people who care about our good name, very much. It really sucks when some clown gets a 1st chexk and runs off, or steals from homeowners, etc...and gives a bad name to us all. It is very frustrating. The 1 thing i will say that is different, sometimes "good cops" look the other way when a dirty cop is beating the hizell out of a perp...or otherwise breaking the law. I dont think you would do that, but it does happen. No honest contractor is gonna cover for a dirtbag, we hate them more than customers do, for giving us a bad name

Sorry for long post
 
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#5,608
#5,608
#5,610
#5,610
utvols88 said:
Another example of falsely accusing a white officer. Another accusation saved by the body cam footage. These body cams have turned to be very beneficial to the officers in their exoneration.


Video: Bodycam footage shows woman falsely accused cop of sexual assault | New York Post
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It'd be nice if they were as beneficial to the unarmed people they were killing.

If they capture an officer executing a crying man pleading for his life and not lead to any significant consequences for the cop, they’re pretty damn worthless as far as I’m concerned.
 
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#5,611
#5,611
n_huffhines said:
In the case of the Golden State killer, it was reported on the news that the man was black, which is information they got from the police. The victims had to contact the authorities to clarify that he was white. This wasn't some emergency situation like in the case of the Zodiac...police interviewed victims thoroughly and somehow it later got communicated to the news that he was black.
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RE: this was a 40-year old cold case and they just made an arrest. Based on DNA evidence, the 12 murders, 50 rapes, and 100 burglaries seem they were committed by former police officer Joseph DeAngelo.

Golden State Killer - Wikipedia
 
#5,612
#5,612
Cdywolfe said:
It'd be nice if they were as beneficial to the unarmed people they were killing.

If they capture an officer executing a crying man pleading for his life and not lead to any significant consequences for the cop, they’re pretty damn worthless as far as I’m concerned.
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#5,613
#5,613
hog88 said:
Yep except they killed the homeowner and nobody ever stood trial for it.
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Are you freaking kidding me. I lost track of story bit I thought a trial was inevitable.

They buy off the family of the victim?
 
#5,614
#5,614
McDad said:
Are you freaking kidding me. I lost track of story bit I thought a trial was inevitable.

They buy off the family of the victim?
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I think they got some money but nobody was ever charged. I don't think anyone even lost their jobs.
 
#5,618
#5,618
DancingOutlaw said:
Another one that appears to be going nowhere.

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Good shoot...

"I told John I was proud of him," Perkins said. "I said, 'You reacted like you were trained. You shot that son of a [expletive]. Sorry for the family, but you shot him. You went home that morning to your kids, your three kids, you know? I was able to go home to my wife.'"
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#5,620
#5,620
Cdywolfe said:
It'd be nice if they were as beneficial to the unarmed people they were killing.

If they capture an officer executing a crying man pleading for his life and not lead to any significant consequences for the cop, they’re pretty damn worthless as far as I’m concerned.
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Seems to be working out for Sterling Brown; it shows how FOS the PD was about his case.
 
#5,623
#5,623
Rasputin_Vol said:
Good shoot...
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Idiots all the way around. In what universe do you attempt entry in a hostage situation to kick things off? No attempt to contact the alleged crazy woman to calm her down? Just go in gunning. Then they shoot a man in his own house and they act like they were seconds from their maker. The ex MIL should be charged with murder as well. I’m sure she’s proud of herself.
 
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