Three pointers percentage NCAA team rankings

[glv98]

You can bet yer ass Kellie was and is using analytics…

For sure, math major very analytical. In fact it's one of the many things she was criticized for while here. Too clinical and inflexible.

Nothing wrong with analytics, they're cool. And definitely here to stay. I just like good old fashioned instinct and spontaneity sometimes too.

 

[chuckiepoo]

Too clinical and inflexible.

Who else recently has been thusly accused? I’m sensing a fledgling narrative coalescing…

 

[Volfan2012]

For sure, math major very analytical. In fact it's one of the many things she was criticized for while here. Too clinical and inflexible.

Nothing wrong with analytics, they're cool. And definitely here to stay. I just like good old fashioned instinct and spontaneity sometimes too.

Don't see any problem with discovering what a player does best. If we were actually doing it on the court might actually work out. I don't know we've went in a different direction way to often this season.

 

[chuckiepoo]

Don't see any problem with discovering what a player does best. If we were actually doing it on the court might actually work out. I don't know we've went in a different direction way to often this season.

The issue with analytics is if you’re going to use them, use them.

Analytics sez your <20% 3pt/att players aren’t taking 3ptatts.

 

[madtownvol]

The issue with analytics is if you’re going to use them, use them.

Analytics sez your <20% 3pt/att players aren’t taking 3ptatts.

The analytics discussed in Cora's article were based on practice play which is only a facsimile of game situations and less instructive than actual games.

After 8 games, they should have great data from actual game situations and it is probably refining those preseason evals.

Also, if I were a coach, I would never make our actual analytics public. I would only publicize GIGO (we average 1.2 points per possession by hoisting under handed set shots from mid court; surprisingly, the analytics show that we get more points per possession from missed 3s than made 3s so our best three point shooters are our worst 3 point shooters).

 

[madtownvol]

Yes Jon was a whipping boy. And Kellie had lots of other problems. It just seemed so backwards and regressive when there's other spouse coaches not just across the country and conference, but also on our own volleyball team!

Kelle had a nice win last night. Good for them.

Jon is not an assistant for her at Mizzou so, it turns out Kellie can change/learn.

During her tenure, there was a set of posters who were against her from the get go because she was Fulmer hire and they wanted Jeff Walz (as if.....). They griped about everything from day one, including Jon.

As Kellie time went on, and she just was not able to win games against the top flight or land top HS recruits, I think more posters jumped on the anti-Jon bandwagon using the argument that TN has resources and is he really the best assistant Kellie could get?

I think CKC's husband being the behind the scenes "analytics guy" is not quite comparable. You can hire any competent statistician to get those breakdowns so if has the skill set, there is not going to be too much debate over his role.

 

[glv98]

Jon is not an assistant for her at Mizzou so, it turns out Kellie can change/learn.

During her tenure, there was a set of posters who were against her from the get go because she was Fulmer hire and they wanted Jeff Walz (as if.....). They griped about everything from day one, including Jon.

As Kellie time went on, and she just was not able to win games against the top flight or land top HS recruits, I think more posters jumped on the anti-Jon bandwagon using the argument that TN has resources and is he really the best assistant Kellie could get?

I think CKC's husband being the behind the scenes "analytics guy" is not quite comparable. You can hire any competent statistician to get those breakdowns so if has the skill set, there is not going to be too much debate over his role.

If not for the Jon Derangement Syndrome, I’ll bet Justin would be a full fledged assistant. And that would be great. I love that the spouse coaching arrangements lets families with small children stay together.

 

[madtownvol]

If not for the Jon Derangement Syndrome, I’ll bet Justin would be a full fledged assistant. And that would be great. I love that the spouse coaching arrangements lets families with small children stay together.

I am sure that is the case.

 

[volsagain]

The analytics discussed in Cora's article were based on practice play which is only a facsimile of game situations and less instructive than actual games.

After 8 games, they should have great data from actual game situations and it is probably refining those preseason evals.

Also, if I were a coach, I would never make our actual analytics public. I would only publicize GIGO (we average 1.2 points per possession by hoisting under handed set shots from mid court; surprisingly, the analytics show that we get more points per possession from missed 3s than made 3s so our best three point shooters are our worst 3 point shooters).

 

[RetroVol]

The analytics discussed in Cora's article were based on practice play which is only a facsimile of game situations and less instructive than actual games.

After 8 games, they should have great data from actual game situations and it is probably refining those preseason evals.

That's not how I read the article. I read it as saying they added practice analytics to data from games last year, apparently including going back and generating some for the transfers and 1st year players. Not sure how, and I assume those were interpreted in light of the staff's understanding of the differences in how those teams played from the style of the LVs, though maybe that doesn't mean that much when you're just talking about shots.

And, yes, I assume they are updating constantly with game data, and I would hope comparing to practice when that is still possible. The goal is to perform in games the way you practice. Practice makes permanent. The odds a player or a team is going to improve their performance in a game by deviating from what they practiced is slim to none. That applies to shot mechanics, shot selection, play execution, situational responses, and likely others I'm not thinking of. But ingrained patterns can be hard to re-pattern. However, with awareness and effort, such as Deniya realizing she is better when she goes strong to the rim rather than fading from contact, players and teams can develop and grow. Which, of course, is a really fun thing to watch as a fan!

Also, I wonder if the green and red on individual reports is replacing or supplemental to the white board? Has Kim broken the white board out yet?

GBO!

 

[madtownvol]

In all seriousness, I wonder when we will start seeing stories about how some coaching staff is "revolutionizing" the game by using AI to optimize performance?

Human-generated analytics is so 2020....

 

[Golfteacher]

Rank # games played 3 pointers %
1 LSU 8 3-pointers 44.36%
5 Missouri 9 3 pointers 40.43%
26 South Carolina 8 3-pointers 37.74%
27 Alabama 8 3-pointers 37.72
33 Vanderbilt 8 3-pointers 36.79
35 Texas 8 3-pointers 36.73%
41 Arkansas 9 3-pointers 36.32%
43 Georgia 9 3-pointers 36.31%
46 Mississippi state 8 3-pointers 36.15%
114 Oklahoma 8 3-pointers 32.63%
119 Kentucky 9 3-pointers 32.32%
186 Old Miss 7 3-pointers 30.26%
205 Auburn 9 3-pointers 29.53%
208 Tennessee 7 3-pointers 29.41%
226 Texas A&M 6 3-pointers 28.81%
309 Florida 9 3-pointers 25.61%
Last update Wednesday December 03 6:12 am
Games through December 02 Tuesday

At this moment, the Lady Vols are struggling with their shot selection. Too often, they appear rushed and resort to haphazardly launching attempts at the basket. Effective shooting, much like every aspect of basketball, requires a combination of mental acuity and proper technique. It's essential to discern the optimal moments for taking specific shots. Many opposing teams are opting for zone defenses or strategically positioning themselves to thwart our long-range attempts. We must learn to capitalize on the opportunities presented by our adversaries. The current strategy of simply outshooting our opponents is proving ineffective against formidable power five teams.

Additionally, we frequently find ourselves trapped beneath the basket with two or three defenders looming nearby. Instead of making the wise decision to pass the ball out, we often attempt ill-conceived shots that compromise our offensive efficiency. It is crucial that we adopt a more structured approach to shot selection and exhibit greater discipline in our offensive plays. Defensively, we must enhance our protection of the paint and maintain vigilance regarding the positioning of our opponents' perimeter shooters.

 

[chuckiepoo]

In all seriousness, I wonder when we will start seeing stories about how some coaching staff is "revolutionizing" the game by using AI to optimize performance?

Human-generated analytics is so 2020....

Moneyball is the easy answer as to when it all started. The book and movie pushed that view. It has since gotten complicated…

CHANGING THE GAME: The Rise of Sports Analytics

Winning in team sports has always been a function of superior ownership, front offices and coaching. Decision making as which players to draft, trade, develop, coach and which system to play have traditionally been made by a "gut" feeling or adherence to past traditions. But then came Oakland...

www.forbes.com

I remember in high school we had a receivers coach (nerd but one of my favorites) that did “the numbers”. Down and distance, formations, and personnel were addressed. The staff referred to them as “the tendancies”. That was back in the late seventies, using fortran and a card reader…

 

[chuckiepoo]

At this moment, the Lady Vols are struggling with their shot selection. Too often, they appear rushed and resort to haphazardly launching attempts at the basket. Effective shooting, much like every aspect of basketball, requires a combination of mental acuity and proper technique. It's essential to discern the optimal moments for taking specific shots. Many opposing teams are opting for zone defenses or strategically positioning themselves to thwart our long-range attempts. We must learn to capitalize on the opportunities presented by our adversaries. The current strategy of simply outshooting our opponents is proving ineffective against formidable power five teams.

Additionally, we frequently find ourselves trapped beneath the basket with two or three defenders looming nearby. Instead of making the wise decision to pass the ball out, we often attempt ill-conceived shots that compromise our offensive efficiency. It is crucial that we adopt a more structured approach to shot selection and exhibit greater discipline in our offensive plays. Defensively, we must enhance our protection of the paint and maintain vigilance regarding the positioning of our opponents' perimeter shooters.

Eloquent.

I see alot of “sticky” where rather than pass and generate motion off ball, we spend way too much time on the perimeter dribbling. Nothing is sweeter than seeing the ball swing three or four quick passes for a bucket, be it at the arc or inside. It seems we are assist averse

 

[1morevol]

The analytics discussed in Cora's article were based on practice play which is only a facsimile of game situations and less instructive than actual games.

After 8 games, they should have great data from actual game situations and it is probably refining those preseason evals.

Also, if I were a coach, I would never make our actual analytics public. I would only publicize GIGO (we average 1.2 points per possession by hoisting under handed set shots from mid court; surprisingly, the analytics show that we get more points per possession from missed 3s than made 3s so our best three point shooters are our worst 3 point shooters).

Why is my inner voice whispering, "Allen Iverson"?

 

[chuckiepoo]

Why is my inner voice whispering, "Allen Iverson"?

 

[RetroVol]

Too often, they appear rushed and resort to haphazardly launching attempts at the basket.

I wonder if that tendency is part of what Coach Kim was referring to when she said before the season that she was having to slow this team down?

Additionally, we frequently find ourselves trapped beneath the basket with two or three defenders looming nearby.

There were times late in the Stanford game when Talaysia drove and it looked like all five Stanford players were converging on her. She looked for the pass out to the perimeter, but sometimes got swarmed. Not sure if she waited too long or if others weren't positioned properly, but it looked like steps in the right direction. If they keep making steps...

 

[1morevol]

To date, the LVs have made 153 of 294 two point shots, a 52% rate. That would equate to 104 points per 100 shots.
So far, they have made 75 of 264 three point shots, a 28.4% rate that equates to 85.2 points per 100 shots.
It appears to me the team would have to raise the 3 point rate to 34.6% to equal (3 X 34.6 = 103.8) the value of a 2 point shot at the current make rate.
That doesn't take into account the extra point gained by a made foul shot on an in the act of shooting foul. I'm thinking act of shooting fouls happen more frequently on 2 point shots. As the 3pt percentage improves (hopefully) will the 2pt percentage remain the same, get even better or dip? Just my thoughts.

 

[chuckiepoo]

To date, the LVs have made 153 of 214 two point shots, a 55.8% rate.

I got 153 of 558 = 52.0%, as of 12/3/25.

3’s checks out.

Imo, take the ball to the hoop. It’s a great way to finish a possession or game!

 

[1morevol]

I got 153 of 558 = 52.0%, as of 12/3/25.

3’s checks out.

Imo, take the ball to the hoop. It’s a great way to finish a possession or game!

You are correct. 153/294 on 2s is 52%. Thanks, @chuckiepoo. I corrected the figures.

 

[RetroVol]

I love that Kim seeks out help, even late career Pat did that.

Absolutely. Not only very much like Pat, but post of being a great leader. As is what seems to be her willingness to trust her staff with significant responsibilities.

 

[RetroVol]

Fairly simple that no matter which player is shooting them or what they did in high school or elsewhere that 34 percent is the number that makes the 3 point shot equal to the two point shot if you are averaging 52 percent.

Yes, if you are only looking at the results of shot attempts rather than possessions. And I felt admit the article I cited seems, from what we can tell, to be talking about individual shots for individual players, although in not 100% sure of that.

But, from a what helps the team win standpoint, it may be different. For example, if the team rebounds 40% of 3pa but only 15% of 2pa, then the analysis changes. Plus there's the effect on pace of the game if you run a lot of clock on a lot of possession trying to get a shot at the rim. Plus turnovers on entry passes. And maybe other things. It gets complicated. Moneyball was not obvious. That's why it was powerful.

All that said, the most exciting thing is that this seems to be helping our players get better. I just love that. The boost for Talaysia I is so cool given how good she already was!

 

[chuckiepoo]

You are correct. 153/294 on 2s is 52%. Thanks, @chuckiepoo. I corrected the figures.

I kinda trying to watch volume also, especially on FTs. Anyone spending Mashack hours at the gym?

 

[lvocd]

He was just a whipping boy for everything folks didn't like about Kellie.

For some of us, it was about what we don’t like about patriarchal society. The fact that it’s only ever women’s coaches whose husbands are on staff, and largely men, like you, who see absolutely nothing wrong with that disparity, is exactly why I never liked it. It had ZERO to do with Jon personally or professionally, and everything to do with how it always falls on female coaches to make sacrifices and concessions in the interest of “making family life easier,” and that, OF COURSE, men like you think that is their responsibility as females. Why are there no husband-wife coaching tandems in the men’s game? Not even one. Ever, as far as I know, and men are not even remotely bothered by that.

 

[glv98]

At this moment, the Lady Vols are struggling with their shot selection.

Which is kind of incredible given the amount of time and effort given to the analytics of shot selection we’ve just been told about.

There’s been a disconnect all season between the coaching staffs’ stated offensive goals and plans and the product that ends up on the floor. Coming up with a plan is easy, implementing it is hard.