The ways I sees it...

[imbubbaspitcup]

The writing is on the wall... we've been down this road with Dooley. How soon do people forget.

We have so underachieved this year it's ridiculous.

We go on a streak of beating the league’s worst teams and now people are screaming for a extension and raise for this guy.

We have 2 players on the all SEC team, 1 on the all SEC defense team and we're soundly on the bubble.

I think we can all agree things look bad for next year... and I wonder why? Maybe we land the 5* big man who ended up signing with UCLA late last year if we would have made the NCAA's last year. Instead we sucked it up until a late push at the end of the season and found ourselves on the outside looking in for the second year in a row. Next year’s suck is on Counzo yet people will probably give him a pass. Think about it... our team is stacked this year and we're likely going to barely make the tourney. I don't care about his 20 wins a year... what matters is NCAA tournament wins... who many of those does he have????

So do you want our Vols to make the tournament or not?

 

[Manvol]

Particularly if we still get into the tournament despite a loss today

I just don't think the administration has the minerals to pull the plug on him. He's not bad. he's not great. He's just ok. Being ok is ok for this administration. They won't make changes this year either way. GoVols just win.

 

[UTBasketball2]

Why are we cursed with this fan base?

 

[calban]

He didn't say anything that isn't true. You need some perspective IMO.

He said things could be worse and that the next coach probably wouldn't average 20 wins per season. The youthful populous of our fanbase was spoiled by the Pearl years. Many have suffered through much worse than what we've seen over the past three seasons.

He said (and I said it preseason myself) that our team was a little overrated by our fanbase with respect to the perception of our team from a national standpoint. There were some crazy Elite 8 expectations by some around here in September. Even Sweet 16 demands for a team and a coach that hasn't even tasted the tournament in three years was a lofty, yet attainable goal. And it still is.

What he didn't say, is that we should accept mediocrity. That is an example of you putting words into his mouth. Things have been, and could be much worse. Ask Auburn. Ask Vandy. Ask South Carolina.

I'm not carrying water for Cuonzo, so please don't confuse this as such, but I think you probably fall into that demographic that was spoiled by the Pearl years. I was spoiled by the 90's football teams that "disappointed" me with 11-2 records.

Just enjoy the fact that we still have a shot to make some noise, even if we didn't meet your expectations. We were likely ranked a top 30-40 team preseason, and lo and behold, that's about where we've landed, even if it were in unspectacular fashion. A time will come for judgement with CCM, and he'll likely be judged on what he does in the next couple weeks.

One of the interesting things about this particular sport is the many roads taken by teams to reach a goal;
the goal being to have your team playing their best ball in March.
Martin has done that and has the pieces to start the NEW season.
I'm going to sit back and enjoy the next 3 games.
Got a feelin.

 

[UT's#1Fan]

So do you want our Vols to make the tournament or not?

If only the answer to your loaded question was as simple as yes or no... sorry it's not. I know your angle... too predictable.

Yes, I want the vols in the tournament despite the negative implications their success will bring on just like a want to eat a nice pepperoni and sausage pizza from snappy tomato despite my knowledge that it is bad for my health. I could never logically justify that eating the pizza makes sense for my long term health, but I do it anyways. Same with the Vols... no one can make a logical argument that Counzo has earned his paycheck and deserves to coach another year at UT, however, for the kids sake, I want the kids to do well and thus we have a conundrum.

 

[RollerVol]

We're in a win/win situation...

• Win and we are likely for sure in the NCAA with a chance to send the gators home early and further bolster our NCAA resume. This scenario helps build Conzos coaching resume and hopefully Purdue comes ah-call'n.
• Lose and Conzo likely gets the boot and we can go after a coach that shall remain unnamed as to avoid the thread being merged with another thread that shall also remain unnamed.

You see, if Arky would have beat USCe, and if we'da lost to them, it would have been somewhat justifiable to the Conzoites. Now, we're set up pretty nice and a loss would be inexusable.

Wertcha thank?

Well, I guess so, since you put it that way. Would rather have seen us play Arky though. Arky had a much better RPI, but...on with the show.:unsure:
GO VOLS!

 

[SlyStone]

I think three things...
1. The next school CCM coaches at will be one with a better basketball tradition than UT.

2. That UT fans should be careful what they wish for, because there's an excellent chance that the next coach won't win 60 games in his first three seasons here.

3. That UT fans who are disappointed with CCMs performance this year did that to themselves, by creating expectations in their own heads about how good this team would be (when no one in the national media had us ranked preseason, that says something), by pumping sunshine, then choosing to believe it, and then getting turned off when the team performed almost exactly like the experts outside the Vol Bubble said they would.

Heck, let's make it four things:
4. There is a 100% chance that Bruce Pearl will never coach here again.

Well said.

 

[Majorvol23]

the ways I sees it is ... I hope we win the whole damn thing ... an SEC tourney championship would feel pretty good

 

[ShowSomePride]

If only the answer to your loaded question was as simple as yes or no... sorry it's not. I know your angle... too predictable.

Yes, I want the vols in the tournament despite the negative implications their success will bring on just like a want to eat a nice pepperoni and sausage pizza from snappy tomato despite my knowledge that it is bad for my health. I could never logically justify that eating the pizza makes sense for my long term health, but I do it anyways. Same with the Vols... no one can make a logical argument that Counzo has earned his paycheck and deserves to coach another year at UT, however, for the kids sake, I want the kids to do well and thus we have a conundrum.

3, 20+ win seasons with a (more than likely) tourney birth his 3rd season. 2 5* recruits in 3 seasons. His development of Stokes and Richardson has been great. Runs an extremely clean program. Appears to be getting better each season. Just playing devil's advocate.

 

[cncchris33]

Just thought it was our year. Yeah I had my expectations high...but who wouldn't had with 2 first team all sec players? That's the thing. We have two of the best players in the SEC and yet we lose 7 games in the weakest the SEC has been in years. I'm not going to apologize for wanting more. Yeah it could be worse, but guess what it could be better too. Martin didn't even seem like he wanted to be here until the fanbase and national media started putting a little pressure on him. That's my only problem. At worst we should be 23--8 14-4 because we should have swept TAMU and Vandy. If you don't think that's realistic then idk what to tell you...

Where did I say that wasn't realistic? I'm disappointed too. I thought our talent was better than our record indicates.

We didn't play as a team at times (which falls as much on the shoulders of those two 1st-team all-SEC players), and we struggled to find ourselves at PG.

The PG question was a major issue before the season, and a lot of people (myself included to an extent) wanted to gloss it over because we had a senior transfer. He struggled with the transition, and our gameplan didn't highlight his skills. We seem to have figured that part out now, even if it did take 28 games.

There have been inexcusable losses, and no one will argue otherwise. Our record should look different. I just never have thought this team was ever quite as flawless as many people seem to have believed.

 

[Vawlz]

Wertcha thank?

I think that a UT "fan" who advocates for the Vols to lose based solely on his failed preseason hopes needs to seriously reassess his fandom.

EDIT: I'm neutral about CCM, but these players deserve to go out on a high note after going through some rough times.

 

[gnm53108]

the ways I sees it is ... I hope we win the whole damn thing ... an SEC tourney championship would feel pretty good

With ya Major.

 

[calban]

If only the answer to your loaded question was as simple as yes or no... sorry it's not. I know your angle... too predictable.

Yes, I want the vols in the tournament despite the negative implications their success will bring on just like a want to eat a nice pepperoni and sausage pizza from snappy tomato despite my knowledge that it is bad for my health. I could never logically justify that eating the pizza makes sense for my long term health, but I do it anyways. Same with the Vols,... no one can make a logical argument that Counzo has earned his paycheck and deserves to coach another year at UT, however, for the kids sake, I want the kids to do well and thus we have a conundrum.

For logical argument's sake, if he wins the SECT and gets a 3-5 seed in the NCAA, has he earned his check?

 

[UT's#1Fan]

I think that a UT "fan" who advocates for the Vols to lose needs to seriously reassess his fandom.

EDIT: I'm neutral about CCM, but these players deserve to go out on a high note.

I don't think that word means what you think it means. :hi:

 

[UT's#1Fan]

For logical argument's sake, if he wins the SECT and gets a 3-5 seed in the NCAA, has he earned his check?

I'd say if they make the SEC title game and then make it to the Sweet 16 of the NCAA's, he did just that, earned his paycheck... based on the talent level this team has, he shouldn't get an attaboy for meeting expectations.

Now if he takes this team past the sweet 16, that would be something special and would warrant commendation.

 

[cncchris33]

One of the interesting things about this particular sport is the many roads taken by teams to reach a goal;
the goal being to have your team playing their best ball in March.
Martin has done that and has the pieces to start the NEW season.
I'm going to sit back and enjoy the next 3 games.
Got a feelin.

I agree. I wonder what UCONN'S fans thought in 2011, when they won the tourney with 9 losses? Arizona fans when they won in 1997 with 9 losses? Kansas in 1988 with 11 losses? Villanova in 1985 with 10 losses? NCSU in 1983 with 10 losses? Indiana in 1981 with 9 losses?

Basketball is a tournament sport, which in some ways, devalues the effect of losses during the regular season in hindsight. At the time, many are frustrating and inexplicable, but as you said, the goal is to be playing your best basketball in March, and I think we are doing that.

Enjoy the twilight of this season while we still have a chance, and judge the performance later.

 

[Vawlz]

I don't think that word means what you think it means. :hi:

Based on your other posts in this thread (read: you really don't like CCM) it's not difficult to discern that you're implicitly advocating a UT loss simply to get rid of CCM.

Again, I'm neutral about CCM, but I'd never consider a UT loss a "win" situation. :hi:

 

[cncchris33]

I don't think that word means what I think it means. :hi:

Fixed

 

[zydane47]

3, 20+ win seasons with a (more than likely) tourney birth his 3rd season. 2 5* recruits in 3 seasons. His development of Stokes and Richardson has been great. Runs an extremely clean program. Appears to be getting better each season. Just playing devil's advocate.

The whole three 20+ win seasons is not a valid argument, I could've ran my dog out there and won 20+ games against the SEC the past three years. Plus the fact his first year he went 19-15 goes against that.

This isn't exactly the toughest SEC has been in three years. The fact is, he should win 20+ games, there was enough talent left from Pearl to do that. He should've been able to make the Tourney the past two years and not be hanging around on the bubble in his third year.

Getting bounced out of the NIT isn't exactly stellar coaching, IF we make the NCAA tourney, he will most likely get out coached in the first round.

I'd like to see the kids make the dance and do well, but sadly they have a coach who will hinder that. The past few games have been great, but you can't ignore the rest of the season, or the past two years.

Unless he makes a deep run in the tourney, I say we cut our losses and move on.

Edit* Also we only won 20 games last year. So he hasn't won over 20+, 20 seems to be his ceiling

 

[GAVol]

I don't think that word means what you think it means. :hi:

Looked like pretty solid usage to me.

 

[calban]

I'd say if they make the SEC title game and then make it to the Sweet 16 of the NCAA's, he did just that, earned his paycheck... based on the talent level this team has, he shouldn't get an attaboy for meeting expectations.

Now if he takes this team past the sweet 16, that would be something special and would warrant commendation.

Not sure your expectations for a 1.6 mil coach are warranted, since we're talking about earnings.
Maybe your expectations are a little biased by the most likely unrepeatable DREAM run of the former.

 

[RileyThaBasedGod]

I'd say if they make the SEC title game and then make it to the Sweet 16 of the NCAA's, he did just that, earned his paycheck... based on the talent level this team has, he shouldn't get an attaboy for meeting expectations.

Now if he takes this team past the sweet 16, that would be something special and would warrant commendation.

If Zo takes these boys to the SEC ship and then the sweet 16 then he def deserve a raise and a extension cause man we jus aint in the top 2 most talented teams in the SEC and we aint in the top 16 teams talent wise in the nation. We jus aint as talented as we thought we was gonna be. To think that we are is jus makin excuses so we can ditch Zo an get Bruce back in. Not to mention Bruce Almighty was only able to get us to the SEC ship and pas the sweet 16 once and we was all about feedin him money and extensions before he ever did that. Take those Bruce colored galsses off bruh and enjoy these vols. March is the best month especially when our boys are in. I dont know why anyone would wish anything different

 

[VolsSportsFan]

I don't think that word means what you think it means. :hi:

I think you need to get a dictionary. And change your name.

 

[orangeluvr]

The ways I sees it….ain't no use in cry in' over spilt milk ! Move on and make some new history,we haven't won the tourney in what, over 30 years (?).

 

[Rudy123]

3, 20+ win seasons with a (more than likely) tourney birth his 3rd season. 2 5* recruits in 3 seasons. His development of Stokes and Richardson has been great. Runs an extremely clean program. Appears to be getting better each season. Just playing devil's advocate.

Playing Angel's advocate! Realistically, we won't get a much better hire than Martin, at this point.

However; look at the games that we lost that we should have won. M.T.S.U., College of Charleston, U.T.E.P., Georgetown, Austin Peay, Close games that we lost: UGA, Memphis, Bama, Xavier.

Getting bumped out of the N.I.T. so soon is not good.....