The Vatican set to embrace Evolution

#51
#51
Sabanocchio said:
I'm sorry you got your feelings hurt. Should I issue a public apology? Would that make you feel better?
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my feelings aren't hurt. This is why I'm here. I enjoy it and learn one helluva lot. I actually learned quite a bit about gravitation theory because of the conversation with rjd. As an engineer, I couldn't stand not knowing, so I checked out a couple books and did my homework.
 
#53
#53
Sabanocchio said:
Then stop whining about it. I saw the quote. I edited my post. Move on.
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I'm not whining. I was pointing out that you were clueless while you were in the midst of calling me clueless. I was right, you weren't. I assure you that I'm positively fine with it, especially since you invalidated everything you might say from the very get go. That's perfect for me and makes it more fun.
 
#54
#54
BigPapaVol said:
I'm not whining. I was pointing out that you were clueless while you were in the midst of calling me clueless. I was right, you weren't. I assure you that I'm positively fine with it, especially since you invalidated everything you might say from the very get go. That's perfect for me and makes it more fun.
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Like I said, my validation by you is the furthest thing from importance to me. I've seen enough discussions involving you on this board to feel perfectly comfortable regardless of your opinion.
 
#55
#55
Sabanocchio said:
Like I said, my validation by you is the furthest thing from importance to me. I've seen enough discussions involving you on this board to feel perfectly comfortable regardless of your opinion.
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not me. I'm very upset that you might not approve of what I have to say or that you, having been right twice that I can ever recall, might think me wrong.

Maybe I can find a good sleep aid.
 
#56
#56
BigPapaVol said:
Tell me what part of evolutionary theory, either micro or macro that I don't get
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When you attack it with crap like this, multiple times no less......

you still have the enormous problem of organic matter forming from the inorganic. I know you believe there is a simple answer here about life forming in electrically charged puddles, but it's lame as can be.

Spontaneous life is simply a problem that can't be explained or assumed away. From there to a brain with a conscience is simply impossible.
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...it tells me you have zero understanding of what the theory actually says or what it's foundation is.


BigPapaVol said:
You have yet to support your silly point that evolution is the basis of medicine and dentistry. Make that happen and I'll concede.

In fact, I just got off the phone with one of my golf partners who happens to be an MD and he told me you're absolutely lost.
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Biology is the first class you take to becoming a medical professional. And the first thing you learn is evolutionary theory. The fact that you can't understand that is your problem.

And a friend of mine, who is fresh out of an MD/PhD dual program at UAB thinks you and your friend are full of it.
 
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#57
#57
rjd970 said:
When you attack it with crap like this, multiple times no less......



...it tells me you have zero understanding of what the thoery actually says or what it's foundation is.




Biology is the first class you take to becoming a medical professional. And the first thing you learn is evolutionary theory. The fact that you can't understand that is your problem.

And a friend of mine, who is fresh out of an MD/PhD dual program at UAB thinks you and your friend are full of it.
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pretending that evolution is part and parcel to bio is ridiculous. Evolution is but a tertiary piece of bio and certainly not the basis for what docs know or do. It is funny that the tone has changed from Evolution the cornerstone to evolution is at the beginning of biology. That similar to calling understanding the definition of a hydrocarbon the basis of all medicine, dentistry and medical breakthroughs. I understand that's at the front of all OrgoChem courses as well, so maybe it is.

Again, we interchange a lot of things around here regularly and typically the evolution debate is about our origins, not actual micro or macro evolution. I assure you that I get the theory, in that it just isn't very complicated and isn't particularly well understood in the mechanical sense.

Your doc friend is a moron if he's telling you evolution is the basis of his medical education or even more silly, that evolution is the basis for all advances in modern medicine.
 
#58
#58
BigPapaVol said:
pretending that evolution is part and parcel to bio is ridiculous. Evolution is but a tertiary piece of bio and certainly not the basis for what docs know or do. It is funny that the tone has changed from Evolution the cornerstone to evolution is at the beginning of biology. That similar to calling understanding the definition of a hydrocarbon the basis of all medicine, dentistry and medical breakthroughs. I understand that's at the front of all OrgoChem courses as well, so maybe it is.

Again, we interchange a lot of things around here regularly and typically the evolution debate is about our origins, not actual micro or macro evolution. I assure you that I get the theory, in that it just isn't very complicated and isn't particularly well understood in the mechanical sense.

Your doc friend is a moron if he's telling you evolution is the basis of his medical education or even more silly, that evolution is the basis for all advances in modern medicine.
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My story hasn't changed. It is the first thing you learn, and therefore the basis of the science.

And I will take my friend's word on his own education over yours, being he actually went through it.

I think you look like a moron calling him a moron.

If I get warned for saying that, then so be it. It is what it is.
 
#59
#59
rjd970 said:
My story hasn't changed. It is the first thing you learn, and therefore the basis of the science.

And I will take my friend's word on his own education over yours, being he actually went through it.

I think you look like a moron calling him a moron.

If I get warned for saying that, then so be it. It is what it is.
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Regardless of your friend saying what you want to hear, I'll be happy to link you up with a couple of real MD's, who teach others, if you'd like some insight.
 
#60
#60
rjd970 said:
Biology is the first class you take to becoming a medical professional. And the first thing you learn is evolutionary theory. The fact that you can't understand that is your problem.
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Really? When I took my two semesters of college-level biology (the "for majors" version) the first thing I got was some generic lesson on "What is biology?" Then, I got a basic chemistry review. Then, I started learning about the differents parts of cells. I don't think word "evolution" was even mentioned until 2nd semester.
 
#61
#61
Chemvol said:
Really? When I took my two semesters of college-level biology (the "for majors" version) the first thing I got was some generic lesson on "What is biology?" Then, I got a basic chemistry review. Then, I started learning about the differents parts of cells. I don't think word "evolution" was even mentioned until 2nd semester.
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and that's how it worked for me, but I was in the non-majors section. It was simply a core course for me, along with Chem and OrgoChem.
 
#62
#62
Chemvol said:
Really? When I took my two semesters of college-level biology (the "for majors" version) the first thing I got was some generic lesson on "What is biology?" Then, I got a basic chemistry review. Then, I started learning about the differents parts of cells. I don't think word "evolution" was even mentioned until 2nd semester.
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I took the class "for majors" and evolution basics was covered in the first semester, and extensively in the second. We used the same book both semesters, and the vast majority of the book was focused on evolution and its implications to the specific topic we covered in each chapter.
 
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#63
#63
My friend suggests that your friends should get together and have a death match to settle the whole thing.

Man, I need to start hanging with smarter people...
 
#65
#65
rjd970 said:
I took the class "for majors" and evolution basics was covered in the first semester, and extensively in the second. We used the same book both semesters, and the vast majority of the book was focused on evolution and its implications to the specific topic we covered in each chapter.
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Methinks the author of your text has research interests in evolutionary biology. You can cover a lot of ground in biology without doing it in the context of evolution. Just an observation.
 
#68
#68
Chemvol said:
Methinks the author of your text has research interests in evolutionary biology. You can cover a lot of ground in biology without doing it in the context of evolution. Just an observation.
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I think this is a good point. The brief look into the issue I did showed strong proponents and others who basically said it was pretty much irrelevant to modern medical curricula.

We can take this further back and say that Reading, Riting and Rithmetic are the basics of the Theory of Evolution - don't see how Darwin could have created and tested his ideas without the 3 Rs.
 
#69
#69
The Vatican is embracing evolution as a viable option on the origin of life on earth and you guys are arguing over the influence of evolution on medicine. Not the path I expected this topic to go down....
 
#70
#70
Sabanocchio said:
The Vatican is embracing evolution as a viable option on the origin of life on earth and you guys are arguing over the influence of evolution on medicine. Not the path I expected this topic to go down....
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We had a mutation and the thread evolved
 
#72
#72
volinbham said:
I think this is a good point. The brief look into the issue I did showed strong proponents and others who basically said it was pretty much irrelevant to modern medical curricula.

We can take this further back and say that Reading, Riting and Rithmetic are the basics of the Theory of Evolution - don't see how Darwin could have created and tested his ideas without the 3 Rs.
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I see what your saying. But I am not talking about taking it back that far. I would equate it with addition and subtraction providing a foundation for high order mathematics. Does calculus have a more direct impact than addition and subtraction on learning something like differential equations? Sure. But simple math provides the needed foundation to grow from. That is all I am saying, and everybody jumps on me like it is a stupid statement.

You don't get to that point without establishing a foundation. Evolutionary biology, as taught to first year biology students, provides that basis. Plain and simple.
 
#74
#74
Sabanocchio said:
The Vatican is embracing evolution as a viable option on the origin of life on earth and you guys are arguing over the influence of evolution on medicine. Not the path I expected this topic to go down....
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I don't think this true at all. At best it says they are embracing evolution as the vehicle for the diversity we see in the flora and fauna today. As has been pointed out evolution has nothing to do with the origins of life, just the origin of species if I understand correctly.
 
#75
#75
KB5252 said:
I don't think this true at all. At best it says they are embracing evolution as the vehicle for the diversity we see in the flora and fauna today. As has been pointed out evolution has nothing to do with the origins of life, just the origin of species if I understand correctly.
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Evolution is not about ultimate origins. It is an explanation of how diverse groups of organisms can have so many common elements, both at the organism level and at the cellular and molecular levels.
 
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