The Unheralded 9 from 2011

#26
#26
1. Alan Carson - Talk about a diamond. Has only played football for a few years. Very raw, but huge upside.
2. Tino Thomas - very athletic, not sure what position he projects at best at next level. In state talent.
3. Devin Young - size and competition hurt his recruitment - UT coaches saw him in person a few times and feel he brings enough to contribute immediately on special teams and will even play some out in space on offense.
4. T. Saulsberry - an absolute steal - Florida came in late. Offers weren't there because everything thinks that if Florida does offer then why bother. Wrong. He and J. Williams are going to be studs.
5. Tom Smith - another steal. Florida had a ton of running back prospects and Smith split carries on his own team so he wasn't looked at as hard by other schools. He runs very hard and is very strong. He could be very good. One of my favorite recruits and he shut down his recruitment after verbaling to UT.
6. Christian Harris - great size, but competition was weak. And as far as other Ga. LBs go he was on the bottom of the list - but he earned some post season honors and projected well in the AJC's top 50. He is a diamond find that the coaches fell in love with when they saw him play. He also shut down his recruitment after committing.
7. Mack Crowder - as smart as they come, but played against awful competition and didn't get evaluated at any other position other than Center. He projects well, but will benefit from being a backup for a year or two. Also instate.
8. Brendan Downs - depth at a position of need. He is truly underrated as TE because of competition. He has great athletic ability, good size and good hands. Not an all world player, but could be good.
9. G. Orta - very talented, but got left behind because he was committed to Clemson for so long. Has a great deal of upside and getting him to switch to UT was a coup for the coaches.
 
#27
#27
thomaseusin said:
1. Alan Carson - Need more big bodies at DT
2. Tino Thomas - Depth in DB
3. Devin Young - Needed help in Special Teams
4. T. Saulsberry - Diamond in rival's backyard
5. Tom Smith - North South RB
6. Christian Harris - Needed size at LB
7. Mack Crowder - Needed more depth at C
8. Brendan Downs - Needed TE's for dual TE sets
9. G. Orta - Needed help at DB
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That about sums its up.
Nuff' said
:loco:
 
#28
#28
UTVOL02 said:
There's no way of knowing that until they get on the field and play. All the guys you listed could end up being 2-3 year starters at UT and all-americans. Or they could end up being busts, just like the other 19 guys you didn't list from the 2011 class could be.
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I totally understand this and feel what you're saying. But you would probably be saying the same thing if Dooley would have offered me. --And I am a bust. There has to be some way of us figuring out who the good recruits are. And these 9 do not have offers from the elite schools like our other recruits do.
 
#30
#30
sjt18 said:
Downs is physically similar coming out of HS to the last several "great" TE's UT had- Stocker, Cottam, Witten. He will probably play earlier than he should out of necessity.

Crowder was pursued by Meyer. As was Smith.

Some of these guys are just players DD and staff believe in. If those guys along with Martaze Jackson, Crump, Propst, et al become good players then both opposing coaches and the recruiting svcs will take a longer look at who UT recruits.

You have to realize that much of what raises a player's image is that someone who has an established eye for talent has offered. If DD shows that then he'll become the Pied Piper.
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Good take. I like it.
 
#31
#31
sjt18 said:
Downs is physically similar coming out of HS to the last several "great" TE's UT had- Stocker, Cottam, Witten. He will probably play earlier than he should out of necessity.

Crowder was pursued by Meyer. As was Smith.

Some of these guys are just players DD and staff believe in. If those guys along with Martaze Jackson, Crump, Propst, et al become good players then both opposing coaches and the recruiting svcs will take a longer look at who UT recruits.

You have to realize that much of what raises a player's image is that someone who has an established eye for talent has offered. If DD shows that then he'll become the Pied Piper.
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I heard on TOS that Downs came in around 235 lbs(rivals listed him 220) and is up to 245/250 range now. He very well might see the field early.
 
#32
#32
SpringBokVol said:
1. Alan Carson - Talk about a diamond. Has only played football for a few years. Very raw, but huge upside.
2. Tino Thomas - very athletic, not sure what position he projects at best at next level. In state talent.
3. Devin Young - size and competition hurt his recruitment - UT coaches saw him in person a few times and feel he brings enough to contribute immediately on special teams and will even play some out in space on offense.
4. T. Saulsberry - an absolute steal - Florida came in late. Offers weren't there because everything thinks that if Florida does offer then why bother. Wrong. He and J. Williams are going to be studs.
5. Tom Smith - another steal. Florida had a ton of running back prospects and Smith split carries on his own team so he wasn't looked at as hard by other schools. He runs very hard and is very strong. He could be very good. One of my favorite recruits and he shut down his recruitment after verbaling to UT.
6. Christian Harris - great size, but competition was weak. And as far as other Ga. LBs go he was on the bottom of the list - but he earned some post season honors and projected well in the AJC's top 50. He is a diamond find that the coaches fell in love with when they saw him play. He also shut down his recruitment after committing.
7. Mack Crowder - as smart as they come, but played against awful competition and didn't get evaluated at any other position other than Center. He projects well, but will benefit from being a backup for a year or two. Also instate.
8. Brendan Downs - depth at a position of need. He is truly underrated as TE because of competition. He has great athletic ability, good size and good hands. Not an all world player, but could be good.
9. G. Orta - very talented, but got left behind because he was committed to Clemson for so long. Has a great deal of upside and getting him to switch to UT was a coup for the coaches.
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Of everyone so far, you are the most glowing on this group.
Do you feel like our overall class is underrated by the recruiting services?
 
#35
#35
WesternKyVol said:
I totally understand this and feel what you're saying. But you would probably be saying the same thing if Dooley would have offered me. --And I am a bust. There has to be some way of us figuring out who the good recruits are. And these 9 do not have offers from the elite schools like our other recruits do.
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There is. They enroll in school, work out, put on pads and hit someone. They play in practices, scrimmages and ultimately the games in the fall. Sure, you can put more stock in higher rated prospects to pan out in the end but until they actually get on the field, there's really no 100% foolproof way to determine who the "good recruits" are, as you say. The good recruits are the ones who perform well on the field in the fall. JMO
 
#36
#36
WesternKyVol said:
Of everyone so far, you are the most glowing on this group.
Do you feel like our overall class is underrated by the recruiting services?
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Absolutely. I think this class is one of the best classes UT has signed in quite some time.

I don't care what the rankings are or what the services say about it, I care about putting productive players that fit your system out on the field. Players that will buy in, execute as directed, get coached up and compete for championships.

This class fills needs, provides depth, and sprinkles in some needed speed and size. You can win with classes like this, it just takes tremendous effort and coaching. Which, I think UT has.

Sure some of these players may bust or not produce as expected, but I think they are the minority. The coaches did a great job of taking players who could contribute early and fit in with last years class. When that class are seniors that talent level should be all the way up for UT.
 
#37
#37
UTVOL02 said:
There is. They enroll in school, work out, put on pads and hit someone. They play in practices, scrimmages and ultimately the games in the fall. Sure, you can put more stock in higher rated prospects to pan out in the end but until they actually get on the field, there's really no 100% foolproof way to determine who the "good recruits" are, as you say. The good recruits are the ones who perform well on the field in the fall. JMO
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Somehow I knew you would make that point so I already thought out my reply: If that were the only way to evaluate talent, then success in college football would be completely random. As it is, certain schools dominate. The science may not be exact, but we have an idea going in of who can play and who can't.
 
#38
#38
Offer lists alone aren't the best measure of a player's potential. Schools have different player needs and extend offers for each position of need accordingly. For example if a team is only taking one running back they are not going to offer the top 20 running backs in a class. Other times players get recruited regionally for whatever reason. Other times these 17-18 year olds develop physically and mentally in college. I could go on but wont
 
#39
#39
VolGraduate said:
Offer lists alone aren't the best measure of a player's potential. Schools have different player needs and extend offers for each position of need accordingly. For example if a team is only taking one running back they are not going to offer the top 20 running backs in a class. Other times players get recruited regionally for whatever reason. Other times these 17-18 year olds develop physically and mentally in college. I could go on but wont
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Good point if you are only looking at a school or two for the offer list. But over the landscape of College Football, I would think that the needs would cancel out so that there are not years where it is "Receivers Wanted" and other years where it is "Defensive Tackles Wanted." I would think that from year to year there would be a pretty constant Demand (econ term) for a pretty constant Supply of talent, when you look around the whole country.
 
#40
#40
SpringBokVol said:
1. Alan Carson - Talk about a diamond. Has only played football for a few years. Very raw, but huge upside.
2. Tino Thomas - very athletic, not sure what position he projects at best at next level. In state talent.
3. Devin Young - size and competition hurt his recruitment - UT coaches saw him in person a few times and feel he brings enough to contribute immediately on special teams and will even play some out in space on offense.
4. T. Saulsberry - an absolute steal - Florida came in late. Offers weren't there because everything thinks that if Florida does offer then why bother. Wrong. He and J. Williams are going to be studs.
5. Tom Smith - another steal. Florida had a ton of running back prospects and Smith split carries on his own team so he wasn't looked at as hard by other schools. He runs very hard and is very strong. He could be very good. One of my favorite recruits and he shut down his recruitment after verbaling to UT.
6. Christian Harris - great size, but competition was weak. And as far as other Ga. LBs go he was on the bottom of the list - but he earned some post season honors and projected well in the AJC's top 50. He is a diamond find that the coaches fell in love with when they saw him play. He also shut down his recruitment after committing.
7. Mack Crowder - as smart as they come, but played against awful competition and didn't get evaluated at any other position other than Center. He projects well, but will benefit from being a backup for a year or two. Also instate.
8. Brendan Downs - depth at a position of need. He is truly underrated as TE because of competition. He has great athletic ability, good size and good hands. Not an all world player, but could be good.
9. G. Orta - very talented, but got left behind because he was committed to Clemson for so long. Has a great deal of upside and getting him to switch to UT was a coup for the coaches.
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Wow dude you are sipping the orange kool aid hard. Lets start at the bottom Orta committed to Clemson in June of 2010 and withdrew his committment in July of 2010 and it had nothing to do with UT. Not exactly a coup for the coaches. We all hope these guys do well here but let's be a little realistic.
 
#41
#41
im most excited about Carson - you can't coach that kind of size - if he can develop he could be a beast
 
#42
#42
WesternKyVol said:
This is not a "Why did we recruit these guys!" post. It is a "Why did we recruit these guys?" post.

I am new to recruiting and did not follow the recruitment of the current class in the beginning. Like most of the little people, I showed up in January. In the past, I always looked to stars for indications of a player's potential. Recently, several of you have turned me onto Offer lists as the best way to measure talent. This is absolutely logical. The evaluators at Rivals are probably not as good as the evaluators in Gainesville, Baton Rouge, and Tuscaloosa.

So I looked back on our commits and saw nine who had less than impressive offer lists.

I realize that this is for the following reasons:

1. The coaches believe he is a diamond in the rough.
2. We have to fill out our class. We are not getting the pick of the litter these days.
3. He committed so early that other schools never offered.
4. Dooley is looking for high character guys, and that may not be fashionable at every school.

So here's the list that I would like info on. I realize that some of them may never have big time careers at UT. But, to the best of the board's knowledge, why are these guys here, and why do they have unimpressive offer lists.

Feel free to address this anyway you like. I would love for people who have been on top of this since day 1 to go one-by-one through the recruits and give their analysis of their potential and whether they deserve to be here, what they expect, etc.

So here they are:

1. Alan Carson
2. Tino Thomas
3. Devin Young
4. T. Saulsberry
5. Tom Smith
6. Christian Harris
7. Mack Crowder
8. Brendan Downs
9. G. Orta

Please understand I am not saying that some of these guys won't be eventual starters or even all league caliber players. I am just seeing relatively weak offers and want to know their stories.
Click to expand...

Out of your list only the following are iffy:

1.D.Young- just a AP/return man
2.Thomas- is a DB with very good size and speed(6'0 190 4.4 speed). He's a very good project who could be very good with coaching.
3. Maybe Orta- had other offers(was a Clemson committ)

Everyone else filled a need and I think will be good players especially Saulsberry and Carson. We needed big guys like that up front. Carson will surprise a few people.
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#44
#44
I've learned a lot about this class from this thread. Thank you WesternKyVol for starting it. I follow our recruiting year round and think that Dooley has done a fine job filling needs for our team. I see all the guys on your list as being hard to evaluate. In my opinion most of these guys played against weak competition and their ratings suffered because of it.

1. Alan Carson Big body in the middle to help our d line. Our d line was incredibly small last year and Carson can help especially in short yardage situations. His height and lack of experience hurt his ratings.

2. Tino Thomas As mentioned before, he's an in road to Memphis. Plus his athletic ability alone will get him on the field for special teams day one. Last year having starters like JJ on kick off coverage is not what you want. He provides depth and a lot of potential.

3. Devrin Young I've seen him play and he could contribute on special teams next year. Very quick and shifty guy. His size could actually be useful hiding behind those big o lineman. Plus he grew up right here in Knoxville. Having some hometown boys to help the chemistry of this team is essential. Devrin can be a leader with his heart and pride for playing with his hometown team.

4. T. Saulsberry From what I've seen and read this kid is a steal. He shows a great motor and is very athletic for a d lineman. He looks to be very aggressive and I think he can help at either end or tackle. I hope he turns out to be great just because he's from Gainseville!

5. Tom Smith Great downhill runner and shows pretty good speed for being known as a downhill runner. He could turn out to be special. For him to put up good numbers against good competition bodes well for his future here. I honestly think he should have gotten his fourth star. Oh well, maybe he can use that as motivation to prove himself.

6. Christian Harris Wow!! This kid has size, good speed, and smarts. I don't think his competition was great so he may turn out to be just ok. But I think he has a chance to be special. On tape he looks very instinctive and aggressive which is what you want at middle lb. Can't wait to see how he turns out.

7. Mack Crowder Another big body to help the depth on the o line. Hear he's a true center so maybe he can contribute early. I hope he's not overwhelmed by the upgrade in competion. He may be a guy that after a year or two in the program can start and do well. Another loyal home state guy to help with the chemistry of this team.

8. Brendan Downs Big athletic guy that can play tight end early. He's a hard worker and home state guy as well. I like his potential. TE was another need we had to fill and this guy fills it. Great job by Dooley building the fence around Tennessee.

9. G. Orta Aggressive guy who can help on special teams right away. He has all the physical qualities to play at the collegiate level. Another diamond in the rough I hope that turns out to be great. He played against some good competition in Georgia so I think he will help out our secondary. Maybe just not right away.

Remember all these guys showed loyalty and never wavered with there commitment to Tennessee. That alone shows they have good character. That will help in the weight room, on the field, and on Friday or Saturday night when Bar Knoxville is open. What good are all the big name guys who have their head in the clouds and think they are invincible? Tennessee needs depth and guys they can count on. I have faith in Dooley and see us back in the mix very soon! Go Vols!
 
#45
#45
Downs shut his recruitment down in early March, when he committed to Duke. In June, Chaney came to see him at school and offered him, knowing the kid bleeds orange. He stayed off the radar by choice, since he had the offer he wanted. Better to keep expectations low and surprise. He was within 15 lbs of the UT tight end power clean record when he arrived on campus in January. He currently weighs 240.
 
#47
#47
WesternKyVol said:
This is not a "Why did we recruit these guys!" post. It is a "Why did we recruit these guys?" post.

I am new to recruiting and did not follow the recruitment of the current class in the beginning. Like most of the little people, I showed up in January. In the past, I always looked to stars for indications of a player's potential. Recently, several of you have turned me onto Offer lists as the best way to measure talent. This is absolutely logical. The evaluators at Rivals are probably not as good as the evaluators in Gainesville, Baton Rouge, and Tuscaloosa.

So I looked back on our commits and saw nine who had less than impressive offer lists.

I realize that this is for the following reasons:

1. The coaches believe he is a diamond in the rough.
2. We have to fill out our class. We are not getting the pick of the litter these days.
3. He committed so early that other schools never offered.
4. Dooley is looking for high character guys, and that may not be fashionable at every school.

So here's the list that I would like info on. I realize that some of them may never have big time careers at UT. But, to the best of the board's knowledge, why are these guys here, and why do they have unimpressive offer lists.

Feel free to address this anyway you like. I would love for people who have been on top of this since day 1 to go one-by-one through the recruits and give their analysis of their potential and whether they deserve to be here, what they expect, etc.

So here they are:

1. Alan Carson
2. Tino Thomas
3. Devin Young
4. T. Saulsberry
5. Tom Smith
6. Christian Harris
7. Mack Crowder
8. Brendan Downs
9. G. Orta

Please understand I am not saying that some of these guys won't be eventual starters or even all league caliber players. I am just seeing relatively weak offers and want to know their stories.
Click to expand...

I think some of the guys they took on that list were reaches, but they needed to get as close to a full roster as possible with this class.

Also, Rivals and Scout never bothered updating the offer lists from guys like Tom Smith and Saulsberry.

Saulsberry picked up Miami, Florida and Michigan offers in the final weeks according to Hubbs at VQ.

Smith picked up a Florida offer months ago.

As for Orta, he actually had a pretty solid BCS offer list.
 
#48
#48
Carson is a beast and will be an immovable object on the D-line first, before he gets better and then begins to live in our opponents backfields. IMO this class has too much to get excited about to pick just one future star. This class will prove to be a monster hall for Dooley and company.
 
#50
#50
WesternKyVol said:
This is not a "Why did we recruit these guys!" post. It is a "Why did we recruit these guys?" post.

I am new to recruiting and did not follow the recruitment of the current class in the beginning. Like most of the little people, I showed up in January. In the past, I always looked to stars for indications of a player's potential. Recently, several of you have turned me onto Offer lists as the best way to measure talent. This is absolutely logical. The evaluators at Rivals are probably not as good as the evaluators in Gainesville, Baton Rouge, and Tuscaloosa.

So I looked back on our commits and saw nine who had less than impressive offer lists.

I realize that this is for the following reasons:

1. The coaches believe he is a diamond in the rough.
2. We have to fill out our class. We are not getting the pick of the litter these days.
3. He committed so early that other schools never offered.
4. Dooley is looking for high character guys, and that may not be fashionable at every school.

So here's the list that I would like info on. I realize that some of them may never have big time careers at UT. But, to the best of the board's knowledge, why are these guys here, and why do they have unimpressive offer lists.

Feel free to address this anyway you like. I would love for people who have been on top of this since day 1 to go one-by-one through the recruits and give their analysis of their potential and whether they deserve to be here, what they expect, etc.

So here they are:

1. Alan Carson
2. Tino Thomas
3. Devin Young
4. T. Saulsberry
5. Tom Smith
6. Christian Harris
7. Mack Crowder
8. Brendan Downs
9. G. Orta

Please understand I am not saying that some of these guys won't be eventual starters or even all league caliber players. I am just seeing relatively weak offers and want to know their stories.
Click to expand...

What counts is the coaches evaluations. They see them at camps and study the film and know if they are physically good and if they fit in the system and also how mature they are and their character....also a freshman changes a lot in a year as he matures and gets on out training table and weights. They can see a lot of times future potential. There is no pat answer...and no one is always right...a star ranking is only a guideline, and the evaluations involved wouldn't be equivalent to our coaches and an offer list is no guarantee or pat answer either. If it was, all they would have to do is watch the rivals and Scout ratings and watch offer lists and save a lot of money and time. Oh, and see what our posters think. Keep your list of nine and follow it over the next 3 years and see what happens.
 
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