The shut down thread

#3,476
#3,476
VolStrom said:
Just because someone works as a government contractor doesn't mean that the company they work for is under contract. People that get paid by a company under contract are way different than people that are under contract through a temp agency.
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Ok you’re going to need to explain more here. The gov doesn’t hire “temps” and pay them directly. They don’t have time clocks for this.

Even on cleaning contacts they take bids and award a contract to an “entity” that manages the effort. They pay that “entity” according to the contract terms and those terms don’t get vacated due to a shutdown.

We have this beaten into our heads yearly on how the process works as it’s part of the labor charging and tracking yearly beatdown.
 
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#3,478
#3,478
Grand Vol said:
Actually, I was questioning more along the lines that a contractor only has a contract with the USG and can't pay their employees?

Regardless, if the company is operating that close to the line funding wise where they are going "paycheck to paycheck", it doesn't speak well to their capital management.
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Lowest bidder, and the government frequently gets just what they pay for ... except in the long run it always costs more.
 
#3,479
#3,479
NorthDallas40 said:
Ok you’re going to need to explain more here. The gov doesn’t hire “temps” and pay them directly. They don’t have time clocks for this.

Even on cleaning contacts they take bids and award a contract to an “entity” that manages the effort. They pay that “entity” according to the contract terms and those terms don’t get vacated due to a shutdown.

We have this beaten into our heads yearly on how the process works as it’s part of the labor charging and tracking yearly beatdown.
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There are two ways (that I know of) that contract employees come to work. One is as the employee of a company that has a contract to provide a service, i.e. a janitorial service or a service to administrate the network or computer help desk. In those cases the employer of the contractors bills the hiring company for a service and the contractors are hired and fired by the contracted company. In this case the employees get paid by the employer and they bill the hiring company (or government) for a service not hours worked. In this case you might get paid for not working, it depends on the company.
In the other case a contractor is needed to perform a specific service like payroll administration or a specific task like a setting up a spare parts inventory. In this case the contractor works under the supervision of the hiring company and the contractor only gets paid for hours worked. In this case no work no pay.
 
#3,480
#3,480
Franklin Pierce said:
Pelosi: The State of the Union Still Isn't Happening

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I think they spelled "OBSTRUCTIONIST" wrong, but then again the Dims never quit on that.
 
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#3,481
#3,481
VolStrom said:
There are two ways (that I know of) that contract employees come to work. One is as the employee of a company that has a contract to provide a service, i.e. a janitorial service or a service to administrate the network or computer help desk. In those cases the employer of the contractors bills the hiring company for a service and the contractors are hired and fired by the contracted company. In this case the employees get paid by the employer and they bill the hiring company (or government) for a service not hours worked. In this case you might get paid for not working, it depends on the company.
In the other case a contractor is needed to perform a specific service like payroll administration or a specific task like a setting up a spare parts inventory. In this case the contractor works under the supervision of the hiring company and the contractor only gets paid for hours worked. In this case no work no pay.
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I don’t disagree with those two cases but even on the second method the individual is not punching a .gov clock. There must be a contract which will define invoicing periods, payment terms, etc... that was one of the examples I listed a few posts back.

I can assure you at least for engineering or technical contracting nobody is missing a paycheck. Not in this job market.
 
#3,482
#3,482
Franklin Pierce said:
Schumer, politicians, react to Trump's shutdown announcement: 'Hopefully now the president has learned his lesson'

Schumer, politicians, react to Trump's shutdown announcement: 'Hopefully now the president has learned his lesson'
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I hope so, too. The idiot brought a dull knife (himself) to a gunfight. Trump has fired some of the most competent people and still surrounds himself with fools - starting with Giuliani and probably Kushner. Competent people might have helped if Trump ever learned to shut his fat mouth so his ears could work.
 
#3,483
#3,483
Nancy is a self described "master legislator". It was a masterful job declaring that she was not going to budge one bit on the border debate and she didn't. She has 3 weeks to decide to do something and actually negotiate or continue to be an idiot and ignore the wants of over half of the country.
In my opinion, if she decides to not negotiate over the next 3 weeks, if I was Trump, I would veto every bill that came across my desk for the next 2 years.
 
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#3,484
#3,484
VolStrom said:
Nancy is a self described "master legislator". It was a masterful job declaring that she was not going to budge one bit on the border debate and she didn't. She has 3 weeks to decide to do something and actually negotiate or continue to be an idiot and ignore the wants of over half of the country.
In my opinion, if she decides to not negotiate over the next 3 weeks, if I was Trump, I would veto every bill that came across my desk for the next 2 years.
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Just because more then half the country wants something doesn’t mean we should do it. If so you would be dealing with President Clinton right now.
 
#3,485
#3,485
VolStrom said:
There are two ways (that I know of) that contract employees come to work. One is as the employee of a company that has a contract to provide a service, i.e. a janitorial service or a service to administrate the network or computer help desk. In those cases the employer of the contractors bills the hiring company for a service and the contractors are hired and fired by the contracted company. In this case the employees get paid by the employer and they bill the hiring company (or government) for a service not hours worked. In this case you might get paid for not working, it depends on the company.
In the other case a contractor is needed to perform a specific service like payroll administration or a specific task like a setting up a spare parts inventory. In this case the contractor works under the supervision of the hiring company and the contractor only gets paid for hours worked. In this case no work no pay.
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I'd tend to think it's also on the type of pay. I.E. hourly versus salary.

If she's salary, she has a case to sue her employer for a breach of contract if her pay is $X per month/ two weeks.

If hourly, you have a point. Regardless, an employer pulling something like this in an artificially created "crisis" that people knew was going to end is not a company I'd work for. You can always find "work" to be done during the times to help employees get by until your money flow comes back. And I'll stand on the financial comments I made earlier that if said company doesn't have the funding reserves to do such a thing is a company bound to fail.
 
#3,486
#3,486
volfanhill said:
Just because more then half the country wants something doesn’t mean we should do it. If so you would be dealing with President Clinton right now.
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And that from the party of "We were for it before we were against it ... only because the other side wanted it."
 
#3,487
#3,487
Grand Vol said:
I'd tend to think it's also on the type of pay. I.E. hourly versus salary.

If she's salary, she has a case to sue her employer for a breach of contract if her pay is $X per month/ two weeks.

If hourly, you have a point. Regardless, an employer pulling something like this in an artificially created "crisis" that people knew was going to end is not a company I'd work for. You can always find "work" to be done during the times to help employees get by until your money flow comes back. And I'll stand on the financial comments I made earlier that if said company doesn't have the funding reserves to do such a thing is a company bound to fail.
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I've hired hundreds of people either through a temp agency or a company we had a contract through. The agency folks were for lower skilled jobs and were for plug and play people that didn't take a huge skill set to fill. The contract company folks were free as to who the hired, but were sensitive to putting the wrong person in the job.
I agree with you about the others, if they can't survive a temporary break in money then you probably don't want to work for them.
 
#3,489
#3,489
IMO here is what Trump is doing:

He will declare a National emergency, knowing it will get tied up in the courts, and use that as his ammo for re-election.
 
#3,490
#3,490
volfanhill said:
IMO here is what Trump is doing:

He will declare a National emergency, knowing it will get tied up in the courts, and use that as his ammo for re-election.
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...and the democrats for sure OWN the open borders now. Any harm coming to a citizen from an illegal is their responsibility now.
 
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#3,491
#3,491
volfanhill said:
IMO here is what Trump is doing:

He will declare a National emergency, knowing it will get tied up in the courts, and use that as his ammo for re-election.
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Why not do that today if that's the end game? That may be his next step on February 14th but right now? I don't think he has a clue what he is going to do. These last 5 weeks were spent over playing his hand and making threats to people he had no leverage over. He is not an effective strategist.
 
#3,492
#3,492
Black Caucus Chair: Pelosi Should Give SOTU Since She’s ‘Running the Country’

After President Donald Trump agreed on Friday to open the government for three weeks, Rep. Karen Bass (D-CA), the chair of the Congressional Black Caucus (CBC), said House Speaker Nancy Pelosi (D-CA) should just give the State of the Union address “since she’s obviously the one running the country.”

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Pelosi cancelled Tuesday’s State of the Union address and said on Friday, after Trump decided to open the government on Democrats’ terms, that she and Trump still have to “discuss a mutually agreeable date.”​


“The State of the Union is not planned now,” Pelosi said when asked if there will be a State of the Union address on Tuesday. “What I said to the president is when the government is open we will discuss a mutually agreeable date, and I’ll look forward to doing that and welcoming the president to the House of Representatives for the State of the Union when we agree on that.”​

​
Pelosi indicated that the State of the Union address will occur only after the government is permanently open. Trump, though, warned that he is willing to shut down the government again on February 15 if he does not get a “fair deal from Congress.”

Black Caucus Chair: Pelosi Should Give SOTU Since She’s ‘Running the Country’ | Breitbart
 
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#3,493
#3,493
BowlBrother85 said:
Why not do that today if that's the end game? That may be his next step on February 14th but right now? I don't think he has a clue what he is going to do. These last 5 weeks were spent over playing his hand and making threats to people he had no leverage over. He is not an effective strategist.
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I don’t think it was his plan earlier today but he’s getting trashed by his base. It’s the smart play by him. He isn’t going to allow himself to lose his base.
 
#3,494
#3,494
Hollywood Roasts Trump over Shutdown Deal: ‘Art of the Kneel’

Hollywood celebrities are dragging President Donald Trump through the mud over his decision to temporarily re-open the government, after more than a month of a partial shutdown, without getting any funding for the border wall in return.
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“NANCY SCORES!” Jim Carrey said in a social media post along with a drawing of Trump missing a soccer goal while wearing a shirt reading “Number 1 Loser.”

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“What a waste. Mr. Art of the Deal caves. 35 days of hurting 800,000 federal workers for nothing. Your incompetence is breathtaking. Since you’ll eventually be thrown out of office for conspiring with an enemy to steal an election, why don’t you get the hell out now. TrumpResign,” left-wing director Rob Reiner said.

Cher exploded on Trump in typical fashion, saying, “trump PUT 800,000,FEDERAL WORKERS AND 1 &1/2 MILLION GOVERNMENT CONTRACTORS IN DANGER OF ‘LOSING EVERYTHING 4 ABSOLUTELY N-O-T-H-I-N-G’!!”​
 
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#3,495
#3,495
volfanhill said:
I don’t think it was his plan earlier today but he’s getting trashed by his base. It’s the smart play by him. He isn’t going to allow himself to lose his base.
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Coulter and Limbaugh are in charge of his base. He's just a puppet.
 
#3,498
#3,498
volfanhill said:
I don’t think it was his plan earlier today but he’s getting trashed by his base. It’s the smart play by him. He isn’t going to allow himself to lose his base.
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Trump has sycophants, but what he doesn't have and never did is a base.
 
#3,500
#3,500
NorthDallas40 said:
We have contractors here every where. Their checks come from their employer, the temp agency not us. This is the same arrangement .gov works from

Now has her employer got her parked with no pay since he cannot bill .gov regular invoices? Sounds like it.

I absolutely know of engineering contractors that are “working from home” during this shutdown and not missing a pay check.
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Yep. I work on the defense contracting side so I’m not affected. But I know contractors for NASA that are still getting paid. If they are under contract the funds have already been allocated until the end of the period of performance. They may not be able to go into their government buildings where their office is but they are expected to be working if they are billing the contract. I suspect most are encouraged to use vacation or personal leave when there is nothing to do, but they can still bill the hours if they are getting work done, from anywhere.
 
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