The Scapegoat

#1
G

gonygonygo

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#1
You all know who you are.

75% of you wanted to put ALL the blame on Randy Sanders for all of the problems that UT has had this year. You guys got your wish, and he has stepped down.

What will be the excuse now for the team which looked NO different last week against Norte Dame than they have all year??

The people I'm talking about are the same people that wanted to believe that players should NEVER be held responsible for the amount of production (or lack of) with this team. They feel that none of the position coaches should be held liable. To them, EVERYTHING falls on throat of the OC. Not even the head coach who has lost the discipline on the team deserves any blame.

I really believe that some of you just speak from what you hear people around you say that have a half-ass knowledge of football. Your observation of this season has been biased towards the hatred you have of one member of the coaching staff has made you blind to all of the other problems of the team.

Point is... Randy Sanders stepped down, and we got the EXACT same result. Tell me please what the excuse is going to be now. I'm just curious...

:question:
 
#2
#2
One more thing, even the players are admitting that they aren't very good. They are getting beat in all phases of the game by the other players in different color uniforms week in and week out. Some of you fans should take note and realize that this group just isn't very good. You still think that the coaches are THE ONLY REASON why these guys are stinking it up on Saturdays.
 
#3
#3
I see your point but the point is Randy did not go anywhere. He did what he always did but refused to be responsible for it by merely giving up the title. In action and in truth everthing remained the same, Randy just did it from the press box...but yes, I agree with your opinion that the problem is bigger than Sanders.
 
#4
#4
The players are being outhustled, outplayed, out skilled, out toughened, out smarted, etc. Most of those things cannot all be fixed by coaching. The players themselves have to decide if they are going to give it their all or not. If they are giving their all, then they really aren't good at all.
 
#5
#5
Originally posted by gonygonygo@Nov 7, 2005 12:58 PM
One more thing, even the players are admitting that they aren't very good.  They are getting beat in all phases of the game by the other players in different color uniforms week in and week out.  Some of you fans should take note and realize that this group just isn't very good.  You still think that the coaches are THE ONLY REASON why these guys are stinking it up on Saturdays.
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Then why did CPF boast before the season started about how they were going to win the SEC championship and possibly the national championship? The best thing that CPF could have done was to keep his mouth closed about how good they were going to be. Sounds like something back-fired.
 
#7
#7
Originally posted by orangetd88@Nov 7, 2005 1:20 PM
Did you really think it was gonna change in a week?
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That's exactly what I've been wondering. I understand disappointment, but how could anybody be surprised by what happened?
 
#8
#8
Originally posted by orangetd88@Nov 7, 2005 1:20 PM
Did you really think it was gonna change in a week?
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According to the majority of posts on this site, yes!
 
#9
#9
Originally posted by gonygonygo@Nov 7, 2005 1:23 PM
According to the majority of posts on this site, yes!
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The problem is not one player or one coach. It is an organizational problem - so we need to fix the organization. In this case it starts with CPF making the necessary changes and re-toolings. That filters down to the players.

The only troubling thing to me is that CPF doesn't seem to understand why they are playing poorly or what to do about it.
 
#10
#10
Originally posted by gonygonygo@Nov 7, 2005 1:23 PM
According to the majority of posts on this site, yes!
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That's an exaggeration if I have ever seen one.
 
#11
#11
Originally posted by Liper@Nov 7, 2005 1:28 PM
The problem is not one player or one coach.  It is an organizational problem - so we need to fix the organization.  In this case it starts with CPF making the necessary changes and re-toolings.  That filters down to the players.

The only troubling thing to me is that CPF doesn't seem to understand why they are playing poorly or what to do about it.
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I agree. Talent-wise, these players have potential; however, "potential" doesn't make a good player or good team.
 
#12
#12
Originally posted by gonygonygo@Nov 7, 2005 1:33 PM
I agree.  Talent-wise, these players have potential; however, "potential" doesn't make a good player or good team.
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That is part of the problem: No development of the talent that we do have. It appears that many players have either remained stagnant with their skills or actually have gone back a step or two. Usually when this occurs it is due to lack of effective coaching of the players. I said before and I will say again it is the coaches who are responsible to develop the talent and to correct the mistakes that have plagued this team. When mistakes are continuously committed like illegal formations, lining up off-sides, and not knowing assignments you have to wonder if they are being properly coached or reprimanded for stupid mistakes. A mistake by a player the first time, it is the players fault. After that, it becomes the coach's fault for not correcting the problem.
 
#13
#13
This article highlights many of the things we've been tossing around about talent and execution, coaching and players, etc.

South Bend Tribune

Here is what Frank Boyles, an independent NFL scout had to say about the Irish's prospects. Anthony Stovall is one in particular that he believes is a pro prospect because of Weiss.

It's no longer merely a dream for Irish senior Maurice Stovall...Stovall's pro football reality changed drastically when ND first-year head football coach Charlie Weis walked through the door last December..."Last year, you didn't even notice him, didn't think of him in terms of a pro prospect," Coyle, of draftinsiders.com, said of Stovall..."This year, he's a threat. Now it starts with having a pro-style offense rather than one that claimed to be. And it starts with Quinn. His improvement makes everyone better.

Wait, it gets better.

You just look at this roster differently now. They're playing in an offense that shows off their talents. It really does make all the difference in the world.

ND has the same players, but all of the sudden, as if out of thin air, they are making plays and look talented. These are the same guys last year that no one thought were draftable. These are the same WRs that couldn't run past my grandmother, and the same OL that couldn't block her.

TN has the inverse problem. We are the 2004 version of Notre Dame. Our team looks out of sorts, our offense looks difficult to make work, and our it "looks" like we don't have any playmakers.
 
#14
#14
If the players aren't any good, or coached well
and they don't make any plays, lack effort or what ever
ALL this goes back to one thing COACHES.
THEY recruited them, coached them, etc....
Randy Phil etc.....
They are all to blame.
1 game without the R.Sanders isn't goint to change anything.
Ainge does good to get the play called much less learn anything new in 1 week.
oh well
Blast Away
 
#15
#15
Originally posted by secfanclub@Nov 7, 2005 1:47 PM
That is part of the problem: No development of the talent that we do have.  It appears that many players have either remained stagnant with their skills or actually have gone back a step or two.  Usually when this occurs it is due to lack of effective coaching of the players.  I said before and I will say again it is the coaches who are responsible to develop the talent and to correct the mistakes that have plagued this team.  When mistakes are continuously committed like illegal formations, lining up off-sides, and not knowing assignments you have to wonder if they are being properly coached or reprimanded for stupid mistakes.  A mistake by a player  the first time, it is the players fault.  After that, it becomes the coach's fault for not correcting the problem.
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I agree completely. Coaches aren't getting it done either. I just want to make sure that people realize that players need to also be held accountable. There is a such thing of players that are talented but simply do not have "it".

When players aren't capable of being "coached", you replace them. Plain and simple, even if the program temporarily suffers. At least you will not have a discipline problem. You make an example out of offenders, and you get less of the behavior that you punish. Look at guys like Bill Parcells. They are highly successful using that system. I would rather lose with a lack of talent than to lose with a WASTE of talent.

 
#16
#16
Originally posted by gonygonygo@Nov 7, 2005 2:23 PM
According to the majority of posts on this site, yes!
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well there was an article (in the Tennessean i think?) they stated that randy still called the plays, he was just doing it from the press box saturday instead of from the sidelines and even if he wasnt calling the plays you really can't expect a team to lose an OC and not be slightly distracted by the whole thing throughout the whole week, the odds were stacked very heavily against us and we just couldnt finish off another game. improvements will not take place until the offseason rolls around and that is when we will be able to determine what this team will look like next year.
 
#17
#17
Originally posted by gonygonygo@Nov 7, 2005 3:21 PM

Point is...  Randy Sanders stepped down, and we got the EXACT same result.  Tell me please what the excuse is going to be now.  I'm just curious...

:question:
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Until Sanders is no longer sitting in the press box calling plays, and until we have a new OC who has had at least several games under his guidance, nothing will change.

Now off with you and go TROLL another forum that there are no members with any football savvy.

Try the Bammer site. You can cry in their beer with them how they have been soooooooo wrongly persecuted.

:lolabove:
 
#18
#18
Originally posted by gonygonygo@Nov 7, 2005 2:35 PM
I agree completely.  Coaches aren't getting it done either.  I just want to make sure that people realize that players need to also be held accountable.  There is a such thing of players that are talented but simply do not have "it".

When players aren't capable of being "coached", you replace them.  Plain and simple, even if the program temporarily suffers.  At least you will not have a discipline problem.  You make an example out of offenders, and you get less of the behavior that you punish.  Look at guys like Bill Parcells.  They are highly successful using that system.  I would rather lose with a lack of talent than to lose with a WASTE of talent.
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Players are not being held accountable because if they were, they would be either sitting on the bench replaced by a second-stringer or removed from the team. I don't have much patience with players who committ stupid mistakes continually. I can't remember a coach I had who would ever clap for a player when he made mistakes. My coaches would meet us on the sidelines and do a little butt-chewing. If the butt-chewing didn't correct the mistakes then, the bench became your new home for awhile. In order for players to be held accountable, coaches must hold them accountable. This is where CPF must do his job and step in and take the necessary actions which he has not done.
 
#19
#19
Originally posted by gonygonygo@Nov 7, 2005 12:51 PM
You all know who you are. 

75% of you wanted to put ALL the blame on Randy Sanders for all of the problems that UT has had this year.  You guys got your wish, and he has stepped down. 

What will be the excuse now for the team which looked NO different last week against Norte Dame than they have all year??

The people I'm talking about are the same people that wanted to believe that players should NEVER be held responsible for the amount of production (or lack of) with this team.  They feel that none of the position coaches should be held liable.  To them, EVERYTHING falls on throat of the OC.  Not even the head coach who has lost the discipline on the team deserves any blame. 

I really believe that some of you just speak from what you hear people around you say that have a half-ass knowledge of football.  Your observation of this season has been biased towards the hatred you have of one member of the coaching staff has made you blind to all of the other problems of the team.

Point is...  Randy Sanders stepped down, and we got the EXACT same result.  Tell me please what the excuse is going to be now.  I'm just curious...

:question:
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Is holding the players accountable bashing them? If so count me out. I don't feel the need to bash a bunch of kids who ARE trying to win every game they play. If you feel the need to bash a bunch of kids then I guess you have that right as an American. Being an American you have the right to have no class.

As far as play calling goes, what did you expect? I said before the game that some like yourself would come on here even though there is NO WAY in heck that you can change an offense in one week, so thank you for proving me right.
These kids are playing hard and if you don't see that you are blinded by your hatred of CPF or you are way to emotional.

As far as players developing, how about our DB's, O line, DE, RB's and punter? How do we rank as far as player who are now on NFL rosters? I think it is 2nd. HELLO!

Look it is obvious that you dislike CPF very much and that you like to bash UT players. I like CRS and hated to see things work out the way they did but I did not bash him and won't. You will not see me bashing any of our players or coaches because I am here for MY SCHOOL and I love them win or lose. Instead of bashing them I want to root them on and help find out how to fix the problem. One bad year will not make my BIG ORANGE fade.

You do want you want. As for me and mine? We are ALL VOL!
 
#21
#21
Originally posted by wilburnVol@Nov 7, 2005 3:03 PM
Until Sanders is no longer sitting in the press box calling plays, and until we have a new OC who has had at least several games under his guidance, nothing will change.

Now off with you and go TROLL another forum that there are no members with any football savvy.

Try the  Bammer site. You can cry in their beer with them how they have been soooooooo wrongly persecuted.

:lolabove:
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Whatever, you are the same person that feels all of the problems lead to his PLAY CALLING. I agree that player development has been an issue along with many other things.

It seems that you will never agree with me, but PLAY CALLING is NOT the sole reason of the offensive problems as many people like YOU think. I would bet to say that you probably know NOTHING about play calling and strategy and what factors lead to certains plays being called.

YOU are the one that has a lack of football knowledge. IDIOT! :wavey:
 
#22
#22
I guess I'm a part of your "Vast 75% Conspiracy". I personally was one calling for Sanders' head. But I never said the proverbial magic wand will be waved and all will be right with the world after one week.

As a matter of fact as some have pointed out, Sanders was a part of Fulmer's "OC By Committee" and was upstairs. Odds are that was who Clausen was with on the headset and Ainge was with on the phone.

So keep griping about "Sanders is gone and we still lost" all you want. Until he is gone, a new OC comes in, and all traces of Sanders is wiped there will still be a question on Offense....
 
#23
#23
Playcalling was NOT the problem. The problem is development of players. Randy is not a good QB coach.
 
#24
#24
Originally posted by wilburnVol@Nov 7, 2005 3:03 PM
Until Sanders is no longer sitting in the press box calling plays, and until we have a new OC who has had at least several games under his guidance, nothing will change.

Now off with you and go TROLL another forum that there are no members with any football savvy.

Try the  Bammer site. You can cry in their beer with them how they have been soooooooo wrongly persecuted.

:lolabove:
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Playcalling had nothing to do with the loss Saturday and if you really believe that it did, I would question your football savvy. I thought the staff did a very good job with the playcalling, but once again nobody stepped up and made a play when it counted. What's next.......until Sanders moves out of the state of Tennessee nothing will change? You can question the staff all you want when it comes to player preparation, discipline, and execution but playcalling has been the least of UT's problems this year.
 
#25
#25
Originally posted by holdemvol@Nov 7, 2005 3:43 PM
Playcalling had nothing to do with the loss Saturday and if you really believe that it did, I would question your football savvy.  I thought the staff did a very good job with the playcalling, but once again nobody stepped up and made a play when it counted.  What's next.......until Sanders moves out of the state of Tennessee nothing will change?  You can question the staff all you want when it comes to player preparation, discipline, and execution but playcalling has been the least of UT's problems this year.
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AMEN! you do so much better of a job explaining to these fools what is going on. We should join together and form an alliance.
:bow:
 
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