The Kim Caldwell System

#52
#52
You have to have players to effectively fit and run the system, plus actually give a damn to do it. This system might work, but we do it in such a half assed way which no system would ever work. I don't think getting outrebounded by 22 is necessarily about a system but it sure as hell is about effort and desire.

The main thing which has disappointed me about Caldwell is I expected a crazy philosophy but someone running it who was an intense, self-assured, assertive type personality who had a buck stops here persona. What I'm seeing is simply chaos on the court and, especially, on the sideline, a deer in the headlights and inmates run the asylum impression. She doesn't look in charge in timeouts and the Type A personality I thought I saw in her at the beginning has been replaced by disorganized leadership.
 
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#53
#53
SGMVols said:
Except Cooper and Boyd, she recruited these players
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She literally recruited the number 2 class and is going to get another top class and one of the better players in the nation next season. Let the freaking kids at least get a chance to develop. We need to stop acting like it’s the 90s where 3 good girls teams exist and all the best players go there
 
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#54
#54
The idea of playing very hard then come out just isn’t what is happening. Players don’t play hard after the press is broken and are terrible at fundamentals and effort half court and rebounding.
 
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#55
#55
Let
volfan102455 said:
What are you willing to endure? I think we may be asking the questions this year -

- Are you willing to miss the NCAA tournament?
- How many blowout losses of 20 plus points before folks admit this system won't work?

I believe she got some leeway due to the CT win, but that is not going to hold up with games like what we saw against UCLA and now Louisvillel
volfan102455 said:
What are you willing to endure? I think we may be asking the questions this year -

- Are you willing to miss the NCAA tournament?
- How many blowout losses of 20 plus points before folks admit this system won't work?

I believe she got some leeway due to the CT win, but that is not going to hold up with games like what we saw against UCLA and now Louisville.
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I want to at least let this recruiting class develop into college players and especially with Edward’s next year
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Let the freshman develop, and the class next year coming in as well. They are so young
 
#56
#56
IMO, I don’t believe this staff is capable of coaching this team into the tournament due to the system they are committed to.

SGMVols said:
You can’t miss the tournament. The tournament streak is all we have right now. If Kim blows it, she has to go.

Don’t even care if we go one and done this year. But you can’t miss the tournament and keep your job in this program. Full stop.
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#58
#58
VolRanch said:
She literally recruited the number 2 class and is going to get another top class and one of the better players in the nation next season. Let the freaking kids at least get a chance to develop. We need to stop acting like it’s the 90s where 3 good girls teams exist and all the best players go there
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This is a coaching problem not a player problem.

How many coaches sit there and watch their team get further and further behind without regrouping and attempting to get the game back in control?
 
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#62
#62
volfan102455 said:
This is a coaching problem not a player problem.

How many coaches sit there and watch their team get further and further behind without regrouping and attempting to get the game back in control?
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I’d say it’s a little bit of both. We a very young inexperienced team at this level and the same with the coaches. Both can and will develop with time. If time even exists anymore in college sports.
 
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#63
#63
VolRanch said:
I’d say it’s a little bit of both. We a very young inexperienced team at this level and the same with the coaches. Both can and will develop with time. If time even exists anymore in college sports.
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SMH - we should not be a place where coaches come to learn how to coach. Sorry - we shouldn't be that.
 
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#65
#65
Her system is not working with this group of players so she needs to adjust to a more traditional type system which is play the best players and sub less and stop the full court press. I think she should go to more a three quarter court press with more traps especially as the midcourt is broken. Use the midcourt as a way to trap players . Most of the major programs have great ball handlers so the full court press is ineffective which leads to easy shots and layups. RECRUIT SOME SHOOTERS NOT JUST ATHLETICS.
 
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#66
#66
Lots of speculation to debate, but if things don't improve dramatically by the middle next season it may be time to call this a failed experiment and make a major change at the top.
 
#67
#67
River67 said:
Louisville is young too. They started 4 sophomores and a senior transfer from a mid major.
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True. Those kids have a full year under them as well as being very talented. And that girl from St Joes is a baller. We can’t act like mid major kids can’t come right in as jrs and srs and not be really good. Knecht and Lanier ring a bell? Lol
 
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#68
#68
gymmlover said:
Her system is not working with this group of players so she needs to adjust to a more traditional type system which is play the best players and sub less and stop the full court press. I think she should go to more a three quarter court press with more traps especially as the midcourt is broken. Use the midcourt as a way to trap players . Most of the major programs have great ball handlers so the full court press is ineffective which leads to easy shots and layups. RECRUIT SOME SHOOTERS NOT JUST ATHLETICS.
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I think your comment about shooters instead of athletes is spot on.
 
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#69
#69
volfan102455 said:
SMH - we should not be a place where coaches come to learn how to coach. Sorry - we shouldn't be that.
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I mean every single coach has to develop as well as their teams. Name a coach in year 2 had their team in top of the world that was rebuilding a program? I may be forgetting one or two but I can’t think of any.

Hell even Dawn Staley with 9 seasons under her belt of coaching didn’t make the tournament with SC until year 4
 
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#71
#71
RetroVol said:
A couple of weeks ago, I posted a thread on $ for Athletes about the compensation of athletes, how much schools control, etc. I was trying to understand the subject, and that thread produced some much appreciated insight. So, since Coach Kim's System comes up frequently in various threads. I thought it might be enlightening to have one place to pull together resources, thoughts, criticisms, and ongoing discussion. I'llstart it off with a statement of my understanding of that system that I put in one of the game threads. Maybe we can add to it with resources (videos, articles, where Kim has commented), analyses, suggestions, critiques, etc.

Here are what seem to me to be the components of the CKC system, maybe in order of importance:

1. Effort. All out, last two minutes of the championship game effort every time you're on the court. Kim has said it's an effort-based system. She's said when done right, players are glad to come out. I see it like interval training -- going really hard for 90 seconds to 3 minutes, then resting, then doing it again. Defense and rebounding are a lot about effort, and we all know what Pat said about offense, defense, and rebounding.

2. Pace. I'm a little less sure about where CKC is on this one, but the early roots of this system included shooting the first good shot. Then rebound and shoot again or defense. Two reasons. One, a good shot is a good shot; take it. And, two, shooting a good shot quickly and running back forces the other team to run also. Half-court sets give defensive players more of a chance to rest. (And, if you shoot fast enough, their "big" may be just getting don the court when she has to turn around and run back. Win, win, win.)

3. Full-Court Pressure: This helps with Pace, produces turnovers, and hopefully wears the other team out so their legs aren't there and shots start missing late in games. In some of our close losses last year, we came back late, just not quite enough. I do think this is one of the "learn" things. Learn the presses, learn the rotations, learn when to go for the double-team and how to do it, learn to pressure but still be able to cut off the ball handler so she can't just go straight toward the rim (a real weakness so far).

4. 3-Point Freedom. We all know this is a bit of a challenge this year. I think we really wanted Latson, but, oh, well. Anyway, it may more of a go to the basket off transition than pull up for a three, but the 3-point shot is a key for Coach Kim's approach, and I think she'll be trying to work it in as players settle in and learn how to get their best shots off in this system. We saw what happens when Robertson sets and shoots rather than trying to go off the bounce. Same is true for others. Knowing when it is the shot they should take and taking it without hesitation and with confidence will help.

5. Trust and Teamwork. Trusting your teammates to fill their roles in the presses. Trusting them to shoot their shots. Trusting yourself to shoot yours. Trusting enough that, when a shot or three fails to fall, you're still putting in the effort on the press, in the half-court defense, and rebounding. Trust and teamwork also generate poise, that ability to execute like practice in critical game situations. We've been short on that at times this year, but hopefully we will get there.

6. Frequent, multi-player substitutions: The frequent and hockey-style substitutions actually are what enable many of the components of this system. In addition, this approach means more players get significant minutes in every game, even important ones. Kim has commented about how quickly this changed team cohesion once they got used to it the first year she played under this system. It also seemed to have that effect (buy-in, cohesion) last year.

But, overall, I think the biggest thing is #1: all-out, intensive effort each time you're on the floor, then rest, then back at it. That is different from how most players have learned to play, and I suspect it is the biggest part of what has to "click." And without it, everything else in this system starts to look bad and, as Kim has said, you get some ugly looking basketball.


Edit to add links to resources. Mention good resources in posts and I'll add them here so we end up with a good overall resource.

Sports Illustrated story on Kim's System

Cora Hall story (Tennessean) on the addition of analytics this season
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I really do not like CKC’s system but I am willing to give it a chance. I believe for it to work, you have to have 10 athletic ball players blessed with speed, strength, shooting ability from all levels for a high percentage, and desire. I believe she has that with the exception of 10 players who can shoot for a high percentages from different levels. At least this current team has not shown that ability. I also like to see her add screen and back door plays. If you play the same old scheme, teams can defense you better but when you play multiple ways it leaves teams guessing. Especially this team, we spend a lot of time passing the ball around the horn trying to get a shot. This allows the opponent to rest and defense you better. CKC’s offense has to be nearly as fast as her defense.
 
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#72
#72
VolRanch said:
I mean every single coach has to develop as well as their teams. Name a coach in year 2 had their team in top of the world that was rebuilding a program? I may be forgetting one or two but I can’t think of any.

Hell even Dawn Staley with 9 seasons under her belt of coaching didn’t make the tournament with SC until year 4
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Didn’t Kim Mulkey win with Angel Reese in her 2nd year of a rebuilding program?
 
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#73
#73
VolRanch said:
I mean every single coach has to develop as well as their teams. Name a coach in year 2 had their team in top of the world that was rebuilding a program? I may be forgetting one or two but I can’t think of any.

Hell even Dawn Staley with 9 seasons under her belt of coaching didn’t make the tournament with SC until year 4
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South Carolina was a Chevy pinto when she took over.

Tennessee wasn't in great shape but that analogy is a big stretch.
 
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#74
#74
VolRanch said:
It’s December of their true freshman season. I don’t what we are supposed to expect so early from these kids that we’re in high school a year ago.
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TO RECRUIT SHOOTERS/SCORERS. It's not a knock on our freshman, we knew they weren't that when we recruited them. CKC should have went after that in the portal. She didnt.
 
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