The Impeachment Thread

#33,701
#33,701
volinbham said:
I think this impeachment effort is bogus but I do support the bolded if merited - you can't pick and choose which parts of the Constitution you support. This is the process. History shows that the 67 part (or the prevailing 2/3rds in the case of Johnson) is not likely.
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67 partisans is what I meant. No evidence is needed
 
#33,702
#33,702
volinbham said:
I think this impeachment effort is bogus but I do support the bolded if merited - you can't pick and choose which parts of the Constitution you support. This is the process. History shows that the 67 part (or the prevailing 2/3rds in the case of Johnson) is not likely.
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That same ectorate elected the legislative branch to have, in part, this ability.
 
#33,703
#33,703
BowlBrother85 said:
I can't imagine what that is, unless you are referring to the Alexandra Chalupa allegations... which outside of an article that ran in Politico, remain unsupported. And what was ever done to bring forth the whistleblower is not germane to the question of whether or not Trump did withhold the military aid from the Ukraine so he could leverage it against Zelensky's willingness to perform a political favor for him. If it happened? It might look bad for a while, but it wouldn't exonerate Trump.

I would gladly offer up the Bidens, Schiff, Alexandra Chalupa and the whistleblower if it meant getting Rudy Giuliani, Robert Hyde, John Bolton, Rick Perry, Devin Nunes, Mick Mulvaney and Mike Pompeo on the stand.
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Stop saying political favor. That's not accurate.
 
#33,704
#33,704
BowlBrother85 said:
I can't imagine what that is, unless you are referring to the Alexandra Chalupa allegations... which outside of an article that ran in Politico, remain unsupported. And what was ever done to bring forth the whistleblower is not germane to the question of whether or not Trump did withhold the military aid from the Ukraine so he could leverage it against Zelensky's willingness to perform a political favor for him. If it happened? It might look bad for a while, but it wouldn't exonerate Trump.

I would gladly offer up the Bidens, Schiff, Alexandra Chalupa and the whistleblower if it meant getting Rudy Giuliani, Robert Hyde, John Bolton, Rick Perry, Devin Nunes, Mick Mulvaney and Mike Pompeo on the stand.
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Trump will never be exonerated by 50% of the country no matter what.

This entire thing is a political exercise. For the truly independent voters the question is which political BS are you willing to put up with. If this looks like a coordinated effort to inflate the significance of Trump's actions then it surely helps Trump.

I would imagine most R Senators are in a place where they say even if Trump applied some pressure here that's not a big enough deal to remove him from office; especially less than 1 year from an election. I'm basically in that camp.

If it's shown that Dems orchestrated a process to inflate this and bring it forward to get him then that not only won't get him removed but it will make voters say "meh, they both suck - who helps me most".
 
#33,706
#33,706
vols40 said:
LMAO. So now what's going to compel these people to testify? That is the most chicken $hite response ever. Oh it may take a little while to get our way and that's not fair? 218 congressman and 67 senators now have precedent for overturning the will of 60 plus million. Is this what you support?
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The Senate, hopefully. Now, they could refuse to comply with a subpoena from a Republican-controlled Senate, I suppose, but that would come with considerably more political consequences for some of them and be much harder for the White House to explain.

If Trump has done nothing wrong here, then there shouldn't be any reason to not want all of these people to testify. If Trump has only conducted himself legally and ethically, then all they could do is provide exculpatory evidence. Right ?
 
#33,708
#33,708
BowlBrother85 said:
The Senate, hopefully. If Trump has done nothing wrong here, then there shouldn't be any reason to not want all of these people to testify. If Trump has only conducted himself legally and ethically, then all they could do is provide exculpatory evidence. Right ?
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Please tell me you don't believe that; particularly in a political setting where people can ask anything they want with out being overruled.

We don't live in a system where you should have to volunteer to go on trial if you are innocent.
 
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#33,711
#33,711
Orange defense said:
The senate isn’t involved?
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Whether is was this perverted in the beginning or not, this is all about one part of congress determining guilt before the other part "tries" the crime. Apparently most earlier politicians were smarter than to politicize the process so that it no longer even resembles an investigation and justice - simply a reflection of which party holds the executive branch and which has the numbers in the house and senate. I guess we'll see what happens - whether politicians become reasonable or impeachment becomes the norm ... just because. Unfortunately, I don't see the electorate taking over matters and putting an end to the stupidity.
 
#33,712
#33,712
volinbham said:
Trump will never be exonerated by 50% of the country no matter what.

This entire thing is a political exercise. For the truly independent voters the question is which political BS are you willing to put up with. If this looks like a coordinated effort to inflate the significance of Trump's actions then it surely helps Trump.

I would imagine most R Senators are in a place where they say even if Trump applied some pressure here that's not a big enough deal to remove him from office; especially less than 1 year from an election. I'm basically in that camp.

If it's shown that Dems orchestrated a process to inflate this and bring it forward to get him then that not only won't get him removed but it will make voters say "meh, they both suck - who helps me most".
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Nobody forced Trump to place a hold on the military aid... and nobody forced Trump to push Zelensky to announce an investigation into the Bidens. He did that of his own free will ... with some help from Giuliani, Barr, Pompeo and Pence. It is a political exercise and that was how this whole thing began - with Trump trying to damage a potential political opponent and in the process, give himself a better chance of winning reelection.
 
#33,713
#33,713
BowlBrother85 said:
I guess they are all liars to some extent. Trump was definitely lying in October when he told a pool of White House reporters that he didn't know who Lev Parnas was. Trump had already discussed Parnas's legal representation with Jay Sekulow when he said that.
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I agree that they are all liars. And they will all do whatever it takes to gain and keep power.
 
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#33,714
#33,714
Septic said:
Surely he'd want to stick it to the corrupt dims in an election year? Embarrassing Pelosi and her caucus under the brightest lights by exposing their 'sham' trail by simply having his closest tell the truth.

Right?
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Well they do a good job of it themselves so what’s the point? It’s up to them to prove he’s guilty of something so why on earth would he try and convict himself? Why give them more material to twist and contort to drag out one sham after another?
 
#33,716
#33,716
AM64 said:
Whether is was this perverted in the beginning or not, this is all about one part of congress determining guilt before the other part "tries" the crime. Apparently most earlier politicians were smarter than to politicize the process so that it no longer even resembles an investigation and justice - simply a reflection of which party holds the executive branch and which has the numbers in the house and senate. I guess we'll see what happens - whether politicians become reasonable or impeachment becomes the norm ... just because. Unfortunately, I don't see the electorate taking over matters and putting an end to the stupidity.
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The democrats already had a crime on him from the time he came down the escalators of Trump’s tower. The impeachment begin day one. This will not hold up in the senate. This will die, before it even gets started. I hope this isn’t the norm, and it can be changed.
 
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#33,720
#33,720
BowlBrother85 said:
Nobody forced Trump to place a hold on the military aid... and nobody forced Trump to push Zelensky to announce an investigation into the Bidens. He did that of his own free will ... with some help from Giuliani, Barr, Pompeo and Pence. It is a political exercise and that was how this whole thing began - with Trump trying to damage a potential political opponent and in the process, give himself a better chance of winning reelection.
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It's a matter of degree.
 
#33,721
#33,721
Orange defense said:
The democrats already had a crime on him from the time he came down the escalators of Trump’s tower. The impeachment begin day one. This will not hold up in the senate. This will die, before it even gets started. I hope this isn’t the norm, and it can be changed.
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Trump and his arrogance did this to Trump. He has no one but himself to blame.
 
#33,722
#33,722
BowlBrother85 said:
Nobody forced Trump to place a hold on the military aid... and nobody forced Trump to push Zelensky to announce an investigation into the Bidens. He did that of his own free will ... with some help from Giuliani, Barr, Pompeo and Pence. It is a political exercise and that was how this whole thing began - with Trump trying to damage a potential political opponent and in the process, give himself a better chance of winning reelection.
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What if all this washes out and the Bidens are exposed in extorting hundreds of millions of dollars in Ukraine and other places? You think the American public would see Trump at fault?
 
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#33,723
#33,723
Orange defense said:
The democrats already had a crime on him from the time he came down the escalators of Trump’s tower. The impeachment begin day one. This will not hold up in the senate. This will die, before it even gets started. I hope this isn’t the norm, and it can be changed.
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Yeah, but we seem to have become a country of the stupid. Charging ahead with bad ideas and ignoring future consequences. Politics is leading the field and the pendulum is swinging further each time ... certainly not a model of stability. I think this could very well become the norm.
 
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