The Impeachment Thread

#15,603
#15,603
Q: Why do you think that either of those activities [investigating Biden or involving Ukraine in Trump's re-election] are problematic?
SONDLAND: Because I believe I testified that it would be improper to do that.
Q: And illegal, right?
SONDLAND: I’m not a lawyer, but I assume so.
 
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#15,607
#15,607
Orangeburst65 said:
There has always been a quid pro quo in the sense that he withheld aid due to corruption issues, just like team Obama. Now show me where he withheld aid to investigate Biden.
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Are you saying you want the quid pro quo and the connection between Biden and Burisma need to come from the same source?

His ask in the phone call to investigate Biden plus subsequent quid pro quo asking for the investigation into Burisma, plus knowing that he knew of Burisma/Biden connection is not sufficient?
 
#15,610
#15,610
Orangeburst65 said:
There has always been a quid pro quo in the sense that he withheld aid due to corruption issues, just like team Obama. Now show me where he withheld aid to investigate Biden.
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This first sentence is not accurate. Trump said from the very beginning, just after the whistleblower's complaint was made public, that there was no quid-pro-quo. He has never qualified that statement with anything else. At first, Trump gave an excuse that the military aid had been withheld because he wanted European countries to share in the burden of supporting the Ukraine. That didn't make sense because he never made those countries aware that the aid had been withheld in the first place... and European countries do share in the burden, anyway. Trump then changed his story to say that the military aid was withheld because of concerns over corruption in the Ukraine, but that doesn't make any sense either because Trump has conducted personal business in the Ukraine in the last 5 years, and so has Rudy Giuliani. Finally, Gordon Sondland testified that yes, this military aid was tied to their willingness to publicly announce an investigation into the Bidens - not just of Burisma Holdings, but of the Bidens - and of course, that means investigating a potential political opponent of Trump's in next year's general election.
 
#15,612
#15,612
Orangeburst65 said:
I am just looking for evidence. There was a quid pro quo, just like all foreign aid. You have to prove it was tied to an investigation of Biden.
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How is there a quid pro quo on all foreign aid?

And what alternative have you heard for the condition for release of aid here other than either investigation Biden's son and the company Burisma, or publicly announcing such was going to take place? To date, I have not heard any other explanation for it and the testimony of about a dozen people working on it so far establishes it to be the case.
 
#15,614
#15,614
lawgator1 said:
How is there a quid pro quo on all foreign aid?

And what alternative have you heard for the condition for release of aid here other than either investigation Biden's son and the company Burisma, or publicly announcing such was going to take place? To date, I have not heard any other explanation for it and the testimony of about a dozen people working on it so far establishes it to be the case.
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Well the Ukraine President said himself that it did not happen. There is your first hand source. All others are hearsay and opinion.
 
#15,618
#15,618
I have an easy way to fix this quid pro quo crap with other countries and that is we just don't give anyone of them a dime. Easy enough, fight your own battles with your own damn money.
 
#15,619
#15,619
lawgator1 said:
Yup, so much for the "no quid pro quo" theory.

But watch, Trump will say he didn't know about it. And his minions will dutifully fall in line and defend that nonsense.
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Trump and his supporters are very good at moving the goal posts. The Quid Pro Quo scenario has now been corroborated by several witnesses who were under oath but Trump's cult will take the word of Trump, a serial liar, over career public servants.
 
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#15,621
#15,621
BigOrangeD said:
Well the Ukraine President said himself that it did not happen. There is your first hand source. All others are hearsay and opinion.
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You guys are leaning hard on that. Zelensky has to say that as long as Trump is still in office, because he needs backing from the United States right now. He can't say anything which might jeopardize the relationship. And all others are not hearsay and opinion. Vindman was on the call too.
 
#15,622
#15,622
BowlBrother85 said:
You guys are leaning hard on that. Zelensky has to say that as long as Trump is still in office, because he needs backing from the United States right now. He can't say anything which might jeopardize the relationship.
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It is similar to Trump relying on Putin's denials over the conclusions of 17 U.S. intelligence agencies: Find the one outlier you can live with and insist THAT one is correct, the others are all wrong.
 
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#15,624
#15,624
What are you dems gonna do when the investigation into Hunter Biden shows that daddy paved the way for junior to make a small fortune? Or is this not the same thing, since this is an actual crime and not an allegation?
 
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#15,625
#15,625
VolStrom said:
What are you dems gonna do when the investigation into Hunter Biden shows that daddy paved the way for junior to make a small fortune? Or is this not the same thing, since this is an actual crime and not an allegation?
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There is a thread for that discussion, please post this speculation there.
 
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