The buyout for firing Butch.

If you're that concerned about it, make a FOIA request to the general counsel's office to get a copy of the contract.
 
Lawdy , The raise was tooooooo much . BUT , the buyout is tooooooooo low . Some of you nice folks make absolutely , NO sense . I am just gonna go ahead and guess . FAHR Butch ?
 
Saw another thread addressing the buyout if Butch decides to leave. On the other side, what we have to pay Butch if we fire him is much steeper. Basically we keep the 2 million dollars/ per year left on the contract that the origianl contract specified. IMO, this is ridiculously irresponsible given that the next two years will tell the tale on Butch. Say he goes 5-7 next year or say he goes 7-5 and then backs that up with a 6-6 in 2016...it could happen.

Under the contract's terms, we would owe him 10 million after next year and 8 million the year after.

The jury is still very much out on Butch, so to owe him 10 million dollars for firing him next year, and 8 the year after that, is complete and utter garbage. By then Dave Hart will be in a retirement community in parts south and the University will be on the hook. This angers me as a fan and former student.

I'm glad you're angry, anyone that can't see the MAJOR improvements and steps made in the right direction of this program is a complete idiot. Butch can go 6-6, 7-5 for the next couple years and would still be doing a fine job. The "jury" still out crap that people use is pathetic. What does that even mean! Really? Who's the jury? Fans like us that make zero impact on the hire/fire process? This is what's wrong with a lot of our fans. So many of us think bc we won national titles 60-70 years ago, and won one 15 years ago, and we had peyton manning, that we are THE elite program in the nation. Well....facts are facts. I hate them as much as anyone. I want to win every game too, but that's not reality...not yet. Our football program has sucked for a while now. Yes, sucked. Our hc hires and former ad, sucked. The way majors got done after building us up from medicority, sucked. The way fulmer got done after taking that talent to the highest levels, sucked. What I'm getting at is called a realistic approach. Things around here lately have, sucked. Now, in comes coach jones. Firing away with a new philosophy, and using words like foundation, and accountability, and VFL. A man of integrity that leads by example. Who told our team captain that he was done when accusations came out about him, where at other universities you can rape, disrespect authority, steal, show zero remorse, and still remain active on the roster. Believe in him. Let the man do his thing and get behind him. We won 6 games this year playing in the toughest conference in the ncaa, with the youngest team, whose best offensive lineman was a walk-on with no acl in one of his knees. Let alone our upper classmen aren't the most talented bunch. What is so hard to see here? Everyone wants to win now, right now. Doesn't work that way. (But Gus Malzan) bull****e! Malzan recruited that team at auburn before he left for Arkansas st. He knew what he had before he ever landed back at the airport in auburn. Quit being stupid. Thanks for pissing me off. Go vols! Kick Iowas arse!
 
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I'm glad you're angry, anyone that can't see the MAJOR improvements and steps made in the right direction of this program is a complete idiot. Butch can go 6-6, 7-5 for the next couple years and would still be doing a fine job. The "jury" still out crap that people use is pathetic. What does that even mean! Really? Who's the jury? Fans like us that make zero impact on the hire/fire process? This is what's wrong with a lot of our fans. So many of us think bc we won national titles 60-70 years ago, and won one 15 years ago, and we had peyton manning, that we are THE elite program in the nation. Well....facts are facts. I hate them as much as anyone. I want to win every game too, but that's not reality...not yet. Our football program has sucked for a while now. Yes, sucked. Our hc hires and former ad, sucked. The way majors got done after building us up from medicority, sucked. The way fulmer got done after taking that talent to the highest levels, sucked. What I'm getting at is called a realistic approach. Things around here lately have, sucked. Now, in comes coach jones. Firing away with a new philosophy, and using words like foundation, and accountability, and VFL. A man of integrity that leads by example. Who told our team captain that he was done when accusations came out about him, where at other universities you can rape, disrespect authority, steal, show zero remorse, and still remain active on the roster. Believe in him. Let the man do his thing and get behind him. We won 6 games this year playing in the toughest conference in the ncaa, with the youngest team, whose best offensive lineman was a walk-on with no acl in one of his knees. Let alone our upper classmen aren't the most talented bunch. What is so hard to see here? Everyone wants to win now, right now. Doesn't work that way. (But Gus Malzan) bull****e! Malzan recruited that team at auburn before he left for Arkansas st. He knew what he had before he ever landed back at the airport in auburn. Quit being stupid. Thanks for pissing me off. Go vols! Kick Iowas arse!

This! The Gospel! No sarcasm!

But you have to have noticed, that most around here, ARE NOT REALISTIC! They have no clue how terrible our o-line is, how terrible recruiting was before Butch even got here, how terrible our depth is, the result of numerous injuries to a team WITH NO depth! Most of them are probably pot heads who claim they know all about college football. Don't let it piss you off! They are actually kind of funny at their age!
 
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I'm glad you're angry, anyone that can't see the MAJOR improvements and steps made in the right direction of this program is a complete idiot. Butch can go 6-6, 7-5 for the next couple years and would still be doing a fine job. The "jury" still out crap that people use is pathetic. What does that even mean! Really? Who's the jury? Fans like us that make zero impact on the hire/fire process? This is what's wrong with a lot of our fans. So many of us think bc we won national titles 60-70 years ago, and won one 15 years ago, and we had peyton manning, that we are THE elite program in the nation. Well....facts are facts. I hate them as much as anyone. I want to win every game too, but that's not reality...not yet. Our football program has sucked for a while now. Yes, sucked. Our hc hires and former ad, sucked. The way majors got done after building us up from medicority, sucked. The way fulmer got done after taking that talent to the highest levels, sucked. What I'm getting at is called a realistic approach. Things around here lately have, sucked. Now, in comes coach jones. Firing away with a new philosophy, and using words like foundation, and accountability, and VFL. A man of integrity that leads by example. Who told our team captain that he was done when accusations came out about him, where at other universities you can rape, disrespect authority, steal, show zero remorse, and still remain active on the roster. Believe in him. Let the man do his thing and get behind him. We won 6 games this year playing in the toughest conference in the ncaa, with the youngest team, whose best offensive lineman was a walk-on with no acl in one of his knees. Let alone our upper classmen aren't the most talented bunch. What is so hard to see here? Everyone wants to win now, right now. Doesn't work that way. (But Gus Malzan) bull****e! Malzan recruited that team at auburn before he left for Arkansas st. He knew what he had before he ever landed back at the airport in auburn. Quit being stupid. Thanks for pissing me off. Go vols! Kick Iowas arse!

Just so you know, Dooley came up with the phrase "VFL", which should tell you how much gimmicky little slogans mean. Jones is the King of Cliches and I could care less about absurd nonsense like Team 118 and Brick by Brick and I have no idea why some get so caught up in that crap. Either you win or don't.

So, to answer your rant, the reason the "jury is out", so to speak, on Jones is because he hasn't won anything in two years and has looked uneven in the process.
 
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If the jury is still out, they are out of their mind. They are like the fifth dentist that doesn't recommend sugarless gum.
 

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If the jury is still out, they are out of their mind. They are like the fifth dentist that doesn't recommend sugarless gum.

He has a losing record. The performances the last two years haven't been particularly noteworthy. What exactly are we basing this confidence in Jones, at this point?
 
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Hate to break it to ya, but he has Fulmer's National Championship in support of his opinion while you have absolutely nothing but speculation in support of yours.
He wins.:)

Gene Chizik has a NC too...does that mean he'd win one at Auburn today? wonder why he got fired
 
Saw another thread addressing the buyout if Butch decides to leave. On the other side, what we have to pay Butch if we fire him is much steeper. Basically we keep the 2 million dollars/ per year left on the contract that the origianl contract specified. IMO, this is ridiculously irresponsible given that the next two years will tell the tale on Butch. Say he goes 5-7 next year or say he goes 7-5 and then backs that up with a 6-6 in 2016...it could happen.

Under the contract's terms, we would owe him 10 million after next year and 8 million the year after.

The jury is still very much out on Butch, so to owe him 10 million dollars for firing him next year, and 8 the year after that, is complete and utter garbage. By then Dave Hart will be in a retirement community in parts south and the University will be on the hook. This angers me as a fan and former student.

and fans make fun of Mike Hamilton?????
 
He has a losing record. The performances the last two years haven't been particularly noteworthy. What exactly are we basing this confidence in Jones, at this point?

Does it really matter what I say here? All the pluses that CBJ has brought to UT have been stated, restated, stated again for the ignorant, reworded for the idiots, typed in bold letters for the hard of seeing, used pictures and stats for the non believers, etc. I can't educate the non football minds. They only look at wins and losses. Evidently they only see 1 successful team a year, the NC. I tend to think UT has been more successful than one time in my lifetime. I guess it's a point of view. I see exactly The same characteristics in CBJs program as I saw in Fulmers program early on. That is why several of us older fans are excited again in where UT is going.
 
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Does it really matter what I say here? All the pluses that CBJ has brought to UT have been stated, restated, stated again for the ignorant, reworded for the idiots, typed in bold letters for the hard of seeing, used pictures and stats for the non believers, etc. I can't educate the non football minds. They only look at wins and losses. Evidently they only see 1 successful team a year, the NC. I tend to think UT has been more successful than one time in my lifetime. I guess it's a point of view. I see exactly The same characteristics in CBJs program as I saw in Fulmers program early on. That is why several of us older fans are excited again in where UT is going.
I think that most of us can see the improvement. However, if it does not eventually end up in winning at a high level, does it really matter. Before you go flying off the handle on one of your emotional rants, I said eventually not right now. I think that's what was meant by the jury still being out. Butch has done well in certain areas but will it translate to winnng? Time will tell.
 
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I think that most of us can see the improvement. However, if it does not eventually end up in winning at a high level, does it really matter. Before you go flying off the handle on one of your emotional rants, I said eventually not right now. I think that's what was meant by the jury still being out. Butch has done well in certain areas but will it translate to winnng? Time will tell.

Great players make the X's and os easy. Saban has been living on that principle for the last ten years. We are just about to do the same thing in a few years. I also think that CBJ is a results, statistic kinda guy. Heck, he keeps spreadsheets on individual practice results. If an assistant coach is not making the grade, I have no doubt that he will be gone the next day and replaced by someone that he thinks will get the job done. He also knows that you can't fairly judge an AC if he does not have the hosses in place. That will take two more years to be realistic. It's this 'my money, and I want it now' generation that pisses me off and gets me on my rants. They must think a coach can just magically call a play and it will work every time versus a more superior talented team.
 
Does it really matter what I say here? All the pluses that CBJ has brought to UT have been stated, restated, stated again for the ignorant, reworded for the idiots, typed in bold letters for the hard of seeing, used pictures and stats for the non believers, etc. I can't educate the non football minds. They only look at wins and losses. Evidently they only see 1 successful team a year, the NC. I tend to think UT has been more successful than one time in my lifetime. I guess it's a point of view. I see exactly The same characteristics in CBJs program as I saw in Fulmers program early on. That is why several of us older fans are excited again in where UT is going.

The only thing that's surprising is that you penned that entire thing and had the nerve to call other people idiots. No one expected Jones to win a NC, that's a nonsense red herring. I hope he's better than Fulmer, as Jones coaches in a league much tougher than the one Fulmer had and he wasn't that great against any coach with a pulse in this league, anyway.

So, we have a coach who has a losing record and a track record of head coach of following Brian Kelly, but not doing as well as Kelly. We have, in two years, lost to the good or moderately good teams and beat most of the bad teams. He has recruited well, just like any UT coach that has actually tried to do so.

Again, what should make me so excited about Jones, thus far? In fact, I'm most worried about the likelihood that he's merely mediocre and him between 8 to 9 games a year will be sufficient for a program and a fan base that has, apparently, embraced mediocrity and meeting the absolute lowest standards and goals set.
 
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The only thing that's surprising is that you penned that entire thing and had the nerve to call other people idiots. No one expected Jones to win a NC, that's a nonsense red herring. I hope he's better than Fulmer, as Jones coaches in a league much tougher than the one Fulmer had and he wasn't that great against any coach with a pulse in this league, anyway.

So, we have a coach who has a losing record and a track record of head coach of following Brian Kelly, but not doing as well as Kelly. We have, in two years, lost to the good or moderately good teams and beat most of the bad teams. He has recruited well, just like any UT coach that has actually tried to do so.

See what I mean? It didn't matter what I said. I can't help Ya son.
 
The only thing that's surprising is that you penned that entire thing and had the nerve to call other people idiots. No one expected Jones to win a NC, that's a nonsense red herring. I hope he's better than Fulmer, as Jones coaches in a league much tougher than the one Fulmer had and he wasn't that great against any coach with a pulse in this league, anyway.

So, we have a coach who has a losing record and a track record of head coach of following Brian Kelly, but not doing as well as Kelly. We have, in two years, lost to the good or moderately good teams and beat most of the bad teams. He has recruited well, just like any UT coach that has actually tried to do so.

See what I mean? It didn't matter what I said. I can't help Ya son.

You're not helping yourself. You say Butch is great and has shown so with anyone not seeing this greatness is an idiot and irredeemable. Unfortunately, you don't say anything. No, he's great just because he is. He says "Brick by Brick", "Team 118" and a million other clichés and you swoon. I don't care (and, frankly, find it annoying) because I want substance, something real.

I'll even get you started. Jones is recruiting very well, thus far. Alright, take the baton from there.
 
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You're not helping yourself. You say Butch is great and has shown so with anyone not seeing this greatness is an idiot and irredeemable. Unfortunately, you don't say anything. No, he's great just because he is. He says "Brick by Brick", "Team 118" and a million other clichés and you swoon. I don't care (and, frankly, find it annoying) because I want substance, something real.

I'll even get you started. Jones is recruiting very well, thus far. Alright, take the baton from there.

I wish you were this relentless in your reading of the three thousand posts and threads on the subject as you are in this thread. It would answer all your questions and clear up some confusion. I'm just a lazy typer, and don't want to try and sell someone that is not buying.
 
You're not helping yourself. You say Butch is great and has shown so with anyone not seeing this greatness is an idiot and irredeemable. Unfortunately, you don't say anything. No, he's great just because he is. He says "Brick by Brick", "Team 118" and a million other clichés and you swoon. I don't care (and, frankly, find it annoying) because I want substance, something real.

I'll even get you started. Jones is recruiting very well, thus far. Alright, take the baton from there.

Here's a pretty blatant result... first bowl game since 2010.

There are pages and pages of facts backing up our team's improvement. But, every day some strung out hillbilly that needs to get laid rehashes this stupid ass argument.
 
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He has a losing record. The performances the last two years haven't been particularly noteworthy. What exactly are we basing this confidence in Jones, at this point?

Insanely good recruiting with a losing record is glaring indication of what's about the explode in Knoxville. Players will show us whose program is going in the right direction and whose isn't. Tennessee being top 5 after so many losing seasons is a HUGE freaking reason to have confidence.

Also, the man has a proven track record as a head coach. He had statistically the hardest two-year schedule in the country. So when you say that a guy who took over for Dooley has a losing schedule with what he's been through, it's white noise.

You are white noise. Khhhhhhhhh.
 
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I'll even get you started. Jones is recruiting very well, thus far. Alright, take the baton from there.

He beat SC two years in a row. Forget how amazing they were in 2013?

He was three points away from beating Georgia...twice. Just imagine when he doesn't have freshmen littered all over the field.

He has rallied the entire base. Not easy and extremely important.

The real question is, what did you expect? 9-3? Why the heck would anyone be so obtuse?

tumblr_mqm0qbH01O1r3vs52o1_500.gif
 
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Here's a pretty blatant result... first bowl game since 2010.

There are pages and pages of facts backing up our team's improvement. But, every day some strung out hillbilly that needs to get laid rehashes this stupid ass argument.

That's a pretty bare minimum accomplishment. It's essentially not committing coaching malpractice, a la Dooley. 6-6 is not indicative of great success on the horizon, hence "the jury is still out".
 
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He beat SC two years in a row. Forget how amazing they were in 2013?

He was three points away from beating Georgia...twice. Just imagine when he doesn't have freshmen littered all over the field.

He has rallied the entire base. Not easy and extremely important.

The real question is, what did you expect? 9-3? Why the heck would anyone be so obtuse?

tumblr_mqm0qbH01O1r3vs52o1_500.gif

Lots of bad coaches have almost wins and the SC result last year was the one decent victory on Jones' resume, but it was also the result of Spurrier inexplicably stopping running ball, too. Rallying the base is pretty empty without the wins that follow and the most irrelevant factor. "The base" follows anyone who has the title of coach, for a time. They do with every coach here, no matter how terrible, including a Dooley, Wade Houston or a Jerry Green. He's not nearly as bad as them, but I haven't been aware of much of anything that says he is a great gameday coach to manage the talent he has to a title in this conference.

Like I said, I'll wait and see.
 
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That's a pretty bare minimum accomplishment. It's essentially not committing coaching malpractice, a la Dooley. 6-6 is not indicative of great success on the horizon, hence "the jury is still out".

You wanted proof of improvement

We haven't been to a bowl in 3 years.

Now we're going

That is, by definition, improvement.

Piss off with this tired garbage. Go read all the other threads before you regurgitate what you think is a cogent argument of "the jury is still out". Just stop watching the team until it's "good enough". It's just astounding that some of you have the gall to say that this team isn't improved. There's a reason that a lot of people leave this website and it has nothing to do with the moderators/admins. It's the blatantly ignorant fans that start the same damn argument in every single thread yet refuse to listen to the other side.

Every time it's "Well I think this. Provide me examples otherwise." Okay... Well here are 'x' number of examples. "No. we're 6-6."

Do you just have "we're 6-6" copy pasted so any time you run out of trash to say, that's all you do? You know what? We are 6-6. You know the last time we were 6-6? 2010. Did you honestly expect us to go 5-7....... then 9-3? With two back-to-back brutally difficult schedules? Have you any football intelligence whatsoever?

No? Okay. 6 > 5. That's improvement. It's not a lot. It's also not what anyone wants this team to strive toward. But if you, as someone who watched Tennessee closely last year, said that we were expected to win more than 6... you're full of it.

The team is trending upward and the fan base is still in the gutter. You give him all of the blame for games that we should have won*, yet ZERO credit for games that we came back and won. "It was luck." "Spurrier sucks at coaching." "That was a miracle." Blah blah blah. That's how football is played. You can't have it both ways just to suit your dumb argument. Piss off.
 
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I wish you were this relentless in your reading of the three thousand posts and threads on the subject as you are in this thread. It would answer all your questions and clear up some confusion. I'm just a lazy typer, and don't want to try and sell someone that is not buying.

I've read a lot of those and, mostly, I see a lot of "rah rah" logic or he's great because, hey, look at how terrible Dooley was.
 
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