Talent Level ( Facts )

#1
All-Vol

All-Vol

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#1
I rarely come here anymore. If this has been hashed to death already feel free to delete.

What are your thoughts on the following facts?

Going by rivals here are the following recruiting rankings for the last 5 years for three teams. I chose these comparative teams only because of where they are in the polls right now.

Tennessee ( unranked ):
Class of 2018: 20th ( currently 3-5 vs. West Virginia, ETSU, UTEP, Florida, Georgia, Auburn, Alabama, and South Carolina )
Class of 2017: 15th ( went 4-8 )
Class of 2016: 15th ( went 9-4 )
Class of 2015: 5th ( went 9-4 )
Class of 2014: 5th ( went 7-6 )

Total wins and losses to date for last 4+ years = 32-27 having averaged the 12th best draft class

UCF ( University of Central Florida currently ranked 9th in AP and Coaches Poll ):
Class of 2018: 67th ( currently 7-0 vs. UConn, SC State, Florida Atlantic, Pitt, SMU, Memphis, and East Carolina )
Class of 2017: 53rd ( went 13-0 )
Class of 2016: 57th ( went 6-7 )
Class of 2015: 63rd ( went 0-12 )
Class of 2014: 73rd ( went 9-4 )

Total wins and losses to date for last 4+ years = 35-23 having averaged the 63rd best draft class

Kentucky ( currently ranked 11th in AP and 12th in Coaches Poll ):
Class of 2018: 30th ( currently 7-1 vs. Central Michigan, Florida, Murray, Mississippi St., South Carolina, Texas A&M [only loss], and Missouri )
Class of 2017: 26th ( went 7-6 )
Class of 2016: 28th ( went 7-6 )
Class of 2015: 35th ( went 5-7 )
Class of 2014: 17th ( went 5-7 )

Total wins and losses to date for last 4+ years = 31-27 having averaged the 47th best draft class
 
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#2
#2
All-Vol said:
I rarely come here anymore. If this has been hashed to death already feel free to delete.

What are your thoughts on the following facts?

Going by rivals here are the following recruiting rankings for the last 5 years for three teams. I chose these comparative teams only because of where they are in the polls right now.

Tennessee ( unranked ):
Class of 2018: 20th ( currently 3-5 vs. West Virginia, ETSU, UTEP, Florida, Georgia, Auburn, Alabama, and South Carolina )
Class of 2017: 15th ( went 4-8 )
Class of 2016: 15th ( went 9-4 )
Class of 2015: 5th ( went 9-4 )
Class of 2014: 5th ( went 7-6 )

Total wins and losses to date for last 4+ years = 32-27 having averaged the 12th best draft class

UCF ( University of Central Florida currently ranked 9th in AP and Coaches Poll ):
Class of 2018: 67th ( currently 7-0 vs. UConn, SC State, Florida Atlantic, Pitt, SMU, Memphis, and East Carolina )
Class of 2017: 53rd ( went 13-0 )
Class of 2016: 57th ( went 6-7 )
Class of 2015: 63rd ( went 0-12 )
Class of 2014: 73rd ( went 9-4 )

Total wins and losses to date for last 4+ years = 35-23 having averaged the 63rd best draft class

Kentucky ( currently ranked 11th in AP and 12th in Coaches Poll ):
Class of 2018: 30th ( currently 7-1 vs. Central Michigan, Florida, Murray, Mississippi St., South Carolina, Texas A&M [only loss], and Missouri )
Class of 2017: 26th ( went 7-6 )
Class of 2016: 28th ( went 7-6 )
Class of 2015: 35th ( went 5-7 )
Class of 2014: 17th ( went 5-7 )

Total wins and losses to date for last 4+ years = 31-27 having averaged the 47th best draft class
Click to expand...
Our class ratings were partially boosted because of the class size, we have had a lot of attrition due to injury and simply people no longer being here, and of course there has been zero player development. Don’t forget we are also implementing new systems with first time coaches at their respective positions. Add a tough schedule and it’s easy to see why we are where we are today. Let’s give it time and see what we truly have with Pruitt. It’s too early to say anything certain one way or the other.
 
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#5
#5
The UCF comparison is silly because they play in a weak conference. I don’t have the numbers, but their opponents this year have a combined losing record. Kentucky is a good example of what talent development can do for a program. They trusted Stoops to build the program and now they are seeing results and success. While their classes are not elite, if you can bring in quality guys and develop them then you will be ok.

We have had some good recruiting classes, but the development is lacking and we have had some questionable coaching decisions with the talent we did have on the team. If you look at our roster, it stacks up fairly well in the SEC as far as “star” power. Our average is even higher than Florida. However, you would never think that with how we have been playing at times. Again, it all centers on talent development. I think with Pruitt and this coaching staff we will see an upgrade in recruiting quality talent and development which will result in more success on the field.
 
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#6
#6
Orange&White said:
The UCF comparison is silly because they play in a weak conference. I don’t have the numbers, but their opponents this year have a combined losing record. Kentucky is a good example of what talent development can do for a program. They trusted Stoops to build the program and now they are seeing results and success. While their classes are not elite, if you can bring in quality guys and develop them then you will be ok.

We have had some good recruiting classes, but the development is lacking and we have had some questionable coaching decisions with the talent we did have on the team. If you look at our roster, it stacks up fairly well in the SEC as far as “star” power. Our average is even higher than Florida. However, you would never think that with how we have been playing at times. Again, it all centers on talent development. I think with Pruitt and this coaching staff we will see an upgrade in recruiting quality talent and development which will result in more success on the field.
Click to expand...

Good post
 
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#10
#10
Using Kentucky this year and Missouri the 2 years they won the East, does it change anyone's opinion on the jimmy's & joe's (players) vs the X & Os (coaching). I am on the coaching being 60-70% or more for success. You can find examples both ways but try not to use Ala as an example.
It seems strange to think there are no D1 HCs around from the Majors or Fulmer coaching trees. Majors had a few but don't recall any from Fulmer. Wonder why?
 
#11
#11
All-Vol said:
I rarely come here anymore. If this has been hashed to death already feel free to delete.

What are your thoughts on the following facts?

Going by rivals here are the following recruiting rankings for the last 5 years for three teams. I chose these comparative teams only because of where they are in the polls right now.

Tennessee ( unranked ):
Class of 2018: 20th ( currently 3-5 vs. West Virginia, ETSU, UTEP, Florida, Georgia, Auburn, Alabama, and South Carolina )
Class of 2017: 15th ( went 4-8 )
Class of 2016: 15th ( went 9-4 )
Class of 2015: 5th ( went 9-4 )
Class of 2014: 5th ( went 7-6 )

Total wins and losses to date for last 4+ years = 32-27 having averaged the 12th best draft class

UCF ( University of Central Florida currently ranked 9th in AP and Coaches Poll ):
Class of 2018: 67th ( currently 7-0 vs. UConn, SC State, Florida Atlantic, Pitt, SMU, Memphis, and East Carolina )
Class of 2017: 53rd ( went 13-0 )
Class of 2016: 57th ( went 6-7 )
Class of 2015: 63rd ( went 0-12 )
Class of 2014: 73rd ( went 9-4 )

Total wins and losses to date for last 4+ years = 35-23 having averaged the 63rd best draft class

Kentucky ( currently ranked 11th in AP and 12th in Coaches Poll ):
Class of 2018: 30th ( currently 7-1 vs. Central Michigan, Florida, Murray, Mississippi St., South Carolina, Texas A&M [only loss], and Missouri )
Class of 2017: 26th ( went 7-6 )
Class of 2016: 28th ( went 7-6 )
Class of 2015: 35th ( went 5-7 )
Class of 2014: 17th ( went 5-7 )

Total wins and losses to date for last 4+ years = 31-27 having averaged the 47th best draft class
Click to expand...
UT would be 7-0 if they played UCF schedule
And Class rankings tell about 5% of the story
 
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#14
#14
a vol n tears said:
Using Kentucky this year and Missouri the 2 years they won the East, does it change anyone's opinion on the jimmy's & joe's (players) vs the X & Os (coaching). I am on the coaching being 60-70% or more for success. You can find examples both ways but try not to use Ala as an example.
It seems strange to think there are no D1 HCs around from the Majors or Fulmer coaching trees. Majors had a few but don't recall any from Fulmer. Wonder why?
Click to expand...

David Cutcliffe and Randy Sanders
 
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#17
#17
All-Vol said:
Yes. I thought this as well. And yet UCF is ranked 9th. What does that tell one about the polls? Or about scheduling?
Click to expand...
Polls and class rankings are opinions, wrong about as often as they are right.
Non power 5 schedules are a lot easier than power 5 schedules. Fact
 
#19
#19
All-Vol said:
I rarely come here anymore. If this has been hashed to death already feel free to delete.

What are your thoughts on the following facts?

Going by rivals here are the following recruiting rankings for the last 5 years for three teams. I chose these comparative teams only because of where they are in the polls right now.

Tennessee ( unranked ):
Class of 2018: 20th ( currently 3-5 vs. West Virginia, ETSU, UTEP, Florida, Georgia, Auburn, Alabama, and South Carolina )
Class of 2017: 15th ( went 4-8 )
Class of 2016: 15th ( went 9-4 )
Class of 2015: 5th ( went 9-4 )
Class of 2014: 5th ( went 7-6 )

Total wins and losses to date for last 4+ years = 32-27 having averaged the 12th best draft class

UCF ( University of Central Florida currently ranked 9th in AP and Coaches Poll ):
Class of 2018: 67th ( currently 7-0 vs. UConn, SC State, Florida Atlantic, Pitt, SMU, Memphis, and East Carolina )
Class of 2017: 53rd ( went 13-0 )
Class of 2016: 57th ( went 6-7 )
Class of 2015: 63rd ( went 0-12 )
Class of 2014: 73rd ( went 9-4 )

Total wins and losses to date for last 4+ years = 35-23 having averaged the 63rd best draft class

Kentucky ( currently ranked 11th in AP and 12th in Coaches Poll ):
Class of 2018: 30th ( currently 7-1 vs. Central Michigan, Florida, Murray, Mississippi St., South Carolina, Texas A&M [only loss], and Missouri )
Class of 2017: 26th ( went 7-6 )
Class of 2016: 28th ( went 7-6 )
Class of 2015: 35th ( went 5-7 )
Class of 2014: 17th ( went 5-7 )

Total wins and losses to date for last 4+ years = 31-27 having averaged the 47th best draft class
Click to expand...
Here is something your rankings are missing, they represent signing day rankings.
How many of those that put UT in the top 5 transfer, or had career ending injuries (jack jones) or injuries that made it impossible to reach there potential? And then the ones that fooled the “experts “ and were bust?
You want to compare apples to apples , go do that research for each school and then I will tell you what I think, otherwise what you posted is meaningless to me.
 
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#20
#20
BigOrangeTrain said:
It certainly hasnt worked out for UK huh? We are Tennessee right?
Click to expand...
If you take Snell away, KY is probably 50/50 or worse in the SEC. Getting a player like Snell is the luck side of the equation. Then there is the whole to be determined matter of whether Stoops has really built a sustainable product or is this just a one season flash in the pan and next year they will fall back to their usual spot in the SECE pecking order and have to wait 4 or 5 years to build it back up.Kentucky is not the model we need to be following.
 
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#21
#21
VolunteerHillbilly said:
If you take Snell away, KY is probably 50/50 or worse in the SEC. Getting a player like Snell is the luck side of the equation. Then there is the whole to be determined matter of whether Stoops has really built a sustainable product or is this just a one season flash in the pan and next year they will fall back to their usual spot in the SECE pecking order and have to wait 4 or 5 years to build it back up.Kentucky is not the model we need to be following.
Click to expand...
Josh Allen: 2 star recruit.
Some Sr. Stats:
2nd in nation in sacks
3rd in nation in tackles for loss
2nd in nation in forced fumbles
6’5” 260lb linebacker
They lose him and Snell and they’re back to being UK.
Kinda like when UT lost Barnett and Dobbs the 2 players that made an average UT team 9-3
 
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#22
#22
GVol1966 said:
Josh Allen: 2 star recruit.
Some Sr. Stats:
2nd in nation in sacks
3rd in nation in tackles for loss
2nd in nation in forced fumbles
6’5” 260lb linebacker
They lose him and Snell and they’re back to being UK.
Kinda like when UT lost Barnett and Dobbs the 2 players that made an average UT team 9-3
Click to expand...
You really don’t know that for sure. The same argument that you are making can be used against you, watch how it works. Josh Allen’s backup John Doe was a 2 star recruit that was being developed while josh Allen was killing it stepped right in and Kentucky never missed a beat. Kentucky was building depth during the whole process of getting to where they are. Snell really didn’t do anything Saturday and they still beat mizzou
 
#23
#23
volunteerfan said:
You really don’t know that for sure. The same argument that you are making can be used against you, watch how it works. Josh Allen’s backup John Doe was a 2 star recruit that was being developed while josh Allen was killing it stepped right in and Kentucky never missed a beat. Kentucky was building depth during the whole process of getting to where they are. Snell really didn’t do anything Saturday and they still beat mizzou
Click to expand...
If we are talking about Bama, Georgia, Ohio St
That is the norm, UK has had some Randal Cobbs, But rarely another waiting in the wings, maybe 3-4 years later yeah but come on , do you really believe they have that kinda players just waiting for their shot?
 
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#24
#24
Got to have them alpha dogs. This defensive team with DB and AJ would be elite. Hopefully next year the light comes on for some rs freshman or sophomores.
 
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