Talent Gap Dooley Inherited......

#27
#27
In other news....the sky is blue. :) j/k fellas.

I think its been obvious for the last 3 years just how far we have fallen but apparently there were people who either refused to believe it or were too stupid to.

Well....there's your evidence. When Kentucky and Vanderbilt have more people taken in the Draft than UT, what does that say about what sort of sh** storm Kiffin and, more importantly, Dooley inherited?

I'd like to see what those numbers look like in three more years in comparison to the last three, starting with '13. I guarantee you it will speak light-years to the recruiting prowess that DD possess.

Now....let's just hope that translates on the field, finally. V, B!
 
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#29
#29
StoVol said:
I don't want no scrubs
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#30
#30
Yankee_Vol said:
Talent only goes so far. You have to be able to coach
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So talent only goes so far. If you don't have the experience talent to get you to the point of FAR then how do you coach. Just asking. I guess basically what I'm trying to say is Dooley is now at FAR he can coach after this year if he doesn't I say fire him.
 
#31
#31
UGA insider said:
Talent is one thing but you still have to coach them up IMO.

Look at Boise. They had like 6 guys drafted, 2 first rounders if I'm not mistaken. Boise is a team that has nowhere near the resources or ability to attract big time recruits into their program like most SEC schools. Just my two cents.
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That may make make sense if we hadn't hired their DC and they still won.... On top of that we lost with him...

Hard to say where coaching plays into that side of it..
 
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#32
#32
It's hard to believe we've virtually had no senior class for the last three years, including this upcoming season. I dare you to find any school anywhere that could say the same barring any major NCAA penalties and/or probation. I still don't know if Dooley is the guy. I think he will get us somewhere between 8 to 10 wins on average, but whether or not he's the guy to take us to SEC titles and national titles, I just don't know. He's definitely had a short deck his first two years, as well as incredibly bad luck; however, he's also made a lot of bonehead decisions, in my opinion, as well. To be fair, even coaches like Saban have made their share of bonehead decisions. (See first Alabama/LSU matchup this past season.) You almost have to wonder, though, if Dooley was so ill-fated his first two years here, that it can't help but keep him from ever really exploding things here. An 8 to 10 win season this coming year would help, but what will help the most is the ability to replicate that again the year after. If he retreats in the win dept. again after next season, then I think he'll never take off here. With that being said, I think Dooley is the biggest proponent of Bray, Hunter, Rodgers, and possibly Patterson staying for their senior seasons. While I think we will be successful this coming year, Dooley simply can't afford to crap out again in 2013-14.
 
#33
#33
volprof said:
It's hard to believe we've virtually had no senior class for the last three years, including this upcoming season. I dare you to find any school anywhere that could say the same barring any major NCAA penalties and/or probation. I still don't know if Dooley is the guy. I think he will get us somewhere between 8 to 10 wins on average, but whether or not he's the guy to take us to SEC titles and national titles, I just don't know. He's definitely had a short deck his first two years, as well as incredibly bad luck; however, he's also made a lot of bonehead decisions, in my opinion, as well. To be fair, even coaches like Saban have made their share of bonehead decisions. (See first Alabama/LSU matchup this past season.) You almost have to wonder, though, if Dooley was so ill-fated his first two years here, that it can't help but keep him from ever really exploding things here. An 8 to 10 win season this coming year would help, but what will help the most is the ability to replicate that again the year after. If he retreats in the win dept. again after next season, then I think he'll never take off here. With that being said, I think Dooley is the biggest proponent of Bray, Hunter, Rodgers, and possibly Patterson staying for their senior seasons. While I think we will be successful this coming year, Dooley simply can't afford to crap out again in 2013-14.
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I said this from day one. We might as well have had sanctions with what Dooley inherited. It was a complete cluster f***!! I dont care who the coach is, it would not be fixed in just two seasons.
 
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#34
#34
volprof said:
It's hard to believe we've virtually had no senior class for the last three years, including this upcoming season. I dare you to find any school anywhere that could say the same barring any major NCAA penalties and/or probation. I still don't know if Dooley is the guy. I think he will get us somewhere between 8 to 10 wins on average, but whether or not he's the guy to take us to SEC titles and national titles, I just don't know. He's definitely had a short deck his first two years, as well as incredibly bad luck; however, he's also made a lot of bonehead decisions, in my opinion, as well. To be fair, even coaches like Saban have made their share of bonehead decisions. (See first Alabama/LSU matchup this past season.) You almost have to wonder, though, if Dooley was so ill-fated his first two years here, that it can't help but keep him from ever really exploding things here. An 8 to 10 win season this coming year would help, but what will help the most is the ability to replicate that again the year after. If he retreats in the win dept. again after next season, then I think he'll never take off here. With that being said, I think Dooley is the biggest proponent of Bray, Hunter, Rodgers, and possibly Patterson staying for their senior seasons. While I think we will be successful this coming year, Dooley simply can't afford to crap out again in 2013-14.
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I think 8 wins or even 7 wins with a big win over UGA, USC, UF or even UA would help UT. CDD has recruited the foundation for the team, just needs a few big play makers on each side of the ball. Especially defense. I think if the season finishes well for UT they will land the players UT needs to start competing for the east again.
 
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#35
#35
UGA insider said:
Talent is one thing but you still have to coach them up IMO.

Look at Boise. They had like 6 guys drafted, 2 first rounders if I'm not mistaken. Boise is a team that has nowhere near the resources or ability to attract big time recruits into their program like most SEC schools. Just my two cents.
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I am not trying to get in a pissing battle back and forth, but UGA is a good example as well. More talent than most teams in the SEC or the country, give or take maybe UA, LSU and UF. UGA may even have better talent in some positions but yet can not seem to put it together. It think that it is the staff that struggles for UGA to put it together on the field when they need to. CMR seems like a really great coach but sometimes if the players do not buy into what he is selling it really does not matter how good the staff is or how much talent you have.

Yes UGA had some players get drafted, but my point is coaching alone is not enough either. What would CDD do with the talent UGA has? I think Saban could bring UGA a title already. My one cent for the arguement. My wife took the other.:)
 
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#36
#36
TideWarrior said:
I think 8 wins or even 7 wins with a big win over UGA, USC, UF or even UA would help UT. CDD has recruited the foundation for the team, just needs a few big play makers on each side of the ball. Especially defense. I think if the season finishes well for UT they will land the players UT needs to start competing for the east again.
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7 wins this coming season, barring another cataclysm of injuries at key positions, and Dooley is done. This team should win 8 at worse. Heck, they probably would have won at least 7 last year had it not been for the injuries: USC, Kentucky, and possibly one of Georgia or Florida. My biggest concern is not with Dooley's recruiting after next season if the wins come in. My biggest concern is that a lot of our key players will defect to the NFL, thus leaving a void for a year or so. If Dooley then takes a step backward in the win dept. in 2013-14, I don't think it will matter what kind of recruiting class he brings in. Another 5 to 6 (maybe even 7) win season in 2013-14 will not cut it, even if he wins 8 to 10 next year. I have no doubt in my mind that Dooley would eventually reel in 8 to 10 wins a year here regularly, given time, but with the first two years he's had, he has a very tight rope for the next couple years at least. One bad season, even if it's preceded by a good season, could spell the end for him. And then we'd just be starting all over. I sincerely hope Dooley succeeds.
 
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#37
#37
volprof said:
7 wins this coming season, barring another cataclysm of injuries at key positions, and Dooley is done. This team should win 8 at worse. Heck, they probably would have won at least 7 last year had it not been for the injuries: USC, Kentucky, and possibly one of Georgia or Florida. My biggest concern is not with Dooley's recruiting after next season if the wins come in. My biggest concern is that a lot of our key players will defect to the NFL, thus leaving a void for a year or so. If Dooley then takes a step backward in the win dept. in 2013-14, I don't think it will matter what kind of recruiting class he brings in. Another 5 to 6 (maybe even 7) win season in 2013-14 will not cut it, even if he wins 8 to 10 next year. I have no doubt in my mind that Dooley would eventually reel in 8 to 10 wins a year here regularly, given time, but with the first two years he's had, he has a very tight rope for the next couple years at least. One bad season, even if it's preceded by a good season, could spell the end for him. And then we'd just be starting all over. I sincerely hope Dooley succeeds.
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It will come down to what he can produce on the field and if he can maintain discipline off the field. Shula for the most part did well on the field but could not control the players off the field. But he did leave Saban with more talent than CDD came into. With the trouble UT has endured through all the coaching changes I doubt the new AD will look to run CDD out anytime soon. No matter how much the fans may want it. UT needs stability if anything. CDD may never win the East or may, who knows, but he will build back up the roster with depth and make UT one of the better teams in the east before long. After that maybe replace him, but getting rid of him now would only be a step back. A step UT can not afford to take.

The funny part about Shula is most UA fans are happy he missed out out on his biggest recruit that he almost got. If Shula could of pulled in Tebow away from UF in the end UA would have never hired Saban and UA would probably be a middle of the pack team in the SEC right now. So sometimes it actually works out missing on the big fish.
 
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#39
#39
keckjm said:
I think another big factor is that everyone else around us has gotten better, way better. Look at Bama, SC, Georgia, FL, LSU, and Auburn. Eight years ago, LSU, Auburn, GA, SC, and Bama were almost guaranteed wins every year for us.
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They all got better by keeping their best players at the in state school, which served to weakened us at the same time they all got better. Not going to be easy (but it is clearly possible) to win titles here as long as Auburn Bama Florida LSU and Georgia are recruiting and winning big (which they all have since Fulmer won the title in 98) all at basically the same time. Dooley has been doing a very good job of stabilizing us and now he is turning things around. But can/will he get over the hump?
 
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#40
#40
Last time I checked the players play the game and not the coaches. It's obvious to anyone with eyes that we haven't had talent on par with the SEC elite since 2003, aka the year Fulmer stopped caring. In fact, that talent has bled over to other teams making South Carolina and the SEC west as a whole more talented then ever. Dooley is bringing it back from the depths of Fulmer's nose dive and Kiffin's utter destruction of our roster. It has taken time but I expect to see the fruits of his labor pay off this year on the field and in turn, pay off in elite recruits off it. We beat someone we're not supposed to this year for once, and probally get beat by someone we should, but that's football. We go 9-3 or 8-4 depending on injuries. GBO!
 
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#41
#41
fade route said:
This.....and the reason they're all better is because they all upgraded in the coaching dept significantly.
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Not sure that makes total sense. LSU has had miles for 7 seasons, and it was Saban before that. Spurrier has been at SC for 7 years too, and Lou Holtz is still considered a pretty good coach. Richt has been at Georgia for 11 seasons. My point: only Bamako and Florida (with Meyer) actually upgraded their coaches during that period. Auburn certainly didn't. Tubby was there from 99 to 08, and I think it's a stretch to call Chizik an upgrade at this point, just because he was the high bidder for Newton.
 
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#43
#43
TideWarrior said:
It will come down to what he can produce on the field and if he can maintain discipline off the field. Shula for the most part did well on the field but could not control the players off the field. But he did leave Saban with more talent than CDD came into. With the trouble UT has endured through all the coaching changes I doubt the new AD will look to run CDD out anytime soon. No matter how much the fans may want it. UT needs stability if anything. CDD may never win the East or may, who knows, but he will build back up the roster with depth and make UT one of the better teams in the east before long. After that maybe replace him, but getting rid of him now would only be a step back. A step UT can not afford to take.

The funny part about Shula is most UA fans are happy he missed out out on his biggest recruit that he almost got. If Shula could of pulled in Tebow away from UF in the end UA would have never hired Saban and UA would probably be a middle of the pack team in the SEC right now. So sometimes it actually works out missing on the big fish.
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Your bottom paragraph touches on my concerns with Dooley exactly. He'll give us consistent winning seasons, something that has become foreign around here lately, but I don't know if he'll be "the" guy. Only time will tell.
 
#44
#44
UGA insider said:
Talent is one thing but you still have to coach them up IMO.

Look at Boise. They had like 6 guys drafted, 2 first rounders if I'm not mistaken. Boise is a team that has nowhere near the resources or ability to attract big time recruits into their program like most SEC schools. Just my two cents.
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Boise doesnt play in the SEC
 
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#46
#46
ChaoticUT said:
Boise doesnt play in the SEC
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But they did beat UGA last year...

Boise is a good team, but truth of the matter...yea they beat Georgia but they can't hack a schedule where you consistently play Georgia, Florida, bama, USCjr, etc every year and be consistent winners. so the argument that they win with less talent is invalid bc they have a pretty easy schedule with the exception of 2 games a year.
 
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#47
#47
spazzyvol said:
But they did beat UGA last year...

Boise is a good team, but truth of the matter...yea they beat Georgia but they can't hack a schedule where you consistently play Georgia, Florida, bama, USCjr, etc every year and be consistent winners. so the argument that they win with less talent is invalid bc they have a pretty easy schedule with the exception of 2 games a year.
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I think Boise's team last year could have won 9 or 10 games if they were in the SEC East and maybe go undefeated if they had UGA's schedule where they did not have to play UA, LSU, and Ark. In the West still a 8 or 9 win team. The real question for Boise with losing so much can they reach that level again.

Boise had one advatage most teams did not last year. Most of their starters, especially their playmakers, were all seniors. In the SEC those guys leave after their junior year.
 
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#48
#48
fade route said:
Agree - solid post. I may be pessemistic, but I've always maintained that Dools deserves this year to prove himself.
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Fade.. that's the first time in a long time that I can recall where I haven't read one of your posts and thought what a miserable a**clown. I think you get too defensive sometimes and go to the extreme when pushed. It was refreshing to see you post something halfway positive. Just my $.02.
 
#49
#49
VolMaster14 said:
I think I see sarcasm here but the people that actually uses this argument makes me sick. That guy had 120 something yards total offense and Kensuckys entire offense had just under or over 200. We lost because our offense couldnt do jacks**t that day.
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I hear u, but with all the resoures we have should we ever lose to kensucky?
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#50
#50
We'll be alright boys. Sit back. Pop the top and enjoy. Football will be exciting again on rocky top.

On the other hand, Boise State and Kellen Moore would be a 6 win team in the SEC. Week in and week out Kellen Moore and his weak arm would get picked like a booger in the SEC. Who can't get up for 1 or 2 games a year. Heck, Utah did against Bama a few years back. All these teams that ESPN blows every year would have a real tough time down here every single week of having to play against the best college football players in the country.
 
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