State of the Program

#26
#26
Your right it doesent.

But....

When they lack on the development side of coaching you never see the potential. Jones already has a strike for being a terrible game day coach he doesent need a recruiting strike or a development strike.

Other wise he's no better than Captain Smith

It's This 1,000%! There is no development of the players. If the players aren't studs their freshman year, then they don't ever grow as players under CBJ. Which is why I don't buy into this ideology that a lot of have written about. Finding diamonds in the rough or foreseeing talent in this three star heavy class and then fine tuning them into something elite. CBJ has not shown that he has this capability in his four years here. Someone posted a spot on assumption in the nsd thread. Butch just signed whoever he could and is hoping that they turn out to be something great. I mean, the CJ Lewis offer early in the off season was enough for me to question what was going on.
 
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#27
#27
I see your points, but at least Butch is making some staff changes...which is a catch-22 around here.

We'll see what kind of coach he is this season.

I like the change at DB coach I think it will be an instant results type hire.

I like Thig as a recruiter but I think he lacks in the coaching part

Who replaces Strip at DL? I know there's a homerun hire being thrown around whose name I can't recall but i doubt Jones goes that route.

Shoop better elevate his game otherwise he could be looking around sooner rather than later
 
#28
#28
The state of the program is better than it has been in over a decade but the mental state of many of you should be analyzed. What we really need is another underwhelming coaching search followed by 4-5 more years of rebuilding
 
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#29
#29
The state of the program is better than it has been in over a decade but the mental state of many of you should be analyzed. What we really need is another underwhelming coaching search followed by 4-5 more years of rebuilding

Because treading water and a decline in ticket sales is any better?

Whether anyone wants to admit it Jones is at his ceiling.
7-9 wins
 
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#30
#30
Last year was much more pivotal than this. Jones needed to win the East or at least better the season record than a year ago. Buy time and earn a rebuilding year. Losing to vandy and uscjr during an up year kills his chance of being kept after a rebuilding year.

I think there is a lot of credence to your theory. 2017 can't be a rebuilding year now. Rather, it must be a reconciliation year that Jones is up to the task. Doesn't matter that the Gators and Bammer are on the road this upcoming year. He must be 1-1 in those two. Doesn't matter LSU is on the schedule. It's a home game Jones will have to win or at least the team plays well. Ditto must have home wins against Georgia, USCe, and Vandy. In fact UT will need to beat the latter two soundly to fix this year's debacle. A loss to GA Tech is potentially disastrous. Hopefully, the hire of the DB Coach from NC will help prep for that critical first game. Kentucky and Mizzou on the road must be wins. Assuming they win their 3 cupcake games that's 10-2 or 11-1 if they could knock off LSU. Very tough but probably necessary to get off hot seat. 9-3 and he remains in the frying pan for another year. 8-4 may not be survivable.
 
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#31
#31
Because treading water and a decline in ticket sales is any better?

Whether anyone wants to admit it Jones is at his ceiling.
7-9 wins

Yeah I would say winning 9 games and being competitive again is much more acceptable than winning 5-7 games. Between 2008-2014, the most UT won in any given season was 7 games; once with Kiffin and the other with Jones. Those years included a span of 4 different head coaches. Between 2000-2008, UT managed to win more than 9 games 3 times and won less than 7 games twice so I am not sure what alternate universe you are living where UT has regularly won more than 9 games a season? It has happened a grand total of 3 times since 2000, nearly a twenty year span. In that same span UT won 6 games or less 5 times so the odds are greater than UT will win 6 games or less as compared to the odds that UT will win 9 or more games.
 
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#33
#33
Yeah I would say winning 9 games and being competitive again is much more acceptable than winning 5-7 games. Between 2008-2014, the most UT won in any given season was 7 games; once with Kiffin and the other with Jones. Those years included a span of 4 different head coaches. Between 2000-2008, UT managed to win more than 9 games 3 times and won less than 7 games twice so I am not sure what alternate universe you are living where UT has regularly won more than 9 games a season? It has happened a grand total of 3 times since 2000, nearly a twenty year span. In that same span UT won 6 games or less 5 times so the odds are greater than UT will win 6 games or less as compared to the odds that UT will win 9 or more games.


Got it. This is history lesson has been brought up in 80% of the threads posted on volnation since October. Thanks for fixing the Dooley catastrophe (seriously). Mike Hamilton was to blame for that, not Dooley. You don't blame your 1 year old for shocking themselves after they put their finger in the electrical socket. It's your fault for allowing that situation to occur...

So all you people will be happy with nothing but 9 win seasons, no cfb playoff appearances, no new years six bowls, losing to muschamp every season, being .500 with vandy, and being known as 3 star u? oh and the life champion award was a very popular joke among other college fanbases (#fail). Because this is what we're going to get on a regular basis.

If he can't find a way to win on the big stage, or at least against the sec west, then he'll eventually be asked to leave. I'm tired of watching the vols play these 4th and 5th best big10 teams at the end of the year.
 
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#35
#35
images
 
#36
#36
Former players, Alumni, and fellow vol fans:

Today on campus, a trainer spent extra time with a student athlete who needed it, and did his/her part to lift the physical ability of an individual to his maximum potential.

An coach flipped on the lights in his film room, and did his part to add to the more than 10 thousand hours of film on opponents.

A coordinator fine-tuned some of the best, most efficient individuals in the world, and did his part to help The University of Tennessee return to a once prominent program.

Today, I speak to you my fellow board members: for it is you, the fans, who make the state of this program strong.

Here are the results of the coaches efforts: The lowest recruiting class rating in over 4 years. A rebounding team who struggled down the stretch. A roster that’s looking to replace individuals leaving for the NFL. More in-state talent than we have ever seen before. And, for the first time in over 2 decades a winning streak in bowl games.

That’s why I believe this is a pivotal year for our program. After four years of grit and determined effort, The University of Tennessee is better-positioned for victory than previous regimes. However, an under performance in 2016, as well as an under performance in recruiting, leaves this program hanging by the thinnest of threads.

The question for everyone in this forum, running through every decision made this year, is whether this staff is going to help or hinder this progress. For several years now, this town has been consumed by a rancorous argument over the proper stars of the recruits, and coaching tactics. It’s an important debate – one that dates back to our the very founding of this board. But, when that debate prevents us from carrying out even the most basic functions of as a fan – when our differences shut down the celebration of our successes, or threaten the full faith and credit of our sources – then we are not doing right by The University of Tennessee.


In the coming months, let’s see where else progress can be made as a program. Let’s make this a year of victory and celebration of success. That’s what most fan want – for all of us in this forum to focus on the position battles, incoming freshmen, and the challenges ahead. And what I believe unites the people of this board, regardless of race or region or party, young or old, rich or poor, is the simple, profound belief in opportunity for all – the notion that if the players work hard and take responsibility, this team will get ahead.

Let’s face it: that belief has suffered some serious blows. Over more than three years, even before this past season hit, massive shifts in fan support had eliminated a lot of good, even-keeled, and rational opinions.

The coaches's jobs are to reverse these trends. It won’t happen right away, and we won’t agree on everything. But what needs to be offered today is a set of concrete, practical proposals to speed up growth, strengthen the fan base, and build new ladders that lead ton unprecedented success at UT. Some require University action, and I’m eager to welcome all courses of action taken to lead toward success. But The University of Tennessee does not stand still – and neither will I. So wherever and whenever I can take steps to expand opportunity for more open-mindedness toward our current state, I'll take it.


So let’s make that decision easier for all involved. Both a sunshine Pumpers and Negavols have argued that our program isnt where it needs to be, is riddled with wasteful, complicated coach speak that punish fans investing time in listening, and reward losses with symbolic recognition of the false titles of Champions of Lufe. Let’s flip that equation. Let’s work together to close those gaps in belief, end those senseless arguments between fans of the same team, and unify behind the common banner of Tennessee.

Many years ago, Butch Jones and staff set out to reverse a negative trend in the success of the UT football program. To that extent, they have succeeded. However, numerous decisions made, a season of lost expectations, and a subpar recruiting class, have left the program at a crossroads. There is no denying the fact that the state of the program has improved. However, the continued success of this program now falls on the coaching of these young individuals. The success of this program no longer falls to the hope of above expectation re ruining classes, and now falls to on the field success.


My fellow fans, times like this remind us that success has never come easy. Our pride, our fandom, has never been easy. Sometimes we stumble; we make mistakes; we get frustrated or discouraged. But for more than one hundred years, we have put those things aside and placed our collective shoulder to the wheel of progress – to create fan traditions unlike any other; to promote competition, and fairness, and good spirtsmanship, so that the words set to paper by our coaching staff are made real for every fan. The program we want for our kids – a rising tradition where hard work is plentiful within the program and fan support are strong; where prosperity is widely shared and opportunity for all lets us go as far as the terrace and sky boxes – none of it is easy. But if we support this team together; if we summon what is best in us, with our feet planted firmly in the stands today, but our eyes cast towards tomorrow – I know solidarity is within our reach. The success of our program rests on Butch Jones, the players, and staff. Let us unify in our support, and let the chips fall where they may.

Inspiring words, but where's your birth certificate?
 
#41
#41
Last year was much more pivotal than this. Jones needed to win the East or at least better the season record than a year ago. Buy time and earn a rebuilding year. Losing to vandy and uscjr during an up year kills his chance of being kept after a rebuilding year.

Record may be the same, but he clearly took a few steps backwards. Division record was worse, blew out SEC weaklings, but struggled with Appy and Ohio..... Complete crap show given the expectations.
 
#42
#42
Got it. This is history lesson has been brought up in 80% of the threads posted on volnation since October. Thanks for fixing the Dooley catastrophe (seriously). Mike Hamilton was to blame for that, not Dooley. You don't blame your 1 year old for shocking themselves after they put their finger in the electrical socket. It's your fault for allowing that situation to occur...

So all you people will be happy with nothing but 9 win seasons, no cfb playoff appearances, no new years six bowls, losing to muschamp every season, being .500 with vandy, and being known as 3 star u? oh and the life champion award was a very popular joke among other college fanbases (#fail). Because this is what we're going to get on a regular basis.

If he can't find a way to win on the big stage, or at least against the sec west, then he'll eventually be asked to leave. I'm tired of watching the vols play these 4th and 5th best big10 teams at the end of the year.

Phil Fulmer went 5-7 in 2008
Lane Kiffin went 7-6 in 2009
Jones went 5-7 in 2013

I am not even going to mention the Dooley years but it wasn't just limited to Dooley
 
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#43
#43
Win the East in 2017. Fan base will be united, especially after losing key players to the draft. Winning solves all problems.
 
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#44
#44
This recruiting class could EASILY be forgiven if Butch hadn't crapped the bed against SC or Vandy.

1 game would have changed everything.

Maybe not. Butch says he had to turn away more talent this year than he ever has. Must have been a lot of 4 *'s out there that Butch had to turn away!:tease2::tease2::tease2::tease2::tease2:
 
#48
#48
Phil Fulmer went 5-7 in 2008
Lane Kiffin went 7-6 in 2009
Jones went 5-7 in 2013

I am not even going to mention the Dooley years but it wasn't just limited to Dooley

Yes... Again...got it. Fulmer also had ten wins and won the east the year before, but that's also irrelevant because we're talking about the current state of the program.

We're mediocre. Which is better than bad
 
#50
#50
Its been moved forward from Dooley.

Its also hit its peak under Jones.

How about some perspective.

Fulmer won 147 games in his 16 year career not counting his partial year when covering for J. Majors.

That is a win average of 9.1875 wins per year.
Butch's career average is 8 wins 7.5 at Tennessee.

Fulmer walked into a dream when taking over at Tennessee Butch didn't. I am not saying that Butch will be a great coach but he still hasn't proven to be horrible one either.

If he continues to win 9 games he isn't going anywhere and that isn't settling for mediocricy either it is the standard that has been set at Tennessee by the most recent successful coach.

So Fulmer had a few 10, 11, and one perfect season but it was still peppered by a few 5's and 8 win seasons. The point is Butch hasn't been here long enough for anyone to be making assumptions about his ability to coach. while many decisions may leave us scratching our heads and we hate all of the coach speak, he came in to the worst situation most coaches ever have to experience, give him time to rebuild and fans shouldn't jump ship at the first sign of adversity. Oh wait this is VolNation it's full of experts, why am I wasting my breath?

Disclaimer: I am not comparing Butch to Fulmer I am simply using it as a point of reference to 9 games being an acceptable average for Tennessee per history.
 
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