Starting 5 on O-line still up in the air per Mahoney today.

#226
#226
Jones, Hall, Kendrick, and Richmond need to get their chance at starting. How can you have a 5 star OT not starting? Hall and Jones both have been impressive in practice. Don't know what Mahoney or Butch have against Kendrick. Thomas and Kerbyson against Oklahoma will be a repeat of last year. Dobbs can hopefully escape the pressure enough and not get hurt.
 
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#227
#227
The amount of people that think Butch and the coaches are "against" or don't "like" a certain player is comical. These guys literally have millions of dollars riding on these positions. You really think Butch forces Mahoney to trot a guy giving up ground and sacks every series over someone that could be the starter because he doesn't like him????

Whoever shows the potential to protect Dobbs and open holes for Hurd and seal the edge for AK will be the starting 5. And these guys want to win so bad they don't care if they played center in high school or last year and are now guard. They just want to play and win.

I personally thought crowder was fine at center and he now knows the plays, lingo and calls I think the real help has to come at the tackles.

Richmond will be good but it's been stated he's not quite ready yet. Key is yet. Come about Georgia he may move his way in.
 
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#228
#228
LWSVOL said:
Fortenberry said this morning they would have liked for Robertson to take the center spot until Jackson went down. They believe it would have made the entire OL better..
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For speculation purposes, if Robertson makes the line better, then wouldn't he still make them better with say Jones/Kendrick @ G, Kerby/Thomas @ T?

I realize Thomas at tackle frightens people...

Edit: doesn't have to be Thomas, just the best available...
 
#229
#229
ButchBallVFL said:
The amount of people that think Butch and the coaches are "against" or don't "like" a certain player is comical. These guys literally have millions of dollars riding on these positions.
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The supposition isn't that Butch and DeBord and Mahoney are playing "teenage princess" with favorites and grossouts.

It's a much subtler thing, one that is part of human nature...one that happens to presidents and corporate CEOs just as easily as it happens to first-line supervisors and squad leaders.

You become convinced, for whatever reason, that person A has the potential to be something special, and you discount all the indicators that, right now, person B is significantly outperforming A. And keeps outperforming him while you keep waiting for A's potential to kick in.

As we discuss this, let's not dumb it down to high school high jinks. It's a more subtle thing than that.
 
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#230
#230
Tackle rotation likely Kerbyson LT, Thomas/Kendrick RT
Guard rotation likely a combination of Robertson/Jones/Kendrick and maybe Weisman
Center rotation likely Crowder/Robertson or Weisman.
That is likely our top seven going into the season.

Richmond/Hall/Mosley are the next three up and could take a spot or two during the season.
 
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#231
#231
What's even more comical than the people thinking that Butch is against some of these guys, is the people acting like they know who's winning the battles based off of a 3 minute practice video. Butch/Mahoney see it for two hours, sometimes more, a day than we do. I'm gonna give them the benefit of the doubt on making decisions around here.
 
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#234
#234
I dont think anybody is saying Butch is avoiding responsibility for the OL.
Look at the prospect of next year's line:
Richmond/Hall/Kendrick/Thomas at tackle
Jones/Mosley/Robertson/Kendrick at guard
Robertson/Weisman at center
all with one more year in the program.
 
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#235
#235
To be fair to CT, I think he does possess the athleticism to play tackle. His inconsistencies lie in his footwork, and to me he does not possess the upper body strength to provide a good punch at first contact. For those of you who are firm believers that he is playing out of position, I do not believe he would make a good center at this point in his career. Again, this goes back to strength, and the other issue being pad level. The kid is 6'6, and I understand that our 2 frosh DTs are freaks of nature, but in the spring game Tuttle walked him around the park 15 yards back (while snapping), and Khalil dumped him in 3-4 steps. I think the kid is also a true sophomore, who only played center in high school, and moving from interior line to a tackle spot is a much different game. Also playing high school and then moving to the best conference in college football, with elite pass rushers is a huge jump. Let the kid mature in program, and let's see what he can do this year. GBO!!!
 
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#236
#236
1standgoal said:
Jones, Hall, Kendrick, and Richmond need to get their chance at starting. How can you have a 5 star OT not starting?
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Are you serious? A freshman starting should be based on his recruiting rankings and not his skill? You think a sports writer who is NOT paid to coach who watches a few minutes of film or attends a camp is better qualified to say a "5*" should start than a coach who works with him for hours every day? Come on. Think some before you post this stuff. If you don't, one of two things will happen. Either you will be the butt of every joke OR you will be ignored completely.

Hall and Jones both have been impressive in practice.
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Reports are that both had positioned themselves to see playing time. But none of us really KNOW who has done what in practice. The details aren't public. Even if the staff were inclined to let fans know, they have good reason not to let opposing teams know.

Thomas and Kerbyson against Oklahoma will be a repeat of last year. Dobbs can hopefully escape the pressure enough and not get hurt.
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We do not know that Thomas is a starter yet or if he is, why.

The same reports that praise Hall and Jones... praise Kerbyson's improvement. He apparently has no serious challenger at LT. In fact, the gap between him and everyone else seems to be so wide that they are struggling with finding a back up.

I personally had hoped that Blair's light would come on or perhaps Richmond might be ready. But by every indication given by the coaches, KK is the LT... and there is no real competition.
 
#238
#238
ButchBallVFL said:
The amount of people that think Butch and the coaches are "against" or don't "like" a certain player is comical. These guys literally have millions of dollars riding on these positions. You really think Butch forces Mahoney to trot a guy giving up ground and sacks every series over someone that could be the starter because he doesn't like him????
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Did you open the link and watch the video I posted earlier?

FWIW, the word "like" is very broad. I don't think anyone is suggesting any bias that might exist has to do with personality.

Whoever shows the potential to protect Dobbs and open holes for Hurd and seal the edge for AK will be the starting 5. And these guys want to win so bad they don't care if they played center in high school or last year and are now guard. They just want to play and win.
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That is true but WITHIN the fallibility of the coaches to accurately determine who the best 5 are. To be absolutely honest, at no point last fall did Thomas look like one of the best 5. The OL got BETTER when he was out.

I personally thought crowder was fine at center and he now knows the plays, lingo and calls I think the real help has to come at the tackles.
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The suggestion from "sources" seems to be that the coaches do not think Crowder is physically talented enough to block SEC DT's. It isn't personal. I don't think anyone questions that his thinking and leadership make the OL better when he's in there.

Richmond will be good but it's been stated he's not quite ready yet. Key is yet. Come about Georgia he may move his way in.
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It appears that Hall and Jones are closer to being ready for the SEC than Richmond. He may need a year of development.
 
#240
#240
berryvol said:
What's even more comical than the people thinking that Butch is against some of these guys, is the people acting like they know who's winning the battles based off of a 3 minute practice video. Butch/Mahoney see it for two hours, sometimes more, a day than we do. I'm gonna give them the benefit of the doubt on making decisions around here.
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I agree with you except in the case of Thomas vs Kendrick. We have the practice videos in which Thomas has looked nothing short of awful. But we also have last year when Kendrick just flat looked better than Thomas but struggled to gain Jones' confidence for whatever reason. Thomas consistently struggled and Jones never seemed to waver on him.
 
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#242
#242
Just watched the OL vs. DL reps from the open practice.

Either our DL is going to be utterly dominant or we are in a tight spot on the OL. It is encouraging that our 1st team OL has to practice against our first team on the DL, but geez. It was right pitiful how bad they were. I feel bad for Coleman Thomas, for sure. The boy is a square peg trying to fit a round hole. We really need to get him to his preferred position. I say Kerbyson (as bad as I hate it) and Kendrick need to be our tackles. They at least have the feet to stay up right.

I really don't want to be a negavol. Never have been. However, if we start Thomas anywhere but C this year, that will speak volumes about our OL. I'd hate to burn these freshmen redshirts, but I'd much rather see a Jack Jones, Chance Hall, or Drew Richmond as RT if they keep Kendrick at LG.

In my uneducated opinion, our front 5 should be:

LT-Kerbyson (burns to type)
LG-Mosley (seems like he is getting it)
C-Crowder (IT HURTS!)
RG-Robertson (All-American this year)
RT-Kendrick (think he fits better at LT, but what do I know...)

Go Vols!
 
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#243
#243
SoMissVol said:
In my uneducated opinion, our front 5 should be:

LT-Kerbyson (burns to type)
LG-Mosley (seems like he is getting it)
C-Crowder (IT HURTS!)
RG-Robertson (All-American this year)
RT-Kendrick (think he fits better at LT, but what do I know...)

Go Vols!
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SoMiss, I couldn't help but notice that you put Mosley at LG. You'll need to go back and watch some more tape. Sad but true.
 
#244
#244
1standgoal said:
Jones, Hall, Kendrick, and Richmond need to get their chance at starting. How can you have a 5 star OT not starting? Hall and Jones both have been impressive in practice. Don't know what Mahoney or Butch have against Kendrick. Thomas and Kerbyson against Oklahoma will be a repeat of last year. Dobbs can hopefully escape the pressure enough and not get hurt.
Click to expand...

There have been plenty of 5 star players that never performed better tham a 2 star in college. OJ Owens example number one.
 
#245
#245
SoMissVol said:
Just watched the OL vs. DL reps from the open practice.

Either our DL is going to be utterly dominant or we are in a tight spot on the OL. It is encouraging that our 1st team OL has to practice against our first team on the DL, but geez. It was right pitiful how bad they were. I feel bad for Coleman Thomas, for sure. The boy is a square peg trying to fit a round hole. We really need to get him to his preferred position. I say Kerbyson (as bad as I hate it) and Kendrick need to be our tackles. They at least have the feet to stay up right.

I really don't want to be a negavol. Never have been. However, if we start Thomas anywhere but C this year, that will speak volumes about our OL. I'd hate to burn these freshmen redshirts, but I'd much rather see a Jack Jones, Chance Hall, or Drew Richmond as RT if they keep Kendrick at LG.

In my uneducated opinion, our front 5 should be:

LT-Kerbyson (burns to type)
LG-Mosley (seems like he is getting it)
C-Crowder (IT HURTS!)
RG-Robertson (All-American this year)
RT-Kendrick (think he fits better at LT, but what do I know...)

Go Vols!
Click to expand...
Thomas can't play center. He would be going up against players like McKenzie more often, and he got flattened. At tackle it is more of dealing with rushers off the end, and we know he pretty much struggled at this as well.
Sure, players can improve, but you have to wonder why Weisman and Sanders (highly recruited guys) haven't even cracked the line-up.
 
#246
#246
SoMissVol said:
Just watched the OL vs. DL reps from the open practice.

Either our DL is going to be utterly dominant or we are in a tight spot on the OL. It is encouraging that our 1st team OL has to practice against our first team on the DL, but geez. It was right pitiful how bad they were. I feel bad for Coleman Thomas, for sure. The boy is a square peg trying to fit a round hole. We really need to get him to his preferred position. I say Kerbyson (as bad as I hate it) and Kendrick need to be our tackles. They at least have the feet to stay up right.

I really don't want to be a negavol. Never have been. However, if we start Thomas anywhere but C this year, that will speak volumes about our OL. I'd hate to burn these freshmen redshirts, but I'd much rather see a Jack Jones, Chance Hall, or Drew Richmond as RT if they keep Kendrick at LG.

In my uneducated opinion, our front 5 should be:

LT-Kerbyson (burns to type)
LG-Mosley (seems like he is getting it)
C-Crowder (IT HURTS!)
RG-Robertson (All-American this year)
RT-Kendrick (think he fits better at LT, but what do I know...)

Go Vols!
Click to expand...

I have not watched second one of any video. I have never even seen recruiting video of any player on our roster.

I will be shocked if the OL is not this way left to right.

Kerbyson
Robertson
Crowder
Jones
Thomas

Injuries will be the only thing that will change that. Staff will cringe if they have another injury.

JMO
 
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#247
#247
LWSVOL said:
I have not watched second one of any video. I have never even seen recruiting video of any player on our roster.

I will be shocked if the OL is not this way left to right.

Kerbyson
Robertson
Crowder
Jones
Thomas

Injuries will be the only thing that will change that. Staff will cringe if they have another injury.

JMO
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Keep Roberston at RG.. If we flipped him.. 3 new starting positions
 
#248
#248
Biopsyman said:
Keep Roberston at RG.. If we flipped him.. 3 new starting positions
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I think their thought process goes like this:

Dobbs has proven to be very elusive against pass rush if he can see it coming. He's right handed. So that means right side of line can be more porous than left, and we're still ok.

So it's kind of an extension of the LT blindside protection mindset to apply to the LG as well. Which makes a lot of sense with a spread, zone-blocking offensive line, when you think about it.

And that's how, I believe, Robertson ends up at LG in spite of the fact that he played RG last year. He's the absolute best inside lineman we have, so there he goes.
 
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#249
#249
VFL-82-JP said:
I think their thought process goes like this:

Dobbs has proven to be very elusive against pass rush if he can see it coming. He's right handed. So that means right side of line can be more porous than left, and we're still ok.

So it's kind of an extension of the LT blindside protection mindset to apply to the LG as well. Which makes a lot of sense with a spread, zone-blocking offensive line, when you think about it.

And that's how, I believe, Robertson ends up at LG in spite of the fact that he played RG last year. He's the absolute best inside lineman we have, so there he goes.
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Has more to do with who the fifth guy is and easiest position for him. That being Jones. Don't over think it in the whole offense. Just trying to find the best five that can play together in the line is the priority
 
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