Starters That Kiffin Recruited

#453
#453
Just saying...He specifically said that we are worse than we were with Fulmer, yet neither year's final record backs up his bold claim.
 
#454
#454
crusse10 said:
Just saying...He specifically said that we are worse than we were with Fulmer, yet neither year's final record backs up his bold claim.
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Wow, are you sure you're at UT? If so, education has really, really slipped. Might be time to start sending the donations straight to the academic fund.

Let's see, two years of data, but you choose to look at one year. Over two years, it ain't even close, and Fulmer is a runaway winner.

Second, 2008 has an outlier, namely Hambone was responsible for the losses after the firing. His machinations in firing Fulmer in mid-season happened to work, and he is responsible for any loss after that point.

Third, Kiffin inherited a team which would put 7 players into the NFL that year. He inherited a deeper, more experienced team. Fulmer would have won 9 games with that team; Kiffin won seven and included absolutely embarrassing losses.

Fourth, Fulmer's class of 2009 was better than the one Kiffin brought in and better suited to team needs. Kiffin destroyed it, and then ran off several players who would be starting this weekend. His 2009 class was the biggest bust of the decade.

I have to wonder now whether you are even at UT. You exhibit none of the education or thinking skills I received many years ago at UT.

Oh, and you continue to pile on your embarrassment by continuing to evade the questions. I don't remember "Ducking and Dodging" being part of the UT curriculum.
 
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#456
#456
utvolpj said:
That's your source for Coleman being an NFL player? Did you happen to click on the 'About' link?
Posted via VolNation Mobile
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Will he or won't he be drafted?

Easy question, but obviously easily evaded by the GoF and their candle-lighting acolytes.

Plenty of links besides that utpjvol. Digging your own nadir even deeper.
 
#457
#457
you linked a 20yo random blogger (with no NFL expertise) from Beloit College and I'm digging a hole?

if he gets drafted he will do no more in the NFL than Crompton
 
#458
#458
thunder5 said:
Here's a more accurate depiction of what the OP was getting at:

Starters recruited exclusively by Fulmer and staff (23%)
Poole
Thomas
Martin
A. Johnson
Waggner

Starters recruited exclusively by Kiffin and staff (18%)
Bray
Fugate
James
Fulton

Starters recruited exclusively by Dooley and staff (23%)
Rivera
Jackson (yes...transfer or not this player was absolutely recruited to come here by Dooley and Thompson)
Maggitt
Coleman
Brewer

Starters recruited by some combination of the 3 staffs (32%)
Hunter (Kiffin/Dooley)
Rogers (Kiffin/Dooley)
Stone (Kiffin/Dooley)
Smith (Fulmer/Kiffin/Dooley)
Hood (Fulmer/Kiffin)
AJ Johnson (Kiffin/Dooley)
Teague (Fulmer/Kiffin)

Starter who approached Dooley and staff about transferring here (4%)
Bullard (not sure why this woulnd't count for Dooley but whatever)

Dooley had all or some part in landing 11 of our starters....Kiffin had all or some part in landing 11....Fulmer had all or some part in landing 8

Pretty much what you would expect when a team has had 3 coaches over the span of 4 recruiting classes
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How did this post not get quoted.

This is the only thing factual in this entire thread.
 
#459
#459
utvolpj said:
you linked a 20yo random blogger (with no NFL expertise) from Beloit College and I'm digging a hole?

if he gets drafted he will do no more in the NFL than Crompton
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Dodging and irrelevant besides. Yes or no, will he get drafted?

LOTS of links to choose from, utpjvol.

B.J. Coleman, Chattanooga, NFL Draft - CBSSports.com - NFLDraftScout.com

B.J. Coleman*|*Tennessee-Chattanooga,*QB*:*2012 NFL Draft Scout Player Profile

B.J. Coleman, coaches like QB's shot at NFL GoVolsXtra

Bj Coleman 2012 NFL Draft Profile - ESPN
 
#461
#461
Ericvol2096 said:
How did this post not get quoted.

This is the only thing factual in this entire thread.
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It was solid. I think this post though, relative to SEC norms, took the cake.

VegasVol said:
The best standard is to look at starters by recruiting class as compared to SEC norms.

SEC Norms on 2011 Starting Rosters:
2007 Class: 2
2008 Class: 5
2009 Class: 9
2010 Class: 6
2011 Class: 2

UT-2011
2007 Class: 1 (Kiffin lost potential starters Creer & Coleman)
2008 Class: 6 (Walls was a sign-and-place player from this class; Lathers is a starter when he returns)
2009 Class: 2 (Teague & Hood)
2010 Class: 10 (Kiffin landed 5 that I can credit to him)
2011 Class: 3

So, by SEC expectations, you would expect each coach's contributions to the 2011 starting roster to be as follows:

Fulmer: 7
Kiffin: 12
Dooley: 5

Instead, what we have is:

Fulmer: 7 (despite several likely starters lost by Kiffin)
Kiffin: 7 (almost half of what it should be)
Dooley: 8 (above expectations)

From a 4-Year Perspective:
% of Recruits Who Became Starters
Fulmer 2007/2008: 40%
Kiffin 2009/2010: 20%
Dooley 2010/2011: 40%

Kiffin is the weak-link in starter-impact on this roster.
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#462
#462
utgibbs said:
Wow, are you sure you're at UT? If so, education has really, really slipped. Might be time to start sending the donations straight to the academic fund.

Let's see, two years of data, but you choose to look at one year. Over two years, it ain't even close, and Fulmer is a runaway winner.

Second, 2008 has an outlier, namely Hambone was responsible for the losses after the firing. His machinations in firing Fulmer in mid-season happened to work, and he is responsible for any loss after that point.

Third, Kiffin inherited a team which would put 7 players into the NFL that year. He inherited a deeper, more experienced team. Fulmer would have won 9 games with that team; Kiffin won seven and included absolutely embarrassing losses.

Fourth, Fulmer's class of 2009 was better than the one Kiffin brought in and better suited to team needs. Kiffin destroyed it, and then ran off several players who would be starting this weekend. His 2009 class was the biggest bust of the decade.

I have to wonder now whether you are even at UT. You exhibit none of the education or thinking skills I received many years ago at UT.

Oh, and you continue to pile on your embarrassment by continuing to evade the questions. I don't remember "Ducking and Dodging" being part of the UT curriculum.
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Dude, c'mon, let reality be your friend. Here is the reality of Fulmer's last FOUR seasons.

2005 (no Cutcliffe): an unmitigated disaster with a preseason top-5 squad finishing with a losing record.

2006-07: Cutcliffe comes back and saves Fulmer from himself with respectable finishes. Nothing stellar, but still respectable.

2008: Cutcliffe is gone, and Fulmer once again has nobody to save him. Another unmitigated disaster with the second losing season out of the last four. AND, and a big AND at that, the second straight losing season without Cutcliffe around to save Fulmer.

Furthermore, the program is showing the signs of poor recruiting. The program is clearly in the abyss and Fulmer does not have any kind of clue as to how to turn it around except to "work like heck" at "staying the course" even though the course has been disastrous.

Had Fulmer remained coach, we would be much closer to 3-9 than 8-4.
 
#465
#465
utgibbs said:
Wow, are you sure you're at UT? If so, education has really, really slipped. Might be time to start sending the donations straight to the academic fund.

Let's see, two years of data, but you choose to look at one year. Over two years, it ain't even close, and Fulmer is a runaway winner.

Second, 2008 has an outlier, namely Hambone was responsible for the losses after the firing. His machinations in firing Fulmer in mid-season happened to work, and he is responsible for any loss after that point.

Third, Kiffin inherited a team which would put 7 players into the NFL that year. He inherited a deeper, more experienced team. Fulmer would have won 9 games with that team; Kiffin won seven and included absolutely embarrassing losses.

Fourth, Fulmer's class of 2009 was better than the one Kiffin brought in and better suited to team needs. Kiffin destroyed it, and then ran off several players who would be starting this weekend. His 2009 class was the biggest bust of the decade.

I have to wonder now whether you are even at UT. You exhibit none of the education or thinking skills I received many years ago at UT.

Oh, and you continue to pile on your embarrassment by continuing to evade the questions. I don't remember "Ducking and Dodging" being part of the UT curriculum.
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You talk about data, then rely on hypothetics for your argument. Neither year was as bad as Fulmer's final year. I like to call that a fact.

I question whether you went to grade school. I mean, that's when remedial vocabulary was taught. Data is tangible, like showing what did happen, not showing what you think could have happened.
 
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#466
#466
crusse10 said:
You talk about data, then rely on hypothetics for your argument. Neither year was as bad as Fulmer's final year. I like to call that a fact.
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I wonder if Vegas would be willing to pull any stats about the depth and experience the 2008 team had compared to the 2009 and 2010 teams.
 
#467
#467
tvolsfan said:
I wonder if Vegas would be willing to pull any stats about the depth and experience the 2008 team had compared to the 2009 and 2010 teams.
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Well, the 2009 team put 7 guys in the pros....

2008 saw three guys drafted (thanks, LWS).

A fact suggesting 2009's team was deeper and more experienced, and, in fact, one of the most indicative markers for team success. Except, obviously, when coached by Lane Kiffin, as all the facts indicate. Of course, any freakin' Vol fan knew 2009 was deeper and more experienced, except of course those blinded by ideology.

Looking back on the talent Kiffin ran off too, it boggles the mind, actually.
 
#468
#468
utgibbs said:
Well, the 2009 team put 7 guys in the pros....

2008 saw three guys drafted (thanks, LWS).

A fact suggesting 2009's team was deeper and more experienced,
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No SEC team that is forced to play identical 260 lb twins at Guard and Center is what I would call "deep".
 
#469
#469
GAVol said:
No SEC team that is forced to play identical 260 lb twins at Guard and Center is what I would call "deep".
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The statement you quoted is absolutely hilarious. How many of the guys on the 2009 team that made it to the pros came in after the 2008 season?

And Gibbs seems to forget that Arian Foster wasn't drafted but made the pros anyways. Speaks volumes to his coaching.
 
#470
#470
crusse10 said:
You talk about data, then rely on hypothetics for your argument. Neither year was as bad as Fulmer's final year. I like to call that a fact.

I question whether you went to grade school. I mean, that's when remedial vocabulary was taught. Data is tangible, like showing what did happen, not showing what you think could have happened.
Click to expand...

Wow. At some point you dig down so deep into a nadir that you must start coming back up on the other side of the planet. You really don't understand this stuff, do you?

Remind me which two year period has been as bad as this one?

2005 - 2006 = 14 - 11

2007 - 2008 = 15 - 12

2009 - 2010 = 13 - 13

Hellfire, boy, 1979 - 1980 was still over 0.500!

Game, Set, and Match. Wipe your nose, junior. You have been played.

PS - 2008 is not a fact. It is actually an outlier. :eek:lol:
 
#471
#471
tvolsfan said:
The statement you quoted is absolutely hilarious. How many of the guys on the 2009 team that made it to the pros came in after the 2008 season?

And Gibbs seems to forget that Arian Foster wasn't drafted but made the pros anyways. Speaks volumes to his coaching.
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Four NFL'ers. I stand corrected.

Sullin boys beat out the Kiffin recruits....

In addition, the board has a long-standing illusion that o-lines are imperative. Dooley has other thoughts.
 
#472
#472
utgibbs said:
Wow. At some point you dig down so deep into a nadir that you must start coming back up on the other side of the planet. You really don't understand this stuff, do you?

Remind me which two year period has been as bad as this one?

2005 - 2006 = 14 - 11

2007 - 2008 = 15 - 12

2009 - 2010 = 13 - 13

Hellfire, boy, 1979 - 1980 was still over 0.500!

Game, Set, and Match. Wipe your nose, junior. You have been played.

PS - 2008 is not a fact. It is actually an outlier. :eek:lol:
Click to expand...

Fulmer's last two seasons without Cutcliffe (2005 and 2008): 10-14. Pathetic.
 
#473
#473
utgibbs said:
Well, the 2009 team put 7 guys in the pros....

2008 saw three guys drafted (thanks, LWS).

A fact suggesting 2009's team was deeper and more experienced, and, in fact, one of the most indicative markers for team success. Except, obviously, when coached by Lane Kiffin, as all the facts indicate. Of course, any freakin' Vol fan knew 2009 was deeper and more experienced, except of course those blinded by ideology.

Looking back on the talent Kiffin ran off too, it boggles the mind, actually.
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LOL..it only boggles the mind of the severely uninformed. If they were so talented, then why aren't they making contributions at BCS schools.

BTW, Kiffin didn't run Creer or Paige off. They both left on their own account and neither contributed jack while they were here.
 
#475
#475
utgibbs said:
Wow. At some point you dig down so deep into a nadir that you must start coming back up on the other side of the planet. You really don't understand this stuff, do you?

Remind me which two year period has been as bad as this one?

2005 - 2006 = 14 - 11

2007 - 2008 = 15 - 12

2009 - 2010 = 13 - 13

Hellfire, boy, 1979 - 1980 was still over 0.500!

Game, Set, and Match. Wipe your nose, junior. You have been played.

PS - 2008 is not a fact. It is actually an outlier. :eek:lol:
Click to expand...

2008
5-7 with a loss to Wyoming. It's in the books so please don't tell that famous lie that it's Hamilton's fault we lost to Wyoming. Your boy Phillip made them fire him. Hamilton wanted Phillip to retire at the end of the season but Phillip wouldn't have any of that. He wasn't going to go out with class like Lloyd Carr. Fulmer wanted the presser so he could talk delusionally about himself and his accomplishments. It was worse than pathetic.

For the record, I can't stand Kiffin and think he is a punk. That doesn't diminish the fact the program was slowly sinking under Fulmer. Facts are facts.
 
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