Speed?

#29
#29
Volfan_TrappedN_KY said:
Stephaun Raines would eat his lunch


Your going to see speed next year.
Meline, Thompkins are both above average fast.
If we can pull Robert Clark and Demar Dorsey from Florida it would make Willie Gault proud.
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I want Dorsey here more than any of the other DB prospects.
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#31
#31
I think we will see a lot more speed in the future, especailly on defense. Our base defense, for instance, calls for the middle linebacker to have responsibility for the deep middle of the field, not the either one of the safeties. You can't run the defense without a lot of speed.

Monte will recruit to our needs...smaller, faster guys. A good example would be a defense like the Colts.
 
#33
#33
JayGunna said:
Art 10.3 100m
Raines 10.6 100m

art 21.5 200m
Raines 22.7 200m
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Keep in mind, track speed is different than football speed. I saw Zach Rodgers run on the track and that guy is fast, but that is much different than football speed. I can't remember the receiver's name or what team, but he was considered "slow" but still caught 3 td passed and well over 100 yards. I want to say it was BGU or something. They said the guy ran a 4.65 40 and that he would need to drop it to get drafted but still made plays.
 
#34
#34
I still think Art Evans could figure it out and become a very solid corner with the two years he has left under Garza and Monte.
 
#35
#35
orangebloodgmc said:
I am not disputing these numbers, but this does surprise me a little bit. Evans really is our fastest db?
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I'm very dubious about those numbers. A 10.3 anything would be one of the fastest HS times in the nation. I can't find a listing for Evans anywhere in the national track listings. He's obviously fast, but I seriously question he's close to 10.3 fast.

More to the overall topic it's not that LD is wrong in liking the idea of more speed but he can be awfully bad in making it sound like speed makes you a good football player. Lots of people clamored for Paige to be on the field last year because he was highly touted and, of course, fast. He was sitting then and isn't even on the team now. O'Neal actually was a 10.3 guy and, well, you know the story. Leonard Scott anyone? Any chance we learn a lesson from this?

Get guys that can ball first and foremost or even a 4.00 40 will only do you so much. People keep mentioning Coker, who, while nowhere near as fast as many believed him to be, was (is) pretty fleet. His loss was lamented as losing a "big play guy". In his 494 carry career at both here and Hampton Coker tallied 15 runs over 20yds and 5 over 40yds. That bane of LD's "speed first" philosophy, Arian Foster, in his first 491 carries had 14 runs over 20 and 4 over 40. I'm hardly bowled over by how much more of a threat to break a longer run Coker showed himself to be in spite of an obvious speed advantage. I think vision and quickness (which is not necessarily synonymous with speed) are huge factors. If you can't manage to get your speed out where it'll do you some good (Chris Johnson/Dexter McCluster/etc) you're chances to show off your NOS button will be few and far between. Same thing in a receiver if he can't run good routes and catch the ball. Wes Welker is the NFL's #1 WR in catches and #2 in yardage and if he is a sub 4.5 guy then I run a 3.7.

LD, I can appreciate you like speed in a football player. Can you at least try a little harder not to make it sound, even if it's not actually your intent to do so, that being fast MAKES you a good football player?
 
#36
#36
hndog609 said:
I'm very dubious about those numbers. A 10.3 anything would be one of the fastest HS times in the nation. I can't find a listing for Evans anywhere in the national track listings. He's obviously fast, but I seriously question he's close to 10.3 fast.

More to the overall topic it's not that LD is wrong in liking the idea of more speed but he can be awfully bad in making it sound like speed makes you a good football player. Lots of people clamored for Paige to be on the field last year because he was highly touted and, of course, fast. He was sitting then and isn't even on the team now. O'Neal actually was a 10.3 guy and, well, you know the story. Leonard Scott anyone? Any chance we learn a lesson from this?

Get guys that can ball first and foremost or even a 4.00 40 will only do you so much. People keep mentioning Coker, who, while nowhere near as fast as many believed him to be, was (is) pretty fleet. His loss was lamented as losing a "big play guy". In his 494 carry career at both here and Hampton Coker tallied 15 runs over 20yds and 5 over 40yds. That bane of LD's "speed first" philosophy, Arian Foster, in his first 491 carries had 14 runs over 20 and 4 over 40. I'm hardly bowled over by how much more of a threat to break a longer run Coker showed himself to be in spite of an obvious speed advantage. I think vision and quickness (which is not necessarily synonymous with speed) are huge factors. If you can't manage to get your speed out where it'll do you some good (Chris Johnson/Dexter McCluster/etc) you're chances to show off your NOS button will be few and far between. Same thing in a receiver if he can't run good routes and catch the ball. Wes Welker is the NFL's #1 WR in catches and #2 in yardage and if he is a sub 4.5 guy then I run a 3.7.

LD, I can appreciate you like speed in a football player. Can you at least try a little harder not to make it sound, even if it's not actually your intent to do so, that being fast MAKES you a good football player?
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This is my philosophy here: having speed will not get you beat but not having speed will get you beat to sleep. Teaching the players how to read and control their physical tools is on the coaches. There are two things that a coach can't teach though. And they are SPEED and HEART.
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#37
#37
Lockdown1 said:
There are two things that a coach can't teach though. And they are SPEED and HEART.
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.


Speed makes up for missteps, or a bad play call.
I dont think its a secret that the teams in the top 20 are LACED with Speed, even at some of the Defensive Line spots.

those speed guys are difference makers. they bring an added dimension to the game.
a Fast WR opens Running Lanes for RBs and opens the middle of the field for Possession WRs and TEs.

Its No coincidence that Randy Moss gets Coverages and safeties rolled to his side thus allowing Wes Welker run free over the middle

you tell me, who would you rather have; a Slow WR with superior talent and skill, or a Fast WR with the same superior talent and skill? ....
 
#38
#38
JayGunna said:
.


Speed makes up for missteps, or a bad play call.
I dont think its a secret that the teams in the top 20 are LACED with Speed, even at some of the Defensive Line spots.

those speed guys are difference makers. they bring an added dimension to the game.
a Fast WR opens Running Lanes for RBs and opens the middle of the field for Possession WRs and TEs.

Its No coincidence that Randy Moss gets Coverages and safeties rolled to his side thus allowing Wes Welker run free over the middle

you tell me, who would you rather have; a Slow WR with superior talent and skill, or a Fast WR with the same superior talent and skill? ....
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I don't think anybody is arguing the points you make, especially the last one, but I think something got lost in translation. The problem isn't what you address, it's that there are people out there that will honest to God try to insist that player X is better than player Y for no reason OTHER than X is faster. Same kind of mindset that will argue QB X is better than QB Y for no other reason than X has a stronger arm. Or how lineman X can bench 500lbs or some BB player has a 40+" vertical. Hey, that's great. It's an asset. It never makes player X even a good player unless there's more to it than that.

Ryan Leaf had a cannon for an arm and Jerry Rice never ran a 4.4 forty in his life. It's pushing some singular aspect, whatever that might be, while ignoring everything else that can get out of hand. If you want examples and have the time to search there's many a post on this site that will read something along the lines of "The coaches are idiots because they won't play (whoever) who is faster than (whoever is playing currently)." Dosn't matter if the coaches spend all week at practice watching this guy miss assignments, drop passes, miss tackles, run lazy routes, etc. Nope, he's faster and coaches are idiots for not playing them.
 
#39
#39
Lockdown1 said:
We really need what I love the most: Speed. Fulmer's recruiting as of late was horrible. Did you see the young VT players? They aren't big names but they were great athletes with a lot of speed. Beamer and crew do a great job of evaluating talent and not stars. We got to see that first hand last night.
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Agreed. You look at the dominant programs over the last 5-10 years and you see those coaches putting emphasis on speed. Meyer and Pete Carol seem like they are always talking about a goal of being the fastest team at every position. Speed wins.

I remember watching the Ohio State v. Fla. national championship a few years ago and Ohio State's skill players were SEC type speedsters, but where UF seemed to kill them was at DE and linebacker where UF was much faster. Thats what some teams don't get - speed needs to be at every position, not just skill players. Heck, look at some of our LB's over the years that have dominated because of their speed.
 
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