Speaking my peace

[volbrian]

Originally posted by Liper@Nov 1, 2005 4:04 PM
Right, to this point Sanders offered it up.

Are you really trying to suggest that changes are not being forced on Fulmer at the end of the year?  We'll see if that one sticks.

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In no way am I saying that. CPF is paid to understand and keep tabs on where the program is, not you or I. To insinuate that he wouldnt make changes at the end of the year, well, that WONT stick.

Watch as the real problem areas will be dealt with at the end of the season. Next year, everyone will see what a difference execution is, as opposed to playcalling.

 

[WA_Vol]

IMO many people on this message board would have traded places with Randy Sanders in a heartbeat. He is highly paid, for doing something that most people in here would love to have an opportunity to do. Coach football at UT.

A lot of people on this message board come in here to vent, I sincerely doubt if the people in Knoxville are basing their decisions on what is being said in these message boards. Most people here take what is said with a grain of salt. Its a place to voice an anonymous opinion, thats all.

Granted I know its tough being a coach, and dealing with fans etc, but these guys again are well rewarded. How many coaches have put in 22 years at one school in the sec??? I dont think anyone here can think of any.

I would have liked for Sanders to have stayed on as a position coach, most people who seemed to agree. No one here has personal issues with Randy Sanders. By all accounts hes a stand up guy. He got blamed for a lot more then he should have. Again, thats why hes well paid.

No one on these message boards had one iota of influence on what happens on the field at UT. Its not fair to blame this message board for the teams lack of success. The only people responsible for the success or failure of that team is the coaching staff and the players. Dont blame the message board for Sanders resigned. I doubt there are even a dozen people on this board who have even met Sanders. Much less said a cross word to him.

 

[Lexvol]

Originally posted by volbrian@Nov 1, 2005 4:20 PM
In no way am I saying that.  CPF is paid to understand and keep tabs on where the program is, not you or I.  To insinuate that he wouldnt make changes at the end of the year, well, that WONT stick.

Watch as the real problem areas will be dealt with at the end of the season.  Next year, everyone will see what a difference execution is, as opposed to playcalling.

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There is a big difference between execution and playcalling, but their relationship is undeniable as well.

If you telegraph your plays, or become preditcable enough with your tendencies, defenses are able to make it harder to execute.

 

[Liper]

Originally posted by volbrian@Nov 1, 2005 4:17 PM
If you want to call some of the things said about Sanders "Critiquing", go ahead. 

btw, that particular post wasnt directed directly at you.  It was just the general "we need to point fingers" mentality.

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Well, I apologize if it is wasn't directed at me. It certainly appeared that way.

BTW, I really have no use for the personal stuff. I don't think you'll find me doing that; it's a waste of time.

We needed coaching changes, and some of us have stated why on a professional level. Those that disagree do.

 

[Liper]

Originally posted by volbrian@Nov 1, 2005 4:20 PM
In no way am I saying that.  CPF is paid to understand and keep tabs on where the program is, not you or I.  To insinuate that he wouldnt make changes at the end of the year, well, that WONT stick.

Watch as the real problem areas will be dealt with at the end of the season.  Next year, everyone will see what a difference execution is, as opposed to playcalling.

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That's what I'm saying. It's not playcalling, per se, but rather the execution of those plays on a conistent basis. However, I believe with the right talent that this is the sole purvue of coaching. Players wearing certain helmets don't magically execute better or worse than players wearing different helmets. The reason is coaching, and it always has been.

If players executing was just a matter of players getting it done, then there would be no difference in coaching, and we wouldn't have Fulmer and Sanders supporters (because they would have already admitted that coaching isn't a factor aside from recruiting).

 

[Vol67]

Sanders is a good family man and a good guy, plus a decent position coach but he is not a good OC.

This is not whether he can call good plays or not, its about ownership. Any OC worth his salt takes ownership of the offense and either Sanders didn't or allowed Fulmer to keep most of the control. HE allowed Fulmer to put him in this perdictament, HE allowed Fulmer to keep assistants that were not good enough. HE should have stood up to Fulmer and said give me control or get someone else 5 years ago, HE should have pushed his point about inferior Offensive coaches.

He is as much at fault as Fulmer is

 

[Lexvol]

Good point. He should be accountable for those around him. The offensive staff is obviously inadequate, he should have insisted on doing some hiring himself.

 

[VolsWinRLose]

I am downright weary of the suggestion that the problem with the Vols' season can be solely attributed to "execution." If the players haven't been executing for this long, I'd expect any coach worth his salt to do something about it.

What it comes down to is the willingness and the ability to teach them to execute and then to do what's necessary if they screw up. It doesn't appear that RS was getting the job done on one front or the other, and it was his place to do so. PF is in the same position - if one of his coaches isn't getting it done, a change has to be made. If none of this was RS' fault, then I hope he goes on to prove us wrong and has a good time doing it.

There are a******s in every group of people. Apparently, some of them thought it was okay to work out on RS and his family in the personal arena. I'm sorry that those people weren't flushed at birth, but their behavior isn't something that I (or, I daresay, anybody on this board) am responsible for in any way.

 

[Liper]

Originally posted by VolsWinRLose@Nov 1, 2005 8:56 PM
I am downright weary of the suggestion that the problem with the Vols' season can be solely attributed to "execution."  If the players haven't been executing for this long, I'd expect any coach worth his salt to do something about it.

What it comes down to is the willingness and the ability to teach them to execute and then to do what's necessary if they screw up. It doesn't appear that RS was getting the job done on one front or the other, and it was his place to do so. PF is in the same position - if one of his coaches isn't getting it done, a change has to be made. If none of this was RS' fault, then I hope he goes on to prove us wrong and has a good time doing it.

There are a******s in every group of people. Apparently, some of them thought it was okay to work out on RS and his family in the personal arena. I'm sorry that those people weren't flushed at birth, but their behavior isn't something that I (or, I daresay, anybody on this board) am responsible for in any way.

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The sweet, sweet, sweet sound of logic ringing through the VolNation. Oh, oh how I love it so.

 

[almostavol]

From the Chattanooga Times Free Press (11/01/05)...........

QBs’ dads laud ousted coordinator
By Darren Epps Staff Writer

KNOXVILLE — David and Janet Crompton called in sick to work Monday morning.
Then they received a text message from Randy Sanders and really felt ill.
"Things are happening down here in a hurry,"
Sanders wrote to David Crompton.
The Cromptons immediately drove to Knoxville from their home in Waynesville, N.C. They joined their son, Tennessee freshman quarterback Jonathan Crompton, and heard from Sanders that he was resigning as UT’s offensive coordinator.
"It’s a very bad day," David Crompton said. "A lot of Tennessee fans don’t realize Randy Sanders is a heck of a guy and a heck of a football coach. The program lost a lot. Our family is pretty emotional.
"I’m not saying Jonathan is not going to work like heck, because he will. But the program lost a great football coach."
The father of UT sophomore quarterback Erik Ainge expressed similar sentiments.
"I think it’s unfortunate, because one of the main reasons Erik went to Tennessee was the quality of the coaching staff, and in particular Randy," Doug Ainge said. "But the offense has been inefficient all season, no matter who is in the game at quarterback. Plus, there were fumbles, dropped passes and passes that no one even made a play on. Something had to be done, and it’s too bad that in big-time college athletics, somebody had to take the hit."
Crompton, one of the most highly rated quarterbacks in last year’s class, turned down overtures from South Carolina’s Steve Spurrier and many other schools to sign with Tennessee for one main reason: Sanders. Crompton is redshirting this year after undergoing surgery on a torn labrum.
"Jonathan was very loyal to Randy," David Crompton said. "He told a heck of a lot of people no because he believed in Randy. He told some pretty high-profile quarterback guys, ‘Thank you, but no thank you.’ But It’s a performance industry and it’s a tough business. What do you do?" What Crompton will not do is transfer, his dad said. As rumors circulated across message boards over the weekend, David Crompton was adamant that his son would remain at Tennessee. None of the offensive players were available to the media Monday.
"Jonathan will work very hard for whomever they hire, and I’m sure they’ll hire a great coach," David Crompton said. "But I’m really disappointed he won’t get a chance to get after it for Coach Sanders."
Speculation around Knoxville is that former Ole Miss coach and Tennessee offensive coordinator David Cutcliffe, who left the Vols in 1998, will return to his old position for the Vols. Cutcliffe told a local radio station Monday that his top goal is to get healthy — he resigned from his assistant’s job at Notre Dame in June following triple-bypass heart surgery — and find a job as a head coach.
But Cutcliffe, who lives in Knoxville, would not rule out a second stint at Tennessee.
"Who knows what the future holds?" he told WNOX radio. "I’d like to be a head football coach. I’m not trying to be arrogant, but I hope the opportunity presents itself. If not, I’d never rule out coming back to Tennessee."

Riggs undergoes surgery
Tennessee running back Gerald Riggs Jr. underwent right ankle surgery Monday at UT Medical Center to repair torn ligaments suffered during a fourth-quarter run against Alabama. Riggs is out for the season. ... The Tennessee-Memphis game on Nov. 12 will kick off at 2 p.m. and will be shown on a pay-per-view basis.
E-mail Darren Epps at depps@timesfreepress.com

 

[Volstorm]

Mikey I think you have some valid points, and I have 1 question for the Nation...

Do you HONESTLY think that all of the problems that came to a head at the last Peach Bowl have been resolved?

 

[mikey]

Originally posted by volbrian@Nov 1, 2005 3:35 PM
Used to be newspapers and telephones.  Now, its internet message boards and emails.

After reading some of the posts on boards (not just this one) for the last few years, its easy to see why people would treat the Sanders the way they do.  They read these message boards too.  Treating the Sanders family like crap falls right into place regarding some of the thinsg said about RS.

Did we gather the wood for the fire?  NO

Did we strike the match?  NO

Did we fan the flame?  A resounding YES.

Bashing Sanders among those of us no where near the situation fans the flames for those people who ARE near the situation.  "Its not my fault" just doesnt apply.  Go back and read what some of the comments you have said about Sanders and consider the fact the RS' next door neighbor might see too. 

We are classless folks!  Next time somebody wants to call us classless, think about what happened during this whole ordeal.

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Incredibly well said.

 

[mikey]

Originally posted by donsargegolf@Nov 1, 2005 3:45 PM
I respect RS as a man, and his family as well. He had 6.5 years to do his job and did not cut it. The players are responsible for their failures as well but, coaches get fired for their failures. Not the other way around. I have never attacked RS personally BUT, he is no OC at the level we play at. :twocents:

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Sarge I agree that coaches should lose their jobs if they don't get it done...I agree that you never attacked Randy personally...and I'm glad that you respect him as a man because regardless of your opinions of him as an OC, he IS a good man. My question is this Sarge...if you think he deserved to go for not getting it done, then why do you think Coach Majors shouldn't have been let go? He clearly was never going to take the program to the level that Phillip has and he had SIXTEEN years to get it done. Just wondering. :dunno:

 

[mikey]

Originally posted by Volstorm@Nov 1, 2005 9:22 PM
Mikey I think you have some valid points, and I have 1 question for the Nation...

Do you HONESTLY think that all of the problems that came to a head at the last Peach Bowl have been resolved?

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No.

 

[duckman398686]

Originally posted by mikey@Nov 2, 2005 9:20 AM
Sarge I agree that coaches should lose their jobs if they don't get it done...I agree that you never attacked Randy personally...and I'm glad that you respect him as a man because regardless of your opinions of him as an OC, he IS a good man.  My question is this Sarge...if you think he deserved to go for not getting it done, then why do you think Coach Majors shouldn't have been let go?  He clearly was never going to take the program to the level that Phillip has and he had SIXTEEN years to get it done. Just wondering. :dunno:

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Actually Majors did alot more for Ut than meets the eye. He dint win them a national title but he brought them back to sec championship status. Look at how successful ut was in the several years b4 majors came and youll see what i mean

 

[mikey]

Originally posted by duckman398686@Nov 2, 2005 10:29 AM
Actually Majors did alot more for Ut than meets the eye.  He dint win them a national title but he brought them back to sec championship status. Look at how successful ut was in the several years b4 majors came and youll see what i mean

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Agreed, but he wasn't going to take it farther.

 

[GAVol]

I think it's safe to say that Majors was rapidly becoming a dinosaur. I really don't like to hear people run him down because he IS Tennessee football, but it was probably time for him to move on.

 

[donsargegolf]

Nicely put GaVol. I don't say Cut is a dinasour BUT, he is from the same idealogy. Phil must step out of the college ranks and bring in "NEW" ideas!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[mikey]

Originally posted by donsargegolf@Nov 2, 2005 10:59 AM
Nicely put GaVol. I don't say Cut is a dinasour BUT, he is from the same idealogy. Phil must step out of the college ranks and bring in "NEW" ideas!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

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from............

 

[GAVol]

I keep hearing this new idea stuff, but do you really believe there is anything THAT innovative out there? There just aren't too many things that haven't been tried on a football field. I'm probably in the minority, but I really believe that our offense is pretty darn diverse . . . if we open up the playbook.

 

[mikey]

Originally posted by GAVol@Nov 2, 2005 11:06 AM
I keep hearing this new idea stuff, but do you really believe there is anything THAT innovative out there?  There just aren't too many things that haven't been tried on a football field.  I'm probably in the minority, but I really believe that our offense is pretty darn diverse . . . if we open up the playbook.

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Agreed...Urban's "new idea" sure seems to be working, huh?

 

[mikey]

There are many offenses that work...the key is being able to get the players to believe in it and execute it correctly.

 

[kiddiedoc]

Originally posted by GAVol@Nov 2, 2005 11:06 AM
I keep hearing this new idea stuff, but do you really believe there is anything THAT innovative out there?  There just aren't too many things that haven't been tried on a football field.  I'm probably in the minority, but I really believe that our offense is pretty darn diverse . . . if we open up the playbook.

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I actually agree with you there. And, I don't believe Randy was a problem due to his "playcalling." How many times do you try to run the ball then hear: "If they'd have PASSED it," or we try to pass the ball and hear: "If they'd have POUNDED it a little more. . . ." It's just second-guessing and it's always the opposite of whatever we tried to do.

IMO, the responsibilities of our coaching staff which are being unfulfilled at the present are: 1) player development, 2) executing (routes, throws, blocking assignments, holding onto the football, catching the ball, etc.), and 3) discipline (both on and off the field -- see the multiple "mental mistakes" and silly penalties.

 

[GAVol]

Exactly . . . In the end it's just exploiting mismatches and going where the defense is not and executing once you get there.

 

[Liper]

Originally posted by GAVol@Nov 2, 2005 11:15 AM
Exactly . . . In the end it's just exploiting mismatches and going where the defense is not and executing once you get there.

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That's it.

Charlie Weiss had same basically the same thing. He has said there is nothing new under the sun, but he just plagarized all the good stuff from the aggregate of what everyone does. This is largely what I have heard all good coaches say, save Bill Walsh who developed his own system, and the guy that used to coach the Rams-Fouts (Corielle?).

Then, he said THE MOST IMPORTANT thing is TEACHING it to the players - which he also said is what the best coaches do the best (hint).

Alas, plays are nothing special, but that the way - and when - those plays are used is what counts. Systems don't win any games.

To me, our system is fine when it is taught and utilized properly. However, I have always thought it was a little too comlicated for the average player to learn, which is why our young players have trouble getting on the field.