Somewhere there's a silver lining

[Bumpndnite]

Looking at team stats for the 2017 season, UT ranked 79th nationally in defense (11th in the SEC). However I think the Vols were much better on the defensive side of the ball, than the numbers show. One key factor in the defensive statistics was the overall ineptness of the Vol's offense (turnover margin, sustained drives, etc.); the Vols were dead last in the SEC. UT has seven starters returning on "D", and there is enough talent to be the core of a solid defensive unit.

WVU ranked 109th in defense last year, and their best wins were against Iowa State, and Kansas State; both were pretty good teams, but not world beaters. The Vols can beat this team, if the offense can at least hold serve.

 

[BigOrangeMojo]

The only reason we were 79th is because we did not play a lot of great offenses. We were run over by GT, Mizzou, and Vandy. UK had a ton of yards against us and UF had an offensive explosion by their standards. I'm concerned that we may be over-estimating our Pass D stats from last year since teams knew they could run all over our Front 7.

 

[photovol]

The only reason we were 79th is because we did not play a lot of great offenses. We were run over by GT, Mizzou, and Vandy. UK had a ton of yards against us and UF had an offensive explosion by their standards. I'm concerned that we may be over-estimating our Pass D stats from last year since teams knew they could run all over our Front 7.

Unfortunately there's no sugar coating the worst Vol defense in program history, turning this defense around won't happen this year, improvement yes, but with the new 3-4 scheme, no turn around for the D

 

[Volfan76]

Butch Jones was a football cancer. By the time that most realized it, like a lot of cancers...it was too late. His cancer had spread down to all aspects of the football program. He's gone....cancer cured. What UT couldn't do when it had cancer has no effect on what it can do without cancer. Time to forget about 2017 and move on cancer free.

 

[ReasonableUTfan]

Butch Jones was a football cancer. By the time that most realized it, like a lot of cancers...it was too late. His cancer had spread down to all aspects of the football program. He's gone....cancer cured. What UT couldn't do when it had cancer has no effect on what it can do without cancer. Time to forget about 2017 and move on cancer free.

Cancer? Really? Sorry but I've had family members that died from this dreaded disease as I'm sure other's have as well but the 2017 season and CBJ's losses to Vandy caused his firing. Please don't throw a term like cancer on a coach that had a bad season and just wasn't cut out to be our HC by demeaning those in our society who are dying from this incurable disease.

 

[ftsandersvol]

However I think the Vols were much better on the defensive side of the ball, than the numbers show.

Did you and I watch the same games last year?

 

[peaygolf]

Silver Lining.......UT plays WVU instead of Oklahoma, Penn State, or Wisconsin, ect......to open the year. WVU is beatable. Charlotte, UTEP and ETSU are also silver linings.
Also, CJP is a defensive guy and should make the D much better.

 

[Volfan76]

Cancer? Really? Sorry but I've had family members that died from this dreaded disease as I'm sure other's have as well but the 2017 season and CBJ's losses to Vandy caused his firing. Please don't throw a term like cancer on a coach that had a bad season and just wasn't cut out to be our HC by demeaning those in our society who are dying from this incurable disease.

There isn't a person on this board who hasn't lost a person to cancer...that's why it's a common analogy. Do you just go around all day looking for something to be offended by? If you are that easily offended, cupcake, maybe a message board isn't for you.

 

[MyBloodRunnethOrange]

Unfortunately there's no sugar coating the worst Vol defense in program history, turning this defense around won't happen this year, improvement yes, but with the new 3-4 scheme, no turn around for the D

How quickly we forget. Last year's defense was bad, but not as bad as the Sunseri debacle.

 

[basspond]

Butch Jones was a football cancer. By the time that most realized it, like a lot of cancers...it was too late. His cancer had spread down to all aspects of the football program. He's gone....cancer cured. What UT couldn't do when it had cancer has no effect on what it can do without cancer. Time to forget about 2017 and move on cancer free.

Cancer? Really? Sorry but I've had family members that died from this dreaded disease as I'm sure other's have as well but the 2017 season and CBJ's losses to Vandy caused his firing. Please don't throw a term like cancer on a coach that had a bad season and just wasn't cut out to be our HC by demeaning those in our society who are dying from this incurable disease.

I think its a perfectly reasonable analogy. Cancer is not an incurable disease. It's cured all the time (yes, in my family). It's cured by killing the cancer cells via chemo and radiation or cutting out the cancerous cells. The former director of the football team didn't have just one bad season. We could all see problems with his football IQ since he came. Apparently, he was not well liked by many of those who worked under him from his micro-management to his broken promises. He was removed and the "body" has renewed energy and optimistic look at life.

 

[VolTexas]

The run defense was not very good.

Pick 6 total should be enough win.

 

[Ten_Titans]

Butch Jones was a football cancer. By the time that most realized it, like a lot of cancers...it was too late. His cancer had spread down to all aspects of the football program. He's gone....cancer cured. What UT couldn't do when it had cancer has no effect on what it can do without cancer. Time to forget about 2017 and move on cancer free.

Cancer? Really? Sorry but I've had family members that died from this dreaded disease as I'm sure other's have as well but the 2017 season and CBJ's losses to Vandy caused his firing. Please don't throw a term like cancer on a coach that had a bad season and just wasn't cut out to be our HC by demeaning those in our society who are dying from this incurable disease.

Knew it was coming. Just a word man.

 

[KBVol]

Looking at team stats for the 2017 season, UT ranked 79th nationally in defense (11th in the SEC). However I think the Vols were much better on the defensive side of the ball, than the numbers show. One key factor in the defensive statistics was the overall ineptness of the Vol's offense (turnover margin, sustained drives, etc.); the Vols were dead last in the SEC. UT has seven starters returning on "D", and there is enough talent to be the core of a solid defensive unit.

WVU ranked 109th in defense last year, and their best wins were against Iowa State, and Kansas State; both were pretty good teams, but not world beaters. The Vols can beat this team, if the offense can at least hold serve.

Our defense was straight trash last year, period. This argument that “it was all on the offense, it was all the offense’s fault” is belied by the fact that our offensive time of possession per game was 28.5 minutes or so, meaning the defense was on the field, on average, about 90 seconds per game more than the offense. So, offensive time of possession explains little to nothing from last year.

Couple of examples for you. Against GaTech, our offense scored 42 points despite only 18 minutes of possesssion.....why only 18 minutes you ask? Because our awful defense couldn’t get off the field while allowing 555 yards of rushing to a GaTech team that averaged 282 yards rushing per game against everybody else.

Another example is Missouri. We had 1:30 more time of possession while losing 50-17. Why? Because our defense was busy giving no resistance whatsoever while allowing 433 yards rushing and 659 total yards to a fairly feckless offense that played anybody not named Tennessee or Missouri State.

So, silver lining based on ANYTHING relating to 2017’s defense? No, not buying it. Only silver lining I see is now having a head coach who is one of the best defensive coordinators/defensive minds in the country.

 

[sechamp2012]

Silver Lining.......UT plays WVU instead of Oklahoma, Penn State, or Wisconsin, ect......to open the year. WVU is beatable. Charlotte, UTEP and ETSU are also silver linings.
Also, CJP is a defensive guy and should make the D much better.

I hope CJP can make this D better but the same thing was said about Shoop who at the time was lauded as one of the best D coordinator in the country

 

[Matt2496]

It feels great to have a coach that isn't a snake oil salesman.

 

[sjt18]

The D couldn't get off the field last year. I personally believe UT had and has talent but Jones meddling and development philosophy prevented it from producing results on the field. Others think that UT has a whole roster of overrated 4/5* players.

The one undeniable positive so far is this team is heading into the first game prep week healthier than any since 2013. Key contributors with injury questions are actually getting better rather than forecasted to be out for weeks.

I don't blame Shoop. Jones had been "developing" last year's team for 4+ years. Shoop inherited players developed the way Jones dictated. This year's D will have had 9 months of development the way Pruitt does it. I expect a considerable difference.

UT's OL progress is encouraging also. I won't blame the O for the D last year... but a solid running game can surely help.

 

[sjt18]

Cancer? Really? Sorry but I've had family members that died from this dreaded disease as I'm sure other's have as well but the 2017 season and CBJ's losses to Vandy caused his firing. Please don't throw a term like cancer on a coach that had a bad season and just wasn't cut out to be our HC by demeaning those in our society who are dying from this incurable disease.

Oh good grief. Lighten up. You know he didn't mean any disrespect toward someone with cancer.

My mom died of cancer. My wife had cancer. I've lost friends to cancer. People I love have fought cancer with some losing.

If you are offended by this then you aren't very "reasonable" and probably don't need to hang out on a board like this.

 

[sjt18]

Cancer? Really? Sorry but I've had family members that died from this dreaded disease as I'm sure other's have as well but the 2017 season and CBJ's losses to Vandy caused his firing. Please don't throw a term like cancer on a coach that had a bad season and just wasn't cut out to be our HC by demeaning those in our society who are dying from this incurable disease.

Oh good grief. Lighten up. You know he didn't mean any disrespect toward someone with cancer.

My mom died of cancer. My wife had cancer. I've lost friends to cancer. People I love have fought cancer with some losing.

If you are offended by this then you aren't very "reasonable" and probably don't need to hang out on a board like this.

How quickly we forget. Last year's defense was bad, but not as bad as the Sunseri debacle.

Yes. And UT scored a ton of points in 2012. Last year's Vols scored either the second or third least points in the last 50 years. An amazing 84 of UT's 238 points were scored in the first two games. After scoring 42 in each of those games, UT didn't break 30 for the remainder of the season.

The point seems valid that UT's D was made to look worse by the O for most of the season... they were bad on their own because they couldn't get off the field but it didn't help that they were on the field so much.

 

[82_VOL_83]

Cancer? Really? Sorry but I've had family members that died from this dreaded disease as I'm sure other's have as well but the 2017 season and CBJ's losses to Vandy caused his firing. Please don't throw a term like cancer on a coach that had a bad season and just wasn't cut out to be our HC by demeaning those in our society who are dying from this incurable disease.

I have had several family members plus friends pass from cancer and knowing the disease, he was a cancer, period. If you think the Vandy loss was the entire reason he was fired you are fooling yourself. Cancer is a generic term. Don't be a snowflake and ask us to stop using a term just because you want us to. Not going to happen.

 

[82_VOL_83]

The D couldn't get off the field last year. I am personally believe UT had and has talent but Jones meddling and development philosophy prevented it from producing results on the field. Others think that UT has a whole roster of overrated 4/5* players.

The one undeniable positive so far is this team is heading into the first game prep week healthier than any since 2013. Key contributors with injury questions are actually getting better rather than forecasted to be out for weeks.

I don't blame Shoop. Jones had been "developing" last year's team for 4+ years. Shoop inherited players developed the way Jones dictated. This year's D will have had 9 months of development the way Pruitt does it. I expect a considerable difference.

UT's OL progress is encouraging also. I won't blame the O for the D last year... but a solid running game can surely help.

We have two things that the teams in the last 4-5 years haven't had, strength and conditioning lead by a strength and conditioning coach with consequences if you don't toe the line and a freaking coaching staff that cares about teaching players instead of just throwing it out and telling them to learn it. Case in point, Kongbo's interview. We will be a different team 9 days from now.

 

[82_VOL_83]

SJT18 bringing some truff up in here.

 

[sjt18]

Unfortunately there's no sugar coating the worst Vol defense in program history, turning this defense around won't happen this year, improvement yes, but with the new 3-4 scheme, no turn around for the D

So just to be clear, you are going on record saying last year's D was a failure because of a lack of talent and not a lack of good coaching, development, and S&C? You are saying the returning team which is incredibly health compared to Jones' last 4 years does not have enough talent to accomplish a turn around?

I would argue that talent and depth were MUCH worse problems in '12 and '13 than '17 and '18. There's no question that the '12 D was much worse than last year even as bad as it was. The '12 team allowed 471 ypg. That improved to 418 in '13... and Jancek is hardly a defensive master mind. Scoring O went from an amazingly bad 35.7 ppg to 29 ppg in '13. And remember, UT had the 2nd most ypg and 4th most ppg offensively that year.

The Vols were last in both scoring and total D in '12. Last year the Vols allowed 29 ppg and around 409 ypg.

I say that to get to this... If Pruitt improves this year's D only half as much as Jancek improved Sunseri's D then the Vols will allow about 25 ppg and around 370 ypg. That would put them around the middle of the SEC in D. If he improves the ball control portion of the O and gets the same improvement Jancek got then you're looking at dramatically better results and a D statistically in the top 3rd of the SEC.

 

[golf437]

Cancer? Really? Sorry but I've had family members that died from this dreaded disease as I'm sure other's have as well but the 2017 season and CBJ's losses to Vandy caused his firing. Please don't throw a term like cancer on a coach that had a bad season and just wasn't cut out to be our HC by demeaning those in our society who are dying from this incurable disease.

Most have but it is just a word. Poster made a good post.

 

[sjt18]

We have two things that the teams in the last 4-5 years haven't had, strength and conditioning lead by a strength and conditioning coach with consequences if you don't toe the line and a freaking coaching staff that cares about teaching players instead of just throwing it out and telling them to learn it. Case in point, Kongbo's interview. We will be a different team 9 days from now.

Loved that interview and especially the part when he said something to the effect that he now feels like he knows what he's doing.

As I continue to look back on Jones, a comment made in an article hit home a few days ago. Jones thought of himself as an "innovator"... on the cutting edge. He was trying to reinvent football. So while Pruitt teaches guys to tackle... Jones taught them the "fine points of playing winning football"... like precise measurements of their sleep and recovery time. While Pruitt uses tried and true S&C methods and asks for physical development to match the proven success criteria for their position... Jones tried to over engineer that too.

Jones read books. From those books he learned about the "fine points"... when he lacked the ability to teach the ground up fundamentals. I believe the team that Wilcox and Chaney left him was more fundamentally sound than the one he left Pruitt though the current team is far more talented. Pruitt... is just a football coach. Yeah. There are some new ideas that prove to be good ones but football is still a game of fundamental skills taught to players with innate talent.

 

[Bumpndnite]

The only reason we were 79th is because we did not play a lot of great offenses. We were run over by GT, Mizzou, and Vandy. UK had a ton of yards against us and UF had an offensive explosion by their standards. I'm concerned that we may be over-estimating our Pass D stats from last year since teams knew they could run all over our Front 7.

I can only go by what I saw. I watched the Bama-UT game in Bryant-Denny, and thought the Vol's front seven played a decent game....until midway of the 4th quarter....by which time they were totally gassed. It is almost impossible for a defense to sustain maximum effort game after game, when there is little or no chance of winning the dang game. Bob Shoops is a well respected coordinator, so am not sure last year's defensive problems were entirely due to coaching.

The good news is: it's preseason, and everyone is undefeated. Pruitt has a clean slate, and I expect him to make the most of it.