Some interesting things being said today.

#1
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coondog

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#1
As Tennstud said, this is strictly my interpretation of a lot of things I've heard from people that I place enough confidence in to give what they say credibility.
As Tennstud noted, the president is a political animal. He is not unique in that. No one ever gets to that position without being a great politician. He is very hands on, and tolerates no threat to his control. That statement is not intended to be judgemental, just fact. Anyone who thinks previous presidents tolerated any threats is mistaken. I think some of those guys were pretty good in the job so it's not a bad or good thing... just what is.
Fulmer is not popular with the president. I don't think it's anything personal, just that Fulmer has been too well established with people the president needs supporting UT to be controlled by the president to the degree the president would be comfortable with. A new coach won't present that problem because he will be beholden to the president for having the job. Just the way things work.
The results on the field recently have weakened Fulmers position to the point that he is vulnerable. Probably, IMO, so weakened that he will be replaced. I make no claim to know whether it will be before the end of the season or after. I just expect it to happen. I do not think Fulmer is ready to go but he might be. I do expect, unlike some other posters, that the fight will not become a nasty public fight but rather stay behind the scenes, possibly culminating in Fulmer getting a placebo job with the athletic department if he wants it. Whether he will want it or not I don't claim to know either.
One other note... most of the guys identified by name on this board as being influential are not really involved.
Make no mistake.... this is at least as much about "office politics" as it is about football... maybe moreso.
 
#2
#2
This is not me saying these things just wanted to get that out before some people got their undies in a wad. But thought you guys might find it interesting. later
 
#5
#5
Hamilton is the man. The vacuum of money being sucked out of the UTAD is driving this, along with a serious national loss of prestige. It's done, but there will be no bitter divorce. CPF will have work to do after the dust settles.
 
#6
#6
Vercingetorix said:
Jeez, if it comes down to Petersen vs. Fulmer then suddenly I don't know what to root for. Yuck.
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For your sake Vercy, I hope it really doesn't come down to a Fulmer vs. Petersen scenario. This would indicate that Fulmer is going to fight against a lost cause. If he goes down swinging nothing about this transition is going to be pretty.
 
#7
#7
I say we do exactly what Bama did. Identify our most feasible longshot canidate: Gruden. Then identify the very best available canidate: Butch Davis.

Reach out to Gruden first, make a impressive offer like $5 million. Like Saban, he will say no, but you will find out how interested he is and what it will take to get him. Likewise, Gruden will know we are serious, and will keep us in the back of his mind. If he says absolutely no, then mark him off your list.

Then you meet with Butch Davis. Typically, these up-in-comers or weaker conference coaches are the ones to be careful with. They are the "hot name" this year and getting offers from everyschool. Because they have options, they can bargain and play offfers off of eachother. In the end, they will go to whoever pays the most. So offer him more than he is making, lets say $2.5 million,but far less than what you offered Gruden. (Bama offered R Rod $2 million). After UNC counters and somebody else bids more, offer $3.25 million as a final offer. Anymore, we are talking about Saban money. Saban money better come with a guarantee and as much as you like BD, you aren't going to break the bank because he is trendy. More than likely he says yes and everyone is happy. But if Clemson is in love with him, let them have him for $4 million.

So now you either lower your standards or you go get the man you wanted the most. The critics are already going to be pissed you didn't get BD. Not only that, the difference between the 2nd canidate and the 3rd is a year more worth of rebuilding. Add the turmoil and postponed profits from slower success to the $3.5 you about paid BD and Gruden is now clearly worth the money he is asking. Fly to Tampa, put Chucky in an orange blazer, and announce the next coach at UT. I don't see any reason that with our talent that we couldn't be competing for NCs in two years under Gruden.
 
#8
#8
Lexvol said:
For your sake Vercy, I hope it really doesn't come down to a Fulmer vs. Petersen scenario. This would indicate that Fulmer is going to fight against a lost cause. If he goes down swinging nothing about this transition is going to be pretty.
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Fulmer is terrible for the football team; Petersen is terrible for the whole university. I want Fulmer gone as much as the next guy, but if I had to decide to fire one of them tomorrow and keep the other around for 15 more years, I'd get rid of Petersen.

I've already been assuming that Fulmer is going to fight it out as long as he can. They may end up being able to present a positive spin on it for the public, but I have no doubt that's it's already ugly behind the scenes.
 
#9
#9
Grateful Vol said:
I say we do exactly what Bama did. Identify our most feasible longshot canidate: Gruden. Then identify the very best available canidate: Butch Davis.

Reach out to Gruden first, make a impressive offer like $5 million. Like Saban, he will say no, but you will find out how interested he is and what it will take to get him. Likewise, Gruden will know we are serious, and will keep us in the back of his mind. If he says absolutely no, then mark him off your list.

Then you meet with Butch Davis. Typically, these up-in-comers or weaker conference coaches are the ones to be careful with. They are the "hot name" this year and getting offers from everyschool. Because they have options, they can bargain and play offfers off of eachother. In the end, they will go to whoever pays the most. So offer him more than he is making, lets say $2.5 million,but far less than what you offered Gruden. (Bama offered R Rod $2 million). After UNC counters and somebody else bids more, offer $3.25 million as a final offer. Anymore, we are talking about Saban money. Saban money better come with a guarantee and as much as you like BD, you aren't going to break the bank because he is trendy. More than likely he says yes and everyone is happy. But if Clemson is in love with him, let them have him for $4 million.

So now you either lower your standards or you go get the man you wanted the most. The critics are already going to be pissed you didn't get BD. Not only that, the difference between the 2nd canidate and the 3rd is a year more worth of rebuilding. Add the turmoil and postponed profits from slower success to the $3.5 you about paid BD and Gruden is now clearly worth the money he is asking. Fly to Tampa, put Chucky in an orange blazer, and announce the next coach at UT. I don't see any reason that with our talent that we couldn't be competing for NCs in two years under Gruden.
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First of all, we aren't near competing for NC's at all. Second, Butch isn't some up and comer. An up and comer would generally be a risk. I would hardly consider Davis a risk. It would take a lot of money to get BD, and I would be thrilled if UT gave it to him.
 
#11
#11
this is his contract now.... so to get him to leave it is gonna take a nice raise

For much of the 2007 season, unfounded rumors swirled that Davis would leave UNC after just one year if the head coaching job at his alma mater, Arkansas, opened up. Davis steadfastly denied he was leaving. On November 21, 2007, Davis agreed to a one-year contract extension, along with a raise. Davis now stands to receive an extra $291,000 annually due to the extension, according to the campus newspaper, The Daily Tar Heel. Davis said in a statement that one year at UNC convinced him that this was where he wanted to be, and that he intended to have "a long and successful career in Chapel Hill." He also hoped it would put to rest any talk of him leaving for Arkansas.[1]

Davis originally signed a seven-year deal worth approximately $1.86 million per season, with a base salary of $286,000. He also gets $25,000 a year in expenses and a supplement from the Educational Foundation (Ram's Club) that ranges from $1 million in 2007 to $1.3 million in 2013. Baddour said he could not release all the details of the contract until it is approved by the trustees but did say the base salary will rise $29,000, the expenses will go up $5,000 and Davis’ supplemental income will go up $100,000.[3]
 
#12
#12
tvolsfan said:
First of all, we aren't near competing for NC's at all. Second, Butch isn't some up and comer. An up and comer would generally be a risk. I would hardly consider Davis a risk. It would take a lot of money to get BD, and I would be thrilled if UT gave it to him.
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The Bammers were given up for dead before they hired Satan two years ago. Take out of that what you will.
 
#13
#13
exactly.... BS (before Saban)..lol... Bama was notta.. now they are exactly where we WANT to be...
 
#14
#14
anyone quoting Tenn"stud" should have their posting privileges limited to the Pub or Endzone
 
#16
#16
tvolsfan said:
First of all, we aren't near competing for NC's at all. Second, Butch isn't some up and comer. An up and comer would generally be a risk. I would hardly consider Davis a risk. It would take a lot of money to get BD, and I would be thrilled if UT gave it to him.
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First of all, Saban inherited a bunch of **** at Bama and is competing for a NC in year 2 as we speak. Whoever UT gets is set at defense for 2 years and set on offense for 4 if he is good enough to save the incoming class. Our 2009 roster will be ridiculesly better than Bamas 07 roster.

Second, I didn't say Butch was an up and comer. He does however coach in an inferior conference and is a trendy name this year. Lane Kiffin is also a trendy name this year, but its because he is an up and comer.

You want Butch Davis so bad that you are offended that I mentioned his name and the words "up and comer" in the same paragraph. I really hope we get Butch Davis, but I hope to God it happens for your sake.

Butch Davis is the college coach with the lowest risk in my opinion. He is proven and been successful at many places throughout his career. Its not a case of "if" he can but "when" can he.

And the fact that you would sell your soul to get him supports my whole theory. Because he is the trendy name this year, we would have to pay a premium to get him. And since you think $3.25 million isn't enough money for BD, I assume you think he is a $4 million man like Saban.

Let me tell you something. In business there are good decisions and bad ones. Alabama got a NC winning coach to take a PAY CUT to come turn their program around in 2 years. Even at $4 mill, Saban is a DISCOUNT. No one can take credit for Saban's success and it is not debatable.

Butch Davis has won many championships as a coordinator and turned programs around. Say what you want, but he has yet to even get near that level of success as a headcoach. Considering his entire body of work, I would say that he has a very high probability to succeed and the best available college coach. But to pay $4 million dollars for him at a premium is ridicules. So if UT is nowhere close to a NC even under BD, why the heck would you give him Saban money but expect less results.

If you are going to pay $4 million, long-term success should be guaranteed. Sorry, but BD is a little risky. Gruden is a guarantee IMO. I truely believe that his West Coast offensive would scare the crap out of our Rivals. Imagine his intensity in our players and running through Neylands 107,000 seats. It would feel like an Atom Bomb waiting to explode.

If you can take a risk with $4 million, then you definitely can afford a gurantee at $6 million.
 
#17
#17
Grateful Vol said:
Let me tell you something. In business there are good decisions and bad ones. Alabama got a NC winning coach to take a PAY CUT to come turn their program around in 2 years. Even at $4 mill, Saban is a DISCOUNT. No one can take credit for Saban's success and it is not debatable.
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This may be the most sensible comment I have read throughout the entire coaching debate.

The hunger is Knoxville to win football games is intense. I wouldn't be surprised by a number even a good bit higher than Saban's four-large if we think the right fish is in the pond.
 
#18
#18
kiddiedoc said:
This may be the most sensible comment I have read throughout the entire coaching debate.

The hunger is Knoxville to win football games is intense. I wouldn't be surprised by a number even a good bit higher than Saban's four-large if we think the right fish is in the pond.
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I agree but Saban isn't making four large at Alabama and isn't in the top three in college football coaches salaries.
http://americasbestonline.net/index.php/pages/collegehighestpaidcoaches.html
 
#19
#19
Grateful Vol said:
I say we do exactly what Bama did. Identify our most feasible longshot canidate: Gruden. Then identify the very best available canidate: Butch Davis.

Reach out to Gruden first, make a impressive offer like $5 million. Like Saban, he will say no, but you will find out how interested he is and what it will take to get him. Likewise, Gruden will know we are serious, and will keep us in the back of his mind. If he says absolutely no, then mark him off your list.

Then you meet with Butch Davis. Typically, these up-in-comers or weaker conference coaches are the ones to be careful with. They are the "hot name" this year and getting offers from everyschool. Because they have options, they can bargain and play offfers off of eachother. In the end, they will go to whoever pays the most. So offer him more than he is making, lets say $2.5 million,but far less than what you offered Gruden. (Bama offered R Rod $2 million). After UNC counters and somebody else bids more, offer $3.25 million as a final offer. Anymore, we are talking about Saban money. Saban money better come with a guarantee and as much as you like BD, you aren't going to break the bank because he is trendy. More than likely he says yes and everyone is happy. But if Clemson is in love with him, let them have him for $4 million.

So now you either lower your standards or you go get the man you wanted the most. The critics are already going to be pissed you didn't get BD. Not only that, the difference between the 2nd canidate and the 3rd is a year more worth of rebuilding. Add the turmoil and postponed profits from slower success to the $3.5 you about paid BD and Gruden is now clearly worth the money he is asking. Fly to Tampa, put Chucky in an orange blazer, and announce the next coach at UT. I don't see any reason that with our talent that we couldn't be competing for NCs in two years under Gruden.
Click to expand...

Amen
 
#21
#21
#22
#22
volger said:
Amen
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Most loser coaches in the NFL that came from college do ok when returning to college. Cowher and Gruden were/ are successful in the big league and don't have to recruit players as part of their job description. Think about it.
 
#23
#23
kiddiedoc said:
$3.75 is "4" to me, you, and most people we know. And, don't forget that there are pay "incentives:" an SEC title adds $125K and a NC would bring a $400K bonus. . . .both of which are good possibilities this year.
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I would be deliriously happy with the 250k that Saban isn't making to reach the 4 million mark. By the way, are your incentive figures standard in every college football contract? Are you a sports agent?
 
#24
#24
hey vol fans do yall think john gruden would make a good coach for tennessee and if so could he turn things around..:rock:
 
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