Rivalry?

#76
#76
DrTNT said:
UT's traditional rivals:

1. Bama... 'nuff said

2. Vandy... UT brought in General Neyland with one objective: beat Vandy. They used to dominate UT.

3. Kentucky: the old beer barrel rivalry...
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Vandy.....the last time they "dominated" Tennessee was 1918-1926. Lol. Since then we're 73-11-5 vs those losers. The Vandy game is an annual contest on Tennessee's schedule......it's very, very far from a rivalry game IMO.
 
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#77
#77
VFL-82-JP said:
We first met UGa in 1899. Played 45 times since then, with 24 of those in 1992 or after (SEC divided into divisions in '92). Means we played 21 times from 1899 to 1991 (a 93 year period), or once every 4.4 years.

That's very roughly equivalent to how frequently we play the six teams in the West not named Bama, these days. And it doesn't really feel like much of a rivalry any more with Auburn or Ole Miss or Miss State, playing them just once every six years.

So I agree, Georgia wasn't much of a rival prior to creation of SEC-E and SEC-W, if your definition of 'rival' includes a meeting frequency element.



p.s. Same for Florida (25 times over 75 years, from 1916 to 1991...about once every 3 years).

p.p.s. If frequency of play is your thing, or at least a big factor in defining "rival" for you, here's a useful list of Power 5 teams we've played the most, in descending order (cutoff at 30 meetings):
  • Kentucky -- 111 times
  • Vandy -- 110 times
  • Bama -- 97 times
  • Ole Miss -- 65 times
  • Auburn -- 54 times
  • Georgia -- 46 times
  • Florida -- 46 times
  • Ga Tech -- 46 times
  • Miss State -- 45 times
  • South Carolina -- 34 times
  • LSU -- 32 times
  • North Carolina -- 32 times

Given all this, here's how I'd break things out:

Historic (but not current) rivals: Auburn, Ole Miss, Miss State, Georgia Tech, LSU

Current (but not so much historic) rivals: Georgia, Florida, South Carolina, Mizzou.

Historic and current rivals: Bama, Kentucky, Vandy.
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I'm surprised we played Auburn that little and USCeast that much.

Arkansas game was turning into a good rivalry before realignment # 2 or 3.
 
#79
#79
HuntlandVolinColo said:
I'm surprised we played Auburn that little and USCeast that much.

Arkansas game was turning into a good rivalry before realignment # 2 or 3.
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Yeah, it's crazy to me that we've only played Arkansas 18 times in over 100 years of football. Even understanding that they didn't join the SEC until 1992, they're still a neighboring state's main land grant college. Weird, huh?
 
#80
#80
KBVol said:
Vandy and Kentucky?? No. They're virtually automatic annual wins and teams we have play to close out the season. Nuances yes, rivals no. Nothing more, nothing less. We have 3 legit rivals....UF, UGA and Bama.
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We are their only natural rivals. Was Vandy a rival when Franklin was whipping our butts? Case closed.

They have always been, and will always be rivals. Sorry.
 
#81
#81
bigorangecrush89 said:
I've often wondered why UT and UGA never played much historically, since the programs are so close to one another geographically and charter members of the conference.

Personally, I think Auburn belongs in the SEC East. It just makes so much more sense geographically and most of the teams they have historic rivalries with are in the East (besides Bama of course). They have still played us more times overall than LSU. Hard to believe.
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It is because of how Tennessee scheduled in the 70s and 80s before Arkansas and South Carolina joined. We played Auburn and Ole Miss every year, and we played Georgia and Florida on a rotation. Once divisional play started, all that changed. Why? Hell if I know.
 
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#82
#82
VFL-82-JP said:
Yeah, it's crazy to me that we've only played Arkansas 18 times in over 100 years of football. Even understanding that they didn't join the SEC until 1992, they're still a neighboring state's main land grant college. Weird, huh?
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Not really. All those years they were in the SWC, they had their own rivals, and we had ours. It was the days of trying to impress AP and UPI voters. Strength of schedule was less of a concern. Only time we might have faced them would have been in a bowl IF that bowl wanted both teams.

For however much college football might seem screwed up nowadays, it was even worse back then. It is also why people still over obsess about the polls. Back then they meant everything, and most fans have not gotten past it.
.
 
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#83
#83
kentucky sucks said:
By that definition Florida isn't our rival. Their players and fans don't hate us the way we hate them. We're just an SEC game they usually win.

Get out of Knoxville and you'll find 400 miles worth of state border line who hates all things KY. Ask the Vol fans in Chatt who they hate and it'll probably be GA. Bristol people hate VT. People in Middle TN hate Vandy. A rivalry isn't about wins and losses. It's about good ole fashioned hate. Just look at us vs Florida the last 10 years. We think it's a rivalry. They don't.
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I live in Nashville and never feel the need to expend emotional capital on Vandy. I hated Vandy fans during the Dooley years, but after close self examination I realized that my hate was misplaced and who I really hated was Dooley and not James Franklin, who is a nobody and not worth the effort.

On the other hand, Nashville has a serious Bama infestation. I tried sprinkling seven dust on them, but that just makes them horny and they continue to interbreed, making the infestation that much worse.
 
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#84
#84
USCGVOL said:
For me the list is:
Bama
Florida
Georgia
Vandy
Kentucky
USCjr
Auburn
LSU
UCLA
ga tech
Then maybe Missouri and I guess Clemson for whatever reason in recruiting.

That's just me.
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Florida and Georgia are more rivalries born out of necessity and convenience. We HAVE to beat them to win the east. Outside of that there is really no interest. There was a manufactured rivalry with Florida that began with Spurrier in the 90s, but before that time nobody would have considered them a rival.

Vandy always gets thrown out there as a rival just because we share the state and are both in the SECE. But there is no history of battling them. We just beat them all the time.

Kentucky is more of a rival in Basketball and I see them as more of a natural regional rival, however Louisville is rightfully considered their biggest rival and in basketball it's Louisville first, Indiana second, Duke third and then maybe they start to think about Tennessee.

To me the only real rival for UT is Bama. All the elements of a rivalry are present (W-L, regionality, tradition and history as being the #1 and #2 programs in the SEC historically).
 
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#86
#86
MWAVolfan said:
I live in Nashville and never feel the need to expend emotional capital on Vandy. I hated Vandy fans during the Dooley years, but after close self examination I realized that my hate was misplaced and who I really hated was Dooley and not James Franklin, who is a nobody and not worth the effort.

On the other hand, Nashville has a serious Bama infestation. I tried sprinkling seven dust on them, but that just makes them horny and they continue to interbreed, making the infestation that much worse.
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I have noticed that since the 1998 National Championship that support for UT football has eroded considerably in the Middle Tennessee area. Bammers are everywhere and so many people I know who used to trek to Knoxville every weekend now would rather attend pro games with the Titans. I see very few UT car flags anymore and far less UT apparel being worn. Now, I detest Middle Tennessee Bammers the most and consider them turncoats but I like to remind them that not a single tax dollar of theirs goes to support the Tide whereas it does goes to support UT athletics so I thank them for their support. But I think UT has an unaddressed problem and that is a smaller fan base from years past. Even Neyland has been downsized. I just don't see a ton of support for UT anymore in the Middle Tennessee area. One thing about Alabama is that it is such a crappy State that Alabama is about the only game in town and there is no competition with pro sports and probably never will be since it is such a hell hole of a place. Nashville now has the Titans and Predators and people are spending their dollars closer to home for what they consider viewing superior athletes. Even my uncle who was an avid Vol attendee chose the Titans citing as reason that the pro game is so much faster and complex and the talent on the field is simply superior to watch than the college game. I think UT has essentially lost Nashville's support and that is a major blow. Just my two cent observation and opinion.
 
#87
#87
MWAVolfan said:
I live in Nashville...Nashville has a serious Bama infestation.
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Smokeys Big Bite said:
I have noticed that since the 1998 National Championship that support for UT football has eroded considerably in the Middle Tennessee area. Bammers are everywhere...
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I don't see that at all. I'm surrounded by Vols fans (Lebanon, east side of Nashville). Couple of hard data points to prove it's not just impression:

1. My wife is a teacher. Once a year, on homecoming week (which was last week for them), they have a "wear your favorite team's colors" day. The overwhelmingly most popular color that day in all the grades? Orange. Tons of Vols fans, with Titans in second, and just a smattering from other schools (yes, including Bama and Vandy). By far Vols in the lead. [my wife has the group photos to prove it, but not sharing with you cretins, hehe]

2. Because I kept hearing this about Nashville and Bama fans (mostly from guys living around Franklin and Cool Springs), I did an experiment one day I had to drive into the city: counted every single car that had a team sticker or license plate or flag or anything. I posted the results in another thread around here somewhere, but it was something like, out of 300 or 400 cars observed, 20-something were Vols, and every other team was just 1 (Bama, Florida, Georgia, Kentucky, Vandy) or zero (all the rest). Oh, and just one Titans car, too, which surprised me. The route was all the way in from Lebanon, through downtown out to West End, and then all the way back. Didn't count it if the car had out-of-state plates; I don't care who some North Carolina resident roots for. :)

So in my experience, Nashville and Middle Tennessee are HUGELY Vols territory. Those of you who have seen Bama infestations (Franklin *cough cough*), get better friends and neighbors!

Go Vols!


EDIT: Here's that original post. I was a little off on the numbers, but the gist of it is as mentioned: http://www.volnation.com/forum/tennessee-vols-football/261328-color-town-challenge.html
 
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#88
#88
VFL-82-JP said:
I don't see that at all. I'm surrounded by Vols fans (Lebanon, east side of Nashville). Couple of hard data points to prove it's not just impression:

1. My wife is a teacher. Once a year, on homecoming week (which was last week for them), they have a "wear your favorite team's colors" day. The overwhelmingly most popular color that day in all the grades? Orange. Tons of Vols fans, with Titans in second, and just a smattering from other schools (yes, including Bama and Vandy). By far Vols in the lead. [my wife has the group photos to prove it, but not sharing with you cretins, hehe]

2. Because I kept hearing this about Nashville and Bama fans (mostly from guys living around Franklin and Cool Springs), I did an experiment one day I had to drive into the city: counted every single car that had a team sticker or license plate or flag or anything. I posted the results in another thread around here somewhere, but it was something like, out of 300 or 400 cars observed, 20-something were Vols, and every other team was just 1 (Bama, Florida, Georgia, Kentucky, Vandy) or zero (all the rest). Oh, and just one Titans car, too, which surprised me. The route was all the way in from Lebanon, through downtown out to West End, and then all the way back. Didn't count it if the car had out-of-state stickers; I don't care who some North Carolina resident roots for. :)

So in my experience, Nashville and Middle Tennessee are HUGELY Vols territory. Those of you who have seen Bama infestations (Franklin *cough cough*), get better friends and neighbors!

Go Vols!
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That's fair enough but let me give you a counter example with my own work group at my workplace. I have a workgroup of roughly 25 people. Seven are Bama fans and three are Vols. I work in Smyrna. I see more Bama apparel and car stickers than Vol stickers and apparel by far. People I know who used to travel to Knoxville every single home game no longer do so but they do go to Titans and/or Predators games. You know, money doesn't grow on trees and most people cannot afford tickets to Vols games, Titans games and Predators games. Seems to me that they have given up the Vols games probably because of the travel distance. Insofar as flags on cars, I honestly have not seen a single Vol flag on a car this year. Again, I think support for the Vols has eroded in Middle Tennessee and I think Knoxville needs Nashville's support far more than Nashville needs Knoxville but Nashville is being populated with people from around the country and world who couldn't care less about "Rocky top" and, quite frankly, probably think the whole mountain culture, Davey Crockett thing to be backward or silly. They bring to Nashville the loyalties of wherever it is from whence they come and Nashville no longer cares about any sort of "Tennessee culture" so much as fostering an "international culture." Knoxville is small potatoes in Nashville's thinking and current burgeoning migratory population. In other words, UT isn't converting anyone.
 
#89
#89
Well, I certainly prefer my corner of the greater Nashville metro area to yours, heh. I'll keep my Vols neighbors, and you keep those transplants south of the city, between Smyrna and Franklin. :)
 
#90
#90
HoptownVol said:
We are their only natural rivals. Was Vandy a rival when Franklin was whipping our butts? Case closed.

They have always been, and will always be rivals. Sorry.
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With those 2 losses to Snakehead, we're 30-3 the last 33 games we've played. So, short answer, no. Still just an obligatory nusance game, nowhere near a rivalry from our standpoint.
 
#92
#92
KBVol said:
Vandy.....the last time they "dominated" Tennessee was 1918-1926. Lol. Since then we're 73-11-5 vs those losers. The Vandy game is an annual contest on Tennessee's schedule......it's very, very far from a rivalry game IMO.
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In the modern era you're right. But the tinespan you quoted was on the tail end of when they were THE rival. Hey Swanee (sic?) used to be another big rival back in the day. We don't play them much any more though!

For this discussion to have any real fruit the concept of time needs to be attached. It's safe to say that with the exclusion of Bama our "historic" rivals don't line up very well with the teams between us and Atl every year now and the ones we know we have to be competitive with I.E. our "modern" rivals
 
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#93
#93
KBVol said:
Add another element IMO. Rivals aren't necessarily mutual.

For example, we are Vandy's biggest rival, hands down, no? But they aren't remotely a "rival" for us IMO. They're more a nusance. We typically beat them 8 or 9 times out of 10, and we definitely do not have the same goals for our respective seasons. They're trying win 4, 5 or, GOD forbid, 6 games so they can go play in a bowl game, lol. Obviously, we're trying to win the East and get to Atlanta.

As far as Bama, history and tradition tells us all we need to know about this rivalry. It's a series of streaks and we're due one, soon, to return the favor.

And like I said, it's not always mutual in a given time period. I doubt too many associated with Bama feel like we're a top rival right now, while all Vol fans know they're one of ours. But, like Florida this year, I think their thought process changes once we beat them again and play a factor in whether or not they reach their goals.
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So kinda like us to FL and Bama? You are totally incorrect.
 
#97
#97
NorthDallas40 said:
In the modern era you're right. But the tinespan you quoted was on the tail end of when they were THE rival. Hey Swanee (sic?) used to be another big rival back in the day. We don't play them much any more though!

For this discussion to have any real fruit the concept of time needs to be attached. It's safe to say that with the exclusion of Bama our "historic" rivals don't line up very well with the teams between us and Atl every year now and the ones we know we have to be competitive with I.E. our "modern" rivals
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But if we're gonna include the concept of time, is Vandy really a relevant choice since we have to go back nearly 100 years ago to make the case?
 
#99
#99
82_VOL_83 said:
So kinda like us to FL and Bama? You are totally incorrect.
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Florida has to deal with us pretty much every year to get to their season's goal. Even last year, if they don't pull off that last miraculous, we go play Alabama in the SECCG ...... and of course, we know what the deal is this year.

Otoh, nobody, not Florida, not Alabama, not anybody has to "deal with" Vandy, ever. They're irrelevant to who's gonna win the SECe every single year.

Bottom line, you got your opinion about, I got mine, and neither of us is gonna change. It's all good, let's leave it at that.
 
#100
#100
KBVol said:
It's just my opinion. Is yours not every bit as myopic if you're sticking to your guns as much as I'm sticking to mine?
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But your OP didn't state that it was your opinion but was stated fact that everyone should recognize. Therefore mine is opinion, yours is BS.
 
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