Recruiting Forum Off-Topic Thread II

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#926
#926
InVOLuntary said:
Had a great time. Rory hit a hole-in-one on 16. He's striking the ball better than anyone IMO. My son got Jordan Speith's autograph along with Westood's and a new one of his favorites Bill Haase (classy young man). He was in awe.
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Awesome stuff
 
#929
#929
InVOLuntary said:
Show me one reference in the bible that it says it HAS to be by immersion. There are thousands of examples of acts by Jesus that we don't practice. Some churches believe in sake handling because of a bible verse or two. Do you handle snakes? Just because you interpret the bible one way doesn't make someone else wrong. According to you the Baptist will be the only ones in heaven because of your interpretation. All us heathen methodist are bound to hell for eternity. Millions will never make it to heaven. Please pray for us OG so maybe we can reach the same level of spiritualness as you baptist.
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Ftr, I'm not a baptist. I'm a Christian...and I don't attend a baptist church either. Also, I haven't been condescending towards you one time in our discussions about this. I have simply tried to provide ample amounts of scripture that shows why baptism is by immersion, as well as explain the word for baptism (baptizo) in its original language and the meaning of that word. Yet, you put words in my mouth that I call you a heathen. I never said anything remotely close to that. I love discussing biblical things. It makes me search and study more, which increases my faith. I am not the Judge about who will go to heaven and who won't. When I read Matthew 7:13-14, 21-23, it it scares me to death that I'm not following my Lord's commands the way He intended. He says only a few will find that narrow gate, which tells me it's a small minority. He says MANY will say on that day that they had been doing all these wonderful things in His name, yet He says "depart from me". That tells me there will be many who believed they were faithful and doing what was right, but they weren't. Now come back full circle with all of this in mind (and also, please, keep Revelation 22:18-19 in mind)...do we want to risk any small detail in our service to the Lord and put ourselves in jeopardy of being in the majority on the judgement day, when He says "depart from me"? This question is for all of us, especially me. I'm not looking down on anyone...I'm just looking up to the Lord to help me interpret His scriptures the exact way He intended, so I can be in that minority on the final day.

A few more questions about baptism, if you don't mind continuing this discussion (and I'm not discussing these things to be seen of men, as beachbum was suggesting last night). If one thinks this, then I will gladly have a study about this on Skype or somewhere else, where it can be private.

Did you not say that it's clear that all biblical examples of baptism were by immersion? Do you find any other form of baptism that occurred in the NT? If so, where is the scriptural authority that shows this other form? If your answer is you don't find any other form, then immersion is the only form to be used (remember Revelation 22:18-19 about adding to His word). If there were another acceptable form, then God would have either given us a direct command for it or an example of it being used, but I don't find that scriptural authority anywhere.

As for snake handling, the verse you are mentioning is taken out of context, IMO, by those who believe you are supposed to handle snakes.
 
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#930
#930
OGbabyaviVol said:
Ftr, I'm not a baptist. I'm a Christian...and I don't attend a baptist church either. Also, I haven't been condescending towards you one time in our discussions about this. I have simply tried to provide ample amounts of scripture that shows why baptism is by immersion, as well as explain the word for baptism (baptizo) in its original language and the meaning of that word. Yet, you put words in my mouth that I call you a heathen. I never said anything remotely close to that. I love discussing biblical things. It makes me search and study more, which increases my faith. I am not the Judge about who will go to heaven and who won't. When I read Matthew 7:13-14, 21-23, it it scares me to death that I'm not following my Lord's commands the way He intended. He says only a few will find that narrow gate, which tells me it's a small minority. He says MANY will say on that day that they had been doing all these wonderful things in His name, yet He says "depart from me". That tells me there will be many who believed they were faithful and doing what was right, but they weren't. Now come back full circle with all of this in mind (and also, please, keep Revelation 22:18-19 in mind)...do we want to risk any small detail in our service to the Lord and put ourselves in jeopardy of being in the majority on the judgement day, when He says "depart from me"? This question is for all of us, especially me. I'm not looking down on anyone...I'm just looking up to the Lord to help me interpret His scriptures the exact way He intended, so I can be in that minority on the final day.

A few more questions about baptism, if you don't mind continuing this discussion (and I'm not discussing these things to be seen of men, as beachbum was suggesting last night). If one thinks this, then I will gladly have a study about this on Skype or somewhere else, where it can be private.

Did you not say that it's clear that all biblical examples of baptism were by immersion? Do you find any other form of baptism that occurred in the NT? If so, where is the scriptural authority that shows this other form? If your answer is you don't find any other form, then immersion is the only form to be used (remember Revelation 22:18-19 about adding to His word). If there were another acceptable form, then God would have either given us a direct command for it or an example of it being used, but I don't find that scriptural authority anywhere.

As for snake handling, the verse you are mentioning is taken out of context, IMO, by those who believe you are supposed to handle snakes.
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OG, you mean well and I understand that that but when you say the only way to heaven is through baptism by immersion you ate insinuating that Christians that are not are doomed.

I asked you to show me where baptism by any other means other than immersion is forbidden and you continue to give me examples of baptisms by immersion. That is not the same thing.

Then I gave the verses of handing the snakes and what was your response? It was taken out of context, i.e. you interpret it differently. Do I think God wants you to go around handling poisonous reptiles in a religious ceremony? Absolutely not but it shows you how people view text in the bible differently.

It's my opinion that baptism is a necessary act to "symbolize" the cleansing of one's soul. I used the sand analogy intentionally to make a point. What if a person was living in the desert that went long times without adequate water for immersion and wanted to be baptized, he was truly repented and accepted Christ as his Lord and savior? He dies before he can get to a body of water. Is he doomed to spend eternity in hell?

I think many people get caught up in the rules, procedures, and ceremonies of religion when all Christ really wants is one's heart. Not lumping you into this but many Christians practice religion instead of Christianity.

You mentioned early on that you couldn't accept "We'll just have to agree to disagree " in this case. We'll that suggest to me that you think this is a black and white issue and it's not. Good people and good Christians can disagree on what the Bible says and means. I'm going to back away from this discussion because it's going nowhere. God bless you and your family and keep doing the good work. :hi:
 
#931
#931
Everyone in the world has it wrong, guys. Only beachbum has the secret knowlege. Remember that song by Cee Lo?
 
#932
#932
Skullbone said:
Everyone in the world has it wrong, guys. Only beachbum has the secret knowlege. Remember that song by Cee Lo?
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Isnt Islam the largest religion in the world? If that is the case maybe beachbum can let us know how many words there are in the Koran for "sand."

Edit: Islam is indeed #2 but with a bullet!
 
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#933
#933
InVOLuntary said:
OG, you mean well and I understand that that but when you say the only way to heaven is through baptism by immersion you ate insinuating that Christians that are not are doomed.

I asked you to show me where baptism by any other means other than immersion is forbidden and you continue to give me examples of baptisms by immersion. That is not the same thing.

Then I gave the verses of handing the snakes and what was your response? It was taken out of context, i.e. you interpret it differently. Do I think God wants you to go around handling poisonous reptiles in a religious ceremony? Absolutely not but it shows you how people view text in the bible differently.

It's my opinion that baptism is a necessary act to "symbolize" the cleansing of one's soul. I used the sand analogy intentionally to make a point. What if a person was living in the desert that went long times without adequate water for immersion and wanted to be baptized, he was truly repented and accepted Christ as his Lord and savior? He dies before he can get to a body of water. Is he doomed to spend eternity in hell?

I think many people get caught up in the rules, procedures, and ceremonies of religion when all Christ really wants is one's heart. Not lumping you into this but many Christians practice religion instead of Christianity.

You mentioned early on that you couldn't accept "We'll just have to agree to disagree " in this case. We'll that suggest to me that you think this is a black and white issue and it's not. Good people and good Christians can disagree on what the Bible says and means. I'm going to back away from this discussion because it's going nowhere. God bless you and your family and keep doing the good work. :hi:
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Now that politics and religion have been exhausted, can we move on to sex now? :popcorn:
 
#938
#938
InVOLuntary said:
OG, you mean well and I understand that that but when you say the only way to heaven is through baptism by immersion you ate insinuating that Christians that are not are doomed.

I asked you to show me where baptism by any other means other than immersion is forbidden and you continue to give me examples of baptisms by immersion. That is not the same thing.

Then I gave the verses of handing the snakes and what was your response? It was taken out of context, i.e. you interpret it differently. Do I think God wants you to go around handling poisonous reptiles in a religious ceremony? Absolutely not but it shows you how people view text in the bible differently.

It's my opinion that baptism is a necessary act to "symbolize" the cleansing of one's soul. I used the sand analogy intentionally to make a point. What if a person was living in the desert that went long times without adequate water for immersion and wanted to be baptized, he was truly repented and accepted Christ as his Lord and savior? He dies before he can get to a body of water. Is he doomed to spend eternity in hell?

I think many people get caught up in the rules, procedures, and ceremonies of religion when all Christ really wants is one's heart. Not lumping you into this but many Christians practice religion instead of Christianity.

You mentioned early on that you couldn't accept "We'll just have to agree to disagree " in this case. We'll that suggest to me that you think this is a black and white issue and it's not. Good people and good Christians can disagree on what the Bible says and means. I'm going to back away from this discussion because it's going nowhere. God bless you and your family and keep doing the good work. :hi:
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This is why there are over 400 Christian denominations. Differing opinions. As a former priest at my church said in his homily, when his Pentecostal grandmother found out he was going to become a priest, she said, "We are all trying to get to the same place; we are just on different trains."

Peace be with you all.
 
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#939
#939
InVOLuntary said:
I asked you to show me where baptism by any other means other than immersion is forbidden and you continue to give me examples of baptisms by immersion. That is not the same thing.
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There are different ways of instruction. Example, inference, direct command, etc. When we see baptism by immersion in the example given, we know that's the way it was meant to happen. The same way we can understand to gather on the first day because of the verse that says "On the first day of the week, when we were gathered together to break bread...".

It's my opinion that baptism is a necessary act to "symbolize" the cleansing of one's soul. I used the sand analogy intentionally to make a point. What if a person was living in the desert that went long times without adequate water for immersion and wanted to be baptized, he was truly repented and accepted Christ as his Lord and savior? He dies before he can get to a body of water. Is he doomed to spend eternity in hell?
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I know this is a lame answer, and I'm sure you've heard it 100x. But God is the the judge. If someone is on the way to be baptized, and dies, then God decides that, not us. I know someone who died in that situation. It's tough for us to make that call.

I think many people get caught up in the rules, procedures, and ceremonies of religion when all Christ really wants is one's heart. Not lumping you into this but many Christians practice religion instead of Christianity.
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There are many passages that tell someone to do a lot more than just give Jesus his/her heart. Verses about believing, obeying, confessing, etc. Passages about living in a way after baptism and repenting when you do wrong. Christianity goes further than just the belief phase. Faith without works is dead.


Late to the party but hope I helped in some small way.
 
#940
#940
LittleCat said:
There are many passages that tell someone to do a lot more than just give Jesus his/her heart. Verses about believing, obeying, confessing, etc. Passages about living in a way after baptism and repenting when you do wrong. Christianity goes further than just the belief phase. Faith without works is dead.


Late to the party but hope I helped in some small way.
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But when you give your heart to Jesus, really give your heart to Jesus, the other things happen as well. IMO of course.
 
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#941
#941
Lol who wants to waster their time worrying about immersion when all you need is a quick deathbed confession, a little bite of Jesus' flesh, and sip of his blood to loophole yourself right into the pearly gates?
 
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#942
#942
Darth_Shiveman said:
Lol who wants to waster their time worrying about immersion when all you need is a quick deathbed confession, a little bite of Jesus' flesh, and sip of his blood to loophole yourself right into the pearly gates?
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I try not to waster my time but I still find myself perusing Volnation.
 
#943
#943
InVOLuntary said:
But when you give your heart to Jesus, really give your heart to Jesus, the other things happen as well. IMO of course.
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I can hope that I will pass my Physics test all day. I can really really hope that I pass it. I can believe I will pass it. I can say that I will pass it and convince myself I can do it. But if I don't do the work, study, and prepare than all my hope and belief is useless. Belief in Jesus is a huge step. It's not the only step though.
 
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#944
#944
InVOLuntary said:
OG, you mean well and I understand that that but when you say the only way to heaven is through baptism by immersion you ate insinuating that Christians that are not are doomed.

I asked you to show me where baptism by any other means other than immersion is forbidden and you continue to give me examples of baptisms by immersion. That is not the same thing.

Then I gave the verses of handing the snakes and what was your response? It was taken out of context, i.e. you interpret it differently. Do I think God wants you to go around handling poisonous reptiles in a religious ceremony? Absolutely not but it shows you how people view text in the bible differently.

It's my opinion that baptism is a necessary act to "symbolize" the cleansing of one's soul. I used the sand analogy intentionally to make a point. What if a person was living in the desert that went long times without adequate water for immersion and wanted to be baptized, he was truly repented and accepted Christ as his Lord and savior? He dies before he can get to a body of water. Is he doomed to spend eternity in hell?

I think many people get caught up in the rules, procedures, and ceremonies of religion when all Christ really wants is one's heart. Not lumping you into this but many Christians practice religion instead of Christianity.

You mentioned early on that you couldn't accept "We'll just have to agree to disagree " in this case. We'll that suggest to me that you think this is a black and white issue and it's not. Good people and good Christians can disagree on what the Bible says and means. I'm going to back away from this discussion because it's going nowhere. God bless you and your family and keep doing the good work. :hi:
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Thank you for being respectful. Before you back out of this discussion, answer this post. Why do you continue to not answer my questions about providing scriptural authority for baptism by some other means besides immersion? My answer to your question is very simple...baptism by any other means, outside of immersion, is forbidden, because God does not condone any other form via direct command or apostolic example in the scriptures. The silence of the scriptures is just as important as what is written. If God commands to do it this way and offers no other alternative, then the silence of the scriptures says that all other ways outside of the one commanded are forbidden. Man cannot just say it's ok to do, because God didn't say specifically that it is wrong. By doing that man is putting his own thoughts in the place of God...that's a scary position to be in, imho.
 
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#945
#945
LittleCat said:
I can hope that I will pass my Physics test all day. I can really really hope that I pass it. I can believe I will pass it. I can say that I will pass it and convince myself I can do it. But if I don't do the work, study, and prepare than all my hope and belief is useless. Belief in Jesus is a huge step. It's not the only step though.
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Where did I mention hope?
 
#946
#946
OGbabyaviVol said:
Thank you for being respectful. Before you back out of this discussion, answer this post. Why do you continue to not answer my questions about providing scriptural authority for baptism by some other means besides immersion? My answer to your question is very simple...baptism by any other means, outside of immersion, is forbidden, because God does not condone any other form via direct command or apostolic example in the scriptures. The silence of the scriptures is just as important as what is written. If God commands to do it this way and offers no other alternative, then the silence of the scriptures says that all other ways outside of the one commanded are forbidden. Man cannot just say it's ok to do, because God didn't say specifically that it is wrong. By doing that man is putting his own thoughts in the place of God...that's a scary position to be in, imho.
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Lol, you've avoided mine as well. Show me in the scripture where baptism other than immersion is forbidden. All you've done is given me examples of other biblical baptisms. Did you read the article I linked?
 
#947
#947
InVOLuntary said:
Where did I mention hope?
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I'm not sure if you are dodging the point I tried to make, or if it just sailed past you? The point being you can have belief in something. I can believe in Jesus. But the belief (or if you want to call it faith, hope, etc) is dead and ultimately can't save you alone.
 
#949
#949
I know you are just being a condescending smartaleck Darth, but to answer that for those that don't know..You can't fool God.."I the Lord search the heart. I try the reins"..."Be not deceived, God is not mocked. For whatsoever a man soweth, that shall he also reap".
 
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#950
#950
Darth_Shiveman said:
Lol who wants to waster their time worrying about immersion when all you need is a quick deathbed confession, a little bite of Jesus' flesh, and sip of his blood to loophole yourself right into the pearly gates?
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You don't have to make a mockery about this topic and our discussions. Just don't say anything, if it's not important to you.
 
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