"Real" Democrats jumping ship?

[volprof]

You mean you hope he is not

I mean he will not be, and I drew that upon rational conclusions about his history and his mental character.

 

[gasguy98]

Your party is dying. Lmao!!

Creepy Obama has done more for the Repubs than anyone since RR.

 

[Carl Pickens]

The lefty lunatic fringe are really showing their true selves these days and it has to be driving some of the moderate Dems away. I know Americans as a whole are dumb as hell, but my goodness...... surely at least 65% of them can look at the extreme left and ask WTF?

 

[TheDeeble]

Maybe all the extreme nuts from each party will push sane people back to the middle. Or possibly even a magical 3rd party.

 

[lawgator1]

If Trump is highly successful helping the black community, it could be checkmate in 2020.

If the economy improves, the best he can hope for (using your analogy) is a stalemate on the status quo, i.e. the black community did not show up in the same numbers it did for Obama.

For the GOP to make up serious, long term institutional ground within the black community the GOP is going to take decades of dramatically different policies and rhetoric towards that community.

It doesn't help that Trump adds fuel to the fire of racism, real or perceived, when he threatens to send federal officials to police Chicago (i.e. clamp down on the black community) or hire a guy with some things lurking in his background to be AG.

Those are not going to improve the GOP image in the black community.

Yes, they both are. Trump caused the most divisive split in the GOP in modern history, yet came out on top.

Bernie caused yet another divisive split and drug Hillary with him on her social policy. And it's not over as the extreme left that keeps clamoring for social justice will continue to alienate those in the center and drive more of the traditional centrists into the GOP or towards independent candidates. The DNC is giving itself a death blow by not making those on the far left shut up and stop. Do you honestly think those protests are helping the cause at all? No, it's just putting steel into the resolve of those who held their nose and voted for Trump. And it will not end well.

I agree that the extremes of both parties weaken the mainstream components. That's true of GOP and Dem alike, that is correct. But do you really think that Dems did not show up to vote for Clinton because of the party being to far left?

Please.

Whatever shortfall there was in motivation on the Dem side was due to HRC being such a dull and unattractive candidate, not that the party was too far left.

Remember, the people coming out now, after a big loss, to rally the party are going to be the extremists, the identity politics people, as you would put it. But that is not who controls the money or the platform, and it is not who ultimately controls the votes.

So do not think that the Dem party is being yanked to the left because that is who you see on tv. Or more accurately, who you see Fox and Drudge mocking as somehow representative of the Dem party.

After the GOP has had its losses, in the immediate aftermath its not people giving speeches or holding rallies saying, we need to go more to the center. Its the extremists saying we need to go more to the right.

Same here.

 

[DancingOutlaw]

I'm not saying they will die, but I could see a split of the DNC along the lines of "don't care about social issues, but want fiscal policy fixed" and "don't care about social issues and want fiscal policy fixed" in the GOP as well.

Very well could create a viable third party that challenges both the mainstream parties.

And before someone mentions it (Huff) yes, that's generally the libertarian movement. However, new party won't be as drastic on the government cuts. Slow rollback rather than "kill it with fire!" Ron Paul style.

You will probably get a Tea Party like split where the SJW/BLM and very socialist elements of the party start making trouble. It's very apparent that this attitude will translate to further problems for the Democrat party in the foreseeable future.

 

[hog88]

That's true, but that was based upon this science of the demographics. The GOP, long-term is still going to have those problems. I really don't think many people question that.

But thats far different than saying that, structurally in terms of policy, the party is falling apart. Same with dems

Regardless of race, religion or ethnic origin most people will vote their pocketbook and security. So if Trump and the Republicans can be successful economically and security wise they will continue to win. If not they will lose.

 

[hog88]

No, I pretty much know that. I gathered it from everything I know about Donald Trump.

Which appears not to be based in reality. Maybe you and your boss need to concentrate on moving more freight and less on feeding each others paranoia.

 

[SpaceCoastVol]

One guy switches.

Ergo some entire and identifiable "real" group switches?

Come on.

Unlike you the all-in leftist. :rock:

 

[volfanjustin]

That's true, but that was based upon this science of the demographics. The GOP, long-term is still going to have those problems. I really don't think many people question that.

But thats far different than saying that, structurally in terms of policy, the party is falling apart. Same with dems

Do you think the dems are attracting people to the party with their antics at protests like the ones last Saturday? I say no, because I assume most people aren't ok with setting cars on fire, busting out windows and wearing shirts and hats or carrying signs with vulgarity.

 

[SpaceCoastVol]

If the Democrats will get rid of their identity politics nonsense, they will recover from this 2016 defeat like a phoenix from the ashes.

One more reason why I've argued that the Trump presidency needs to end as soon as possible through legitimate means.

The Republican Party most likely won't survive four full years of Trumpism.

Thus far, however, there's no indication that Democrats have learned their lesson.

Two words for you.

Nancy

Pelosi.











idiot.

 

[Biopsyman]

I'm hoping Ellison wins DNC; of course Jemu Greene? would be equally gungho with the identity politics/social justice nonsense.

They would be excellent choices !!!!! I hope either one of them win. Either will continue to have great input on the democratic collapse

 

[UT_Dutchman]

Neither you nor I know that.

Don't question volpuff, he is all knowing and all seeing. He should have tried for the dnc nomination.

 

[volinbham]

That's true, but that was based upon this science of the demographics. The GOP, long-term is still going to have those problems. I really don't think many people question that.

But thats far different than saying that, structurally in terms of policy, the party is falling apart. Same with dems

Science of demographics? Please - your interpretation of that science proved wrong in 2010, to some degree in 2012, in 2014 and in 2016. 0 - 4 in predictions based on your science.

Plus you started countless threads about "fractures" in the GOP that had nothing to do with demographics and everything to do with policy.

Volprof is absolutely correct - the identity politics fetish of the current Dem party is election poison. Some in the party recognize it; others lap it up like candy.

 

[Orangedogsrule]

I think you'll see more identify as the independent side of things rather than making the jump to complete GOP.

I'd almost be willing to bet a split is coming in both major parties sooner rather than later.

I left the Democrats and I stayed independant. Don't like lots of the republican ways either. But I actually hope the Demoshietic Party continues it's headlong run like the White Rabbit and dives in the hole and disappears to be smitten by the Red Queens army. They're not Democrats. They've mis-appropriated the name.

 

[Grand Vol]

I agree that the extremes of both parties weaken the mainstream components. That's true of GOP and Dem alike, that is correct. But do you really think that Dems did not show up to vote for Clinton because of the party being to far left?

Please.

Whatever shortfall there was in motivation on the Dem side was due to HRC being such a dull and unattractive candidate, not that the party was too far left.

Remember, the people coming out now, after a big loss, to rally the party are going to be the extremists, the identity politics people, as you would put it. But that is not who controls the money or the platform, and it is not who ultimately controls the votes.

So do not think that the Dem party is being yanked to the left because that is who you see on tv. Or more accurately, who you see Fox and Drudge mocking as somehow representative of the Dem party.

After the GOP has had its losses, in the immediate aftermath its not people giving speeches or holding rallies saying, we need to go more to the center. Its the extremists saying we need to go more to the right.

Same here.

Lordy, I can't wait to get on the computer and point out just how wrong you truly are in this post.

 

[Nerwen Aldarion]

I think making predictions about the future is about just as good as guessing my love line from reading the lines on my hand.

Pointless. WE don't know what will happen to either party in the next four years. Eight years ago all over the news was the "Permanent Democratic Majority" and how the GOP was dead. Then when the Tea Party sprang up all I heard was "they will destroy the GOP, split and form a second party paving the way for a permanent Democratic majority"

That didn't work out that well.

If one thing history has shown it is that neither party is going to suddenly split up and turn around. The only indication is the Whig party which did dissolve, but they basically just regrouped and named themselves Republicans (who won the first presidential election they were ever in, a tall fellow named Mr. Lincoln).

Basically, I don't think the Dems are going to die. I don't think the GOP is either. I think 4 years, 8 year, 20, 30, 50 years from now we will still have the same two sides slinging mud and making deals.

 

[TheDeeble]

I don't think either party is really dead. One group holds power. They piss off enough of the other side to lose majority. The other side has power and pisses off enough of the other side to give majority back.

People thought the democrats were dying when Bush won the White House in 2000. Since then the left claimed the republicans were dying for the past 8 years.

And here we are today with the republicans controlling congress/white house. I imagine either in the midterms or 2020 the democrats will get a nice voter turnout and swing the balance back to the left. The Trump voters are doing a great job of motivating the left to be active for change. The MSM will be helping as well by pushing their "republicans are bad" agenda as much as they can. Can't count on much honesty or integrity from them.

I hope that at some point the moderates in each party get fed up with the extremists pushing the agenda/making fools out of themselves and either shut them up or move more center to a 3rd party.

 

[hndog609]

I don't think anything about Mr Hout's views in the OP are about the Democratic party "dying" but more where they currently are heading. I also think these quotes say a lot about where his (and probably no small number of real/classic/whatever you want to call them Dems) head is at in evaluating the current situation.

“This strategy of catering to the whims of those for whom identity politics matters more than anything else, and of allowing for even anti-white, anti-male rhetoric to find a home within the party, is a large part of its untenable strategy moving forward,” Hout explained, predicting that “it will continue to cause Democrats to lose, time and time again.”

“This just isn't the party of Jack, Bobby, or Ted Kennedy anymore,” he continued. “It's losing its edge for a number of reasons...and the price it’s going to pay is losing people like me, and more importantly- losing elections.”

“Conservatives my age tend to be far more willing to engage in those conversations than liberals, the worst of [whom] enter any conversation with the delusional notion that their worldview is undeniably superior, and absolutely the ideal moral paradigm,” he said.

I personally think last one may be the biggest issue for him since if those are the people that are going to be the future of the party he sees some serious problems moving forward.

 

[volinbham]

I personally think last one may be the biggest issue for him since if those are the people that are going to be the future of the party he sees some serious problems moving forward.

Goes hand in hand with identity politics, the other side isn't just wrong; they are bad people.

Heard a comment the other day, the right thinks the left is wrong; the left thinks the right is evil.

 

[Grand Vol]

I agree that the extremes of both parties weaken the mainstream components. That's true of GOP and Dem alike, that is correct. But do you really think that Dems did not show up to vote for Clinton because of the party being to far left?

Please.

Whatever shortfall there was in motivation on the Dem side was due to HRC being such a dull and unattractive candidate, not that the party was too far left.

Remember, the people coming out now, after a big loss, to rally the party are going to be the extremists, the identity politics people, as you would put it. But that is not who controls the money or the platform, and it is not who ultimately controls the votes.

So do not think that the Dem party is being yanked to the left because that is who you see on tv. Or more accurately, who you see Fox and Drudge mocking as somehow representative of the Dem party.

After the GOP has had its losses, in the immediate aftermath its not people giving speeches or holding rallies saying, we need to go more to the center. Its the extremists saying we need to go more to the right.

Same here.

You think Hillary lost because she was a boring and unattractive candidate?

Please.

She lost because of more than one reason. The FBI investigation, the Wikileaks, the fact she bounced around on policy issues repeatedly and most importantly the way the left acted both during and after the election cycle. And yes, she was boring.

However...

She lost the Bernie vote because of the crappy way he was treated by the party and the fact the race was rigged from the start. Bernie supporters didn't hold their nose and vote for her just because he was the candidate. They stayed home. The far left extremes of the party didn't support her just like the far right extremes didn't support Romney in 2012. And furthermore, it remains to be seen who will control the party and the platform coming up. Unless they get someone other than the ones that have run so far, your party is in big trouble. Because right now, I see your leading candidates (or at least those trying to get their name out there) in 2020 being:

Liz Warren
Sidney Blumenthal
Cory Booker
Kirsten Gillibrand

With only Booker having a legitimate shot since he isn't far left crazy and but has enough appeal to go across the entire party. But make no mistake, the far left is what lost you the election and continue to lose seats in the House, Senate, State Legislatures and Governorships.

 

[RussDogg]

They certainly won't gain many members blaming all men and all white people for America's ills. They are alienating a large portion of the voting population.

This all day. Partisan politics is complicit in keeping the racial divide thriving.