Prayers for Myanmar and Bangkok

[EasternVol]

Thailand Says Collapsed Bangkok Tower Used Substandard Steel

The contractors of an under-construction tower that crashed in Bangkok during last week's earthquake apparently used substandard steel bars made by a

www.insurancejournal.com

 

[LouderVol]

Thailand Says Collapsed Bangkok Tower Used Substandard Steel

The contractors of an under-construction tower that crashed in Bangkok during last week's earthquake apparently used substandard steel bars made by a

www.insurancejournal.com

why am I not surprised.

"The discovery of the substandard steel comes amid a separate probe ordered by the government to uncover the reasons for the building collapse. Xin Ke Yuan Steel is the second Chinese company to draw Thai scrutiny. The skyscraper was being constructed by ITD-CREC, a joint venture between Italian-Thai Development Pcl and China Railway Number 10 Thailand Co."

there is a reason I have been hating on the chinese. they will lie and say whatever it takes to get something sold. I have seen it first hand, and the implications are terrifying.

 

[utvolpj]

there is a reason I have been hating on the chinese. they will lie and say whatever it takes to get something sold. I have seen it first hand, and the implications are terrifying.

I once lost the underground piping bid for the Phx Coyotes stadium to a competitor supplying Chinese, cast-iron pipe. It ended up being full of pin hole leaks and they had to tear the whole thing apart and replace with American made pipe which is still there now. It was an expensive lesson but didn't cost any lives like this

 

[LouderVol]

I once lost the underground piping bid for the Phx Coyotes stadium to a competitor supplying Chinese, cast-iron pipe. It ended up being full of pin hole leaks and they had to tear the whole thing apart and replace with American made pipe which is still there now. It was an expensive lesson but didn't cost any lives like this

with how prevalent Chinese steel is in the US, its a matter of when, not if. 2018 tariffs cut some of it off, but I still believe there is more getting into the US than otherwise "should" be.

I have no percentages to throw at it, but at least some of the Mexican steel is just rebranded Chinese steel.

 

[PEPPERJAX]

I once lost the underground piping bid for the Phx Coyotes stadium to a competitor supplying Chinese, cast-iron pipe. It ended up being full of pin hole leaks and they had to tear the whole thing apart and replace with American made pipe which is still there now. It was an expensive lesson but didn't cost any lives like this

Is that competitor you lost the bid to still in business?

 

[utvolpj]

Is that competitor you lost the bid to still in business?

Definitely since they were still one of the top5 biggest nationally. It did lead to is getting a lot more business from that contractor though which was nice

 

[LouderVol]

Definitely since they were still one of the top5 biggest nationally. It did lead to is getting a lot more business from that contractor though which was nice

do you mind telling me who that competitor was/is?

 

[utvolpj]

do you mind telling me who that competitor was/is?

Hughes supply

 

[PEPPERJAX]

why am I not surprised.

"The discovery of the substandard steel comes amid a separate probe ordered by the government to uncover the reasons for the building collapse. Xin Ke Yuan Steel is the second Chinese company to draw Thai scrutiny. The skyscraper was being constructed by ITD-CREC, a joint venture between Italian-Thai Development Pcl and China Railway Number 10 Thailand Co."

there is a reason I have been hating on the chinese. they will lie and say whatever it takes to get something sold. I have seen it first hand, and the implications are terrifying.

I told my wife that we are staying at a resort with only floor level rooms the next time we go to Bangkok. There is a cool place I stayed at back in 2018 that was pretty swag only ten minutes away from Suvarnabhumi Airport. Normally, we prefer to stay at the JW Marriott which is bad azz as well. I am paranoid that there are other buildings in Krung Thep that pose a risk of falling from another tremor or quake.

 

[EasternVol]

I told my wife that we are staying at a resort with only floor level rooms the next time we go to Bangkok. There is a cool place I stayed at back in 2018 that was pretty swag only ten minutes away from Suvarnabhumi Airport. Normally, we prefer to stay at the JW Marriott which is bad azz as well. I am paranoid that there are other buildings in Krung Thep that pose a risk of falling by another tremor or quake.

Is the resort Ammata Lanta? Cool place if it is. The JW is indeed bad azz - passed Thaksin and his posse in the lobby there one evening. I considered asking him his favorite spot in Nana Plaza but thought better of it.

 

[PEPPERJAX]

Is the resort Ammata Lanta? Cool place if it is. The JW is indeed bad azz - passed Thaksin and his posse in the lobby there one evening. I considered asking him his favorite spot in Nana Plaza but thought better of it.

That is the one. The owner of the resort is an artist and artifact collector. He gave my wife a Buddha statue that was a few centuries old from his collection.

 

[TheDirector]

I don't know of any hard set value a building has to hit as a general condition. but the more things you add to it, the more/stricter the requirements there are. I do know California has their own code, so maybe its more directly referenced there.

Having sat through a couple seismic construction seminars in California, this is accurate. California changed their requirements after an Earthquake in Long Beach in 1933. It didn't cause as much death as it could have because luckily schools were out at the time it hit. But it basically leveled every school in the area. Most of the deaths that did occur were actually people fleeing buildings and getting struck by debris. Thus leading to the advice of drop duck and cover rather than run outside. With that said, every time an earthquake hits there are a lot of people that run outside immediately.

After that Long Beach Earthquake, California changed the codes and started upgrading most buildings. As someone said earlier, 7.0 is often referenced as a baseline but some are "supposedly" designed to withstand up to a 9.0. Most engineers and experts take this with a grain of salt because the energy difference from 7 to 8 to 9 is so enormous that you are dealing with a lot of theories in design and engineering that can't be accurately tested. Also a building could be standing perfectly intact after a 7 but have no exterior after a 8 or 9. Is that considered a success if only the shell(brick, cladding, glass etc...) comes off? Not if you are standing below the falling debris.

There is now an app that warns you immediately after Earthquakes hit and it's actually impressive. A fairly large one hit a couple years ago and the alert hit my phone a few seconds before it got to my area. Then it rumbled through just as predicted. I live on top of the same fault as the long beach earthquake so I've read plenty about it. Supposedly it has the capability to produce a deadlier and more destructive quake than what the San Andreas could produce. Fingers Crossed!

 

[LouderVol]

Having sat through a couple seismic construction seminars in California, this is accurate. California changed their requirements after an Earthquake in Long Beach in 1933. It didn't cause as much death as it could have because luckily schools were out at the time it hit. But it basically leveled every school in the area. Most of the deaths that did occur were actually people fleeing buildings and getting struck by debris. Thus leading to the advice of drop duck and cover rather than run outside. With that said, every time an earthquake hits there are a lot of people that run outside immediately.

After that Long Beach Earthquake, California changed the codes and started upgrading most buildings. As someone said earlier, 7.0 is often referenced as a baseline but some are "supposedly" designed to withstand up to a 9.0. Most engineers and experts take this with a grain of salt because the energy difference from 7 to 8 to 9 is so enormous that you are dealing with a lot of theories in design and engineering that can't be accurately tested. Also a building could be standing perfectly intact after a 7 but have no exterior after a 8 or 9. Is that considered a success if only the shell(brick, cladding, glass etc...) comes off? Not if you are standing below the falling debris.

There is now an app that warns you immediately after Earthquakes hit and it's actually impressive. A fairly large one hit a couple years ago and the alert hit my phone a few seconds before it got to my area. Then it rumbled through just as predicted. I live on top of the same fault as the long beach earthquake so I've read plenty about it. Supposedly it has the capability to produce a deadlier and more destructive quake than what the San Andreas could produce. Fingers Crossed!

its considered a success if people are able to survive it safely. I haven't dealt with earthquakes to know the protocol, stay inside and shelter in place, or get outside. But with fires an apartment building could burn down, but as long as residents were able to escape, and fire rescue could work, in a timely and relatively safe manner its considered a success regardless of what happens to the building.

there is a still a review, maybe a lawsuit, and things are checked. but its a lot easier if no one was hurt. At some point its impossible to build an "X-proof" building. You get anything hot enough, it will burn. you shake anything enough, it will eventually break. at some point the code/design team/owner/city are saying its "safe enough", not that its totally safe.

in your case with the falling debris, that would be considered a failure if someone was hurt getting out, but the building still stood.

 

[KB5252]

with how prevalent Chinese steel is in the US, its a matter of when, not if. 2018 tariffs cut some of it off, but I still believe there is more getting into the US than otherwise "should" be.

I have no percentages to throw at it, but at least some of the Mexican steel is just rebranded Chinese steel.

I work for a company that supplies all kinds of manufacturing, industrial, construction etc. Virtually all grade 8 fasteners are manufactured there because of the yellow dichromate finish used. What they make for US markets are tested pretty intensely to meet standards.

Everything else from China I've found to be hit or miss. Europe produces high quality steel, Germany, Italy big players. Sweden and Finland produce some very high quality specialized steel.

We really need to bolster our steel production at home.

 

[LouderVol]

I work for a company that supplies all kinds of manufacturing, industrial, construction etc. Virtually all grade 8 fasteners are manufactured their because of the yellow dichromate finish used. What they make for US markets are tested pretty intensely to meet standards.

Everything else from China I've found to be hit or miss. Europe produces high quality steel, Germany, Italy big players. Sweden and Finland produce some very high quality specialized steel.

We really need to bolster our steel production at home.

I would want to see where those tests were done.

If it was done in China, I wouldn't trust any label they slapped on there. My first ever project we found them forging a UL label for some gypsum.

 

[KB5252]

I would want to see where those tests were done.

If it was done in China, I wouldn't trust any label they slapped on there. My first ever project we found them forging a UL label for some gypsum.

They are tested here independently as I understand it. And because of the standards, heat and vibration resistance, and their use in OEM projects they maintain the standards pretty well.

It's the one offs and batch quantities, steel products-wise you have to be wary of.

 

[GVF]

heck erryone thinks of Cal, but Memphis and even East TN might get the Madrid quake..frightening.

I gappened to be in Chatt visiting back when that quake hit Chatt years ago..I was asleep and thought I was having a seizure or something.

We were still in NE GA early mid 2000's when the quake rattled around West TN/Mizz area. Can't recall exactly. We got tremors that far away. Laying in bed, things started rattling around on dresser and falling off. It was very eerie experience.

 

[dalton_vol]

why am I not surprised.

"The discovery of the substandard steel comes amid a separate probe ordered by the government to uncover the reasons for the building collapse. Xin Ke Yuan Steel is the second Chinese company to draw Thai scrutiny. The skyscraper was being constructed by ITD-CREC, a joint venture between Italian-Thai Development Pcl and China Railway Number 10 Thailand Co."

there is a reason I have been hating on the chinese. they will lie and say whatever it takes to get something sold. I have seen it first hand, and the implications are terrifying.

Wait, are you saying that China produces sub quality materials?

 

[dalton_vol]

I work for a company that supplies all kinds of manufacturing, industrial, construction etc. Virtually all grade 8 fasteners are manufactured there because of the yellow dichromate finish used. What they make for US markets are tested pretty intensely to meet standards.

Everything else from China I've found to be hit or miss. Europe produces high quality steel, Germany, Italy big players. Sweden and Finland produce some very high quality specialized steel.

We really need to bolster our steel production at home.

.

 

[dalton_vol]

I work for a company that supplies all kinds of manufacturing, industrial, construction etc. Virtually all grade 8 fasteners are manufactured there because of the yellow dichromate finish used. What they make for US markets are tested pretty intensely to meet standards.

Everything else from China I've found to be hit or miss. Europe produces high quality steel, Germany, Italy big players. Sweden and Finland produce some very high quality specialized steel.

We really need to bolster our steel production at home.

how dare you, you're sounding like some Trump nationalist. You're actually wanting to steal and materials made in us? That sounds very isolationist. Why are you against free trade. Sounds a lot of like white supremacy to me.

 

[EasternVol]

Rubio dismisses criticism over US response to Myanmar earthquake

The US has been accused of not doing enough to help Myanmar due to the shuttering of its humanitarian aid agency.

www.bbc.com

 

[StarRaider]

its considered a success if people are able to survive it safely. I haven't dealt with earthquakes to know the protocol, stay inside and shelter in place, or get outside. But with fires an apartment building could burn down, but as long as residents were able to escape, and fire rescue could work, in a timely and relatively safe manner its considered a success regardless of what happens to the building.

there is a still a review, maybe a lawsuit, and things are checked. but its a lot easier if no one was hurt. At some point its impossible to build an "X-proof" building. You get anything hot enough, it will burn. you shake anything enough, it will eventually break. at some point the code/design team/owner/city are saying its "safe enough", not that its totally safe.

in your case with the falling debris, that would be considered a failure if someone was hurt getting out, but the building still stood.

I had some coworkers who were in SF during the 89 quake (the one during the WS)... they were outside but said falling glass was their fear.