Playing to win vs playing not to lose

#27
#27
sjt18 said:
Nothing to do with "moving on" either. This isn't about OU per se. It is about UT's O as compared to a mid-major. UT's O couldn't move the ball vs OU. OU couldn't stop Tulsa a week later at home.

Tulsa just put to bed the notion that OU was just such a great defensive team that it wasn't reasonable to expect UT to move the ball.

So how about growing some... gumption... and try answering the question?
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Tulsa didn't put to bed anything on the OU defense. The very nature of college football is that excellent teams or excellent team units play flat occasionally. It's what makes ncaa football more exciting than nfl.
 
#29
#29
volroadwarrior said:
Ho Hum!!!!!! :snoring::whistling: fahr butch---fahr debord----shoulda hahred Strong----WAIT:popcorn:
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Ho hum more idiotic attempts at deflection by those unwilling to discuss or even consider the existence of problems with this staff...

No one said anything about firing anyone except you as you attempt to exaggerate and create an argument... because you simply have no answer, do you?
 
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#31
#31
McDad said:
Tulsa didn't put to bed anything on the OU defense. The very nature of college football is that excellent teams or excellent team units play flat occasionally. It's what makes ncaa football more exciting than nfl.
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So who played flat? UT's O?

I can tell you that OU's D didn't "play flat" to the tune of over 600 yds of O. Worse yet.... their aggressive playcalling and good QB play resulted in well over 400 yds through the air.

If Tulsa had say 100 yds more than UT then maybe you have a point. But it was closer to 400 yds more.

Disappointing that you didn't even try to answer the question.
 
#33
#33
McDad said:
The OU game is done. But your question about the UT offense is interesting. The scheme is conservative by design. The only element which isn't conservative is the up tempo play. We have a run heavy, low risk philosophy. The only time CBJ has been unorthodox is out of necessity (UGA, USCe, etc). With that said, we have problems at Oline and WR. Oline has improved from last year but last season's line was so horrid that's not saying much. WRs....I don't have a clue what that unit's problem is.

Why did you think CBJ's offense was going to be aggressive in the first place when he was hired? Was Cincinnati setting the college football world on fire with its offense?
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Conservative = losing
 
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#34
#34
Sarge,

you make a solid point.

I'm not one of to over react, so I don't look to the OK loss as anything other than a loss in double over time. What I do look too is what is a now established track record of (outside of the Georgia 2013 and Iowa game, which were called very aggressive) an offensive attack that does no have a kill mentality.

It's frustrating that Butch talks about his team having swagger and confidence and when the chips are down he folds a pretty good hand unwilling to risk anything.

That being said, as a card player myself - You have to understand a bit about sample size, trends and running hot/cold. In that OK game there were some pretty big debacles that went our way. Dobbs had a huge fumble that should have been a scoop and score for OK and Hurd fumbled pretty ugly for a 15 yard loss. That would make me conservative too. His goaline FG was before all that though and so that's the decision I hold him accountable for.

I will not decide on Butch until this season is over. His work ethic has earned him three FULL seasons before he gets run out by the pitchfork and torch bearers. That's the Dooley difference. Work ethic and program building has in my mind earned him reasonable fans respect.


PS: ON a personal level I'm not a Jones fan. He reminds me of a robot man. Pre programmed to say the same dumb **** over and over. I'm much more inclined to gravitate to innovative coaches that have the guts to go balls to the wall.
 
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#37
#37
IBleedOrange said:
You honestly think Oklahoma is playing with the same kind of excitement today as a week ago?? It's not an excuse. Michigan St just got out gained in total yardage against Air Force today. I guess Dantonio better fire his defensive coordinator. Oklahoma is a little flat today just like Michigan St was
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If Tulsa outgained UT by 100 yds... blame it on them being flat. But it was almost 400 yds. Flat just doesn't explain that big of a difference.
 
#39
#39
sjt18 said:
It has nothing to do with me being "over myself". Get over YOURSELF and stop being a coward. What's the reason? Or are you just too much of a coward to discuss it?
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Hahahaha, a coward? It's a football conversation. I don't think I'm scared of a football conversation.

I simply gave you my opinion on why Oklahoma is giving up so many yards to Tulsa and then I gave another one about how Mich St got OUTGAINED by Air Force today to reinforce my point about good teams playing flat after a big win the week before.

I'm pretty sure that's why they're called "trap games"
 
#40
#40
To try to answer the question, I don't think Dobbs throws the football very well.

I don't think he throws it so poorly that they can't get more production from the passing game.

But, in order for the stuff Tennessee likes to run to work, it would help if they can make the defense back up.

If Tennessee had a dominant offensive line, they could run the ball without threatening a defense downfield through the air. But, they don't.

So, you are pretty much defending sideline to sideline for 10 yards. After that, you take your chances. Nothing is between the hashmarks either.

Again, even with that, they can be more creative.
 
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#42
#42
ReaderVol said:
Is that why we threw the ball more in 2nd half than 1st half?
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How many of those throws went more than 10 yds from the LOS? How many were screens?

You seem to think no matter how many times this excuse is refuted that it somehow carries weight. It doesn't.

Tulsa spread the field. Virtually every time OU went to pressure, they dropped a quick throw into the area vacated by their D. Pretty simple concept actually... that UT's staff couldn't utilize in 3 qtrs.
 
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#45
#45
ReaderVol said:
Is that why we threw the ball more in 2nd half than 1st half?
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Bubble screens and 3 yard passes aren't exactly what puts fear in the defense.

And calling passes alone isn't aggressive. He went conservative worth garbage passes. He also neglected his best player at the goal line.

He folds.
 
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#46
#46
volfanhill said:
The transitive property does not work in sports. The OK Tulsa game has literally nothing to do with our game.
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The transitive property doesn't work... which would be a problem if that's what we were looking at.

We are looking at why Tulsa's O flat ran over the same OU D that stopped UT cold a week earlier. Unit to unit direct comparison.
 
#47
#47
sjt18 said:
Stay classy... and maybe grow up at some point. Coward.
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Stop posting during your menstrual cycle. I asked very sincere questions about what you expected when CBJ was hired. Again, attempting to engage in a real discussion. You're a drama queen masquerading as a "reasonable" poster. That's your shtick. Ironically, you make some good points occasionally. ..I even complimented on that a few days ago.

I'll bow out and let the "butch sux" circle jerk have its climax. Enjoy.
 
#48
#48
volfanhill said:
The transitive property does not work in sports. The OK Tulsa game has literally nothing to do with our game.
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So, when the same cornerback, Sancez, who dominated our WRs and ended the game with an interception vs Tennessee, gets lit up all day long vs a Tulsa team that was 2-10 last year, that means nothing?
 
#50
#50
If I understand the title of this thread, it is Playing to win vs playing to not lose.

One can only contemplate what may or may not have been. I can only assume, given the background that I read of Coach Jones and Coach Montgomery (Tulsa) is that Montgomery would have pressed down and not looked back. Of course, he would have had the luxury of having a fantastic D like TN. With Tulsa's D, I think he took the correct course of action, which is try to outgun OK. I don't think he could depend on his D stopping OK, at least not much. Perine had a fumble inside the Red zone as well as did Mixon on two seperate drives. That cost OK 6 and maybe as much as 14 pts. Tulsa missed a chance for another TD and left a FG (blocked) on the field. It's easy as a fan to look at two totally different games against a familiar opponent and say "Man, shoulda done this, shoulda done that". Every coach has his method, his way of doing things. I'm not trying to take sides on this issue with Coach Jones. I like the man, he shows class. And I think he does have a way with recruits. I see both sides of the debate here as well. I thought TU would make this a game and they did. Scoring and aggressiveness in my book is what Tulsa brought to the rectangle (field). Not saying TN players didn't, each game has it's own, unique life unto itself.
 
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