PizzaGate

#527
#527
SamRebel35 said:
Yes
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If so, we are at an impasse.

We are either working with two different ideas of credible or we really have divergent epistemological values, especially when concerning extreme moral or criminal accusations of our fellow beings (particularly fellow citizens).
 
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#528
#528
MercyPercy said:
PKT has echoed my own thoughts on this matter. I haven't followed any mainstream media regarding this, so I haven't been "sullied" by whatever narrative you think they are pushing. I've read what's been posted in this thread, and do not find any of this compelling whatsoever. Most of it is laughable, with the connections trying to be made.

Child trafficking rings exist. Nothing posted here has suggested this is one, to me. It reads as bat**** at worst and a huge stretch at best.
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I guess we can take solace that there's at least another who shares our thoughts. We might be the only crazy ones (not seeing what they are seeing) or the only sane ones (seeing what they are not). At least neither one of us is the only one in the canoe.
 
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#529
#529
PKT_VOL said:
If so, we are at an impasse.

We are either working with two different ideas of credible or we really have divergent epistemological values, especially when concerning extreme moral or criminal accusations of our fellow beings (particularly fellow citizens).
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More like we have differing opinions on the threshold of evidence required to warrant a proper investigation by both media and law enforcement. You seem to think there is no investigation warranted unless there is absolute proof of child sex trafficking prior to the investigation. You wouldn't begin the investigation until there was some piece of evidence so damning that it would completely nullify the purpose of an investigation in the first place.

We also disagree in that I think "investigative journalists" ought to "investigate" rather than simply "proclaim" after zero investigation.
 
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#530
#530
PKT_VOL said:
If so, we are at an impasse.

We are either working with two different ideas of credible or we really have divergent epistemological values, especially when concerning extreme moral or criminal accusations of our fellow beings (particularly fellow citizens).
Click to expand...

Hypothetical: Would your level of skepticism change if you found out Julian Assange is dead?
 
#531
#531
SamRebel35 said:
More like we have differing opinions on the threshold of evidence required to warrant a proper investigation by both media and law enforcement. You seem to think there is no investigation warranted unless there is absolute proof of child sex trafficking prior to the investigation. You wouldn't begin the investigation until there was some piece of evidence so damning that it would completely nullify the purpose of an investigation in the first place.

We also disagree in that I think "investigative journalists" ought to "investigate" rather than simply "proclaim" after zero investigation.
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I'm with you Sam. There is enough to warrant an investigation of some kind whether it is by the media or law enforcement.

Of course now that this has gotten so much attention I have serious doubts an investigation would actually be able to uncover the truth - unless there was zero wrongdoing.
 
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#532
#532
SamRebel35 said:
More like we have differing opinions on the threshold of evidence required to warrant a proper investigation by both media and law enforcement. You seem to think there is no investigation warranted unless there is absolute proof of child sex trafficking prior to the investigation. You wouldn't begin the investigation until there was some piece of evidence so damning that it would completely nullify the purpose of an investigation in the first place.

We also disagree in that I think "investigative journalists" ought to "investigate" rather than simply "proclaim" after zero investigation.
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StrawMan.jpg
 
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#537
#537
SamRebel35 said:
Not a charitable interpretation of your views? Tell me where I've missed the mark. Where would you put the threshold of required evidence in order to warrant a proper investigation?
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The media can investigate anything they want. They are a private entity. Most of them dream of breaking a story like this. Rest assured, there are plenty of journalists investigating this story.

As for law enforcement, I would be surprised if they aren't investigating this. Maybe not to the extent or with the level of resources you might hope for. They have certainly investigated stuff with practically nothing there. Either way, it wouldn't upset me.

However, with that said, there is a monumental difference between investigating and reporting (or spreading speculation masquerading as news). I'm for the former and against the latter until one has their ducks in a row. It's the same reason law enforcement doesn't comment on investigations until they are complete.
 
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#538
#538
PKT_VOL said:
The media can investigate anything they want. They are a private entity. Most of them dream of breaking a story like this. Rest assured, there are plenty of journalists investigating this story.

As for law enforcement, I would be surprised if they aren't investigating this. Maybe not to the extent or with the level of resources you might hope for. They have certainly investigated stuff with practically nothing there. Either way, it wouldn't upset me.

However, with that said, there is a monumental difference between investigating and reporting (or spreading speculation masquerading as news). I'm for the former and against the latter until one has their ducks in a row. It's the same reason law enforcement doesn't comment on investigations until they are complete.
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Fair enough
 
#539
#539
PKT_VOL said:
The media can investigate anything they want. They are a private entity. Most of them dream of breaking a story like this. Rest assured, there are plenty of journalists investigating this story.

As for law enforcement, I would be surprised if they aren't investigating this. Maybe not to the extent or with the level of resources you might hope for. They have certainly investigated stuff with practically nothing there. Either way, it wouldn't upset me.

However, with that said, there is a monumental difference between investigating and reporting (or spreading speculation masquerading as news). I'm for the former and against the latter until one has their ducks in a row. It's the same reason law enforcement doesn't comment on investigations until they are complete.
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This is a reasonable explanation. Missing from this explanation, however, is the issue of media outlets who choose not to investigate, yet still render a conclusion that the story is fake (BBC and NYT among many others). Is that fine, or do you view it as hack journalism?
 
#542
#542
PKT_VOL said:
The media can investigate anything they want. They are a private entity. Most of them dream of breaking a story like this. Rest assured, there are plenty of journalists investigating this story.

As for law enforcement, I would be surprised if they aren't investigating this. Maybe not to the extent or with the level of resources you might hope for. They have certainly investigated stuff with practically nothing there. Either way, it wouldn't upset me.

However, with that said, there is a monumental difference between investigating and reporting (or spreading speculation masquerading as news). I'm for the former and against the latter until one has their ducks in a row. It's the same reason law enforcement doesn't comment on investigations until they are complete.
Click to expand...

SamRebel35 said:
This is a reasonable explanation. Missing from this explanation, however, is the issue of media outlets who choose not to investigate, yet still render a conclusion that the story is fake (BBC and NYT among many others). Is that fine, or do you view it as hack journalism?
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Plenty of journalists investigating this? Well if that's true, then we know they won't be from CNN, NYT, Washington Post, ABC, NBC, CBS, Fox News, BBC, NPR or any of the other mainstream outlets. They have all already declared the story to be fake news. So what does that leave? Only those outlets declared by the mainstream to be fake news. Interesting.

I think it has become clear that mainstream "news" is no longer in the news business; rather, they are in the business of pushing an agenda, regardless of the facts. They don't want people reporting facts because it interferes with their agenda, plain and simple.

The most damning aspect of this entire story might just be the extreme effort being put forth to shut it down. How many countless conspiracy theories have been postulated over the years? Kennedy, moon landing, 911, Columbine, Sandy Hook, Boston bombings, a myriad of other "false flag" conspiracies, and countless others, easily in the thousands. In all of those cases, no effort was ever made to censor the conspiracy theorists and absolutely shut down any discussion regarding the matter. TPTB were content to simply let folks stumble around in the dark. But not on pizzagate. The effort to shut it down is remarkable. And very damning.
 
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#544
#544
jamesd1628 said:
Plenty of journalists investigating this? Well if that's true, then we know they won't be from CNN, NYT, Washington Post, ABC, NBC, CBS, Fox News, BBC, NPR or any of the other mainstream outlets. They have all already declared the story to be fake news. So what does that leave? Only those outlets declared by the mainstream to be fake news. Interesting.

I think it has become clear that mainstream "news" is no longer in the news business; rather, they are in the business of pushing an agenda, regardless of the facts. They don't want people reporting facts because it interferes with their agenda, plain and simple.

The most damning aspect of this entire story might just be the extreme effort being put forth to shut it down. How many countless conspiracy theories have been postulated over the years? Kennedy, moon landing, 911, Columbine, Sandy Hook, Boston bombings, a myriad of other "false flag" conspiracies, and countless others, easily in the thousands. In all of those cases, no effort was ever made to censor the conspiracy theorists and absolutely shut down any discussion regarding the matter. TPTB were content to simply let folks stumble around in the dark. But not on pizzagate. The effort to shut it down is remarkable. And very damning.
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I mean, I can't even begin to describe the irony of that little snippet.


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9k=


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#547
#547
jamesd1628 said:
Plenty of journalists investigating this? Well if that's true, then we know they won't be from CNN, NYT, Washington Post, ABC, NBC, CBS, Fox News, BBC, NPR or any of the other mainstream outlets. They have all already declared the story to be fake news. So what does that leave? Only those outlets declared by the mainstream to be fake news. Interesting.

I think it has become clear that mainstream "news" is no longer in the news business; rather, they are in the business of pushing an agenda, regardless of the facts. They don't want people reporting facts because it interferes with their agenda, plain and simple.

The most damning aspect of this entire story might just be the extreme effort being put forth to shut it down. How many countless conspiracy theories have been postulated over the years? Kennedy, moon landing, 911, Columbine, Sandy Hook, Boston bombings, a myriad of other "false flag" conspiracies, and countless others, easily in the thousands. In all of those cases, no effort was ever made to censor the conspiracy theorists and absolutely shut down any discussion regarding the matter. TPTB were content to simply let folks stumble around in the dark. But not on pizzagate. The effort to shut it down is remarkable. And very damning.
Click to expand...

Someone telling you that you are full of sh*t is not the same thing as censorship.
 
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