Perception of Butch

#151
#151
McDad said:
Complacency, almost there, and also rans is our program. We have 2 national championships in 60 years, right?
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Sadly Fulmer is iconic... and had a career with two championships in 17 years?.... then a bunch of bridesmaid's dresses.
 
#152
#152
volfannbama said:
Lol, no what I demonstrated is not being stupid.
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No. Don't sell yourself short. It is plenty stupid to accept a low standard and somehow expect champions.

And again I ask you like I ask everyone else, who ya got? What coach you gonna win that gaurantees a championship within 4 years?
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To answer would be speculative and an argument from ignorance.... just like your challenge was.

Butch wasn't the only coach considered. That we know. We don't know who all was talked to... but there were others. Perhaps you think that Hart and the powers that be infallibly chose the absolute best candidate.... but I'm not buying it.

When you have a chance, look behind Jones' numbers at Cincy. He was set up well by Kelly. What was his win % against bowl teams? Ranked teams? Teams with a winning record?

Here's a hint. He's coach about the same level at UT as he did Cincy.... he's just playing a lot more good teams than he ever has.
 
#153
#153
Too controlling and plays it safe far too often. Not a brilliant game day coach. Loyal to a fault and stubborn.

Good for keeping the program somewhat on track. Decent with media but cliché ridden. Not a bad recruiter but development is weak.

What else? I don't know he seems like a decent guy and inherited a freaking mess, but I don't think Butch will ever compete with elite programs.
 
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#155
#155
sjt18 said:
No. Don't sell yourself short. It is plenty stupid to accept a low standard and somehow expect champions.



To answer would be speculative and an argument from ignorance.... just like your challenge was.

Butch wasn't the only coach considered. That we know. We don't know who all was talked to... but there were others. Perhaps you think that Hart and the powers that be infallibly chose the absolute best candidate.... but I'm not buying it.

When you have a chance, look behind Jones' numbers at Cincy. He was set up well by Kelly. What was his win % against bowl teams? Ranked teams? Teams with a winning record?

Here's a hint. He's coach about the same level at UT as he did Cincy.... he's just playing a lot more good teams than he ever has.
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Firing a coach that has posted a higher win total each year is stupid, plan and simple.

As to the Cincy comments, he went 4-8 in his first year and 10-3 the second year, dont really care about any more stats than that and dont care who they played.

As states before, you do not fire a coach who has posted a higher win total each year. The only exception is if you have a sure home run hire and there isnt one. You know how I know that? Because of the 15-20 times ive asked "who ya got?", you know how many answers I got..none, not a single one, just like your answer above.

And dont fool yourself into thinking you hold the key to why everyone like me is wrong because of all these stats. There is only one that matters and thats win/loss total.

Id like to see a new OC, but I said after the florida / georgia games that I hope CBJ is here for a long time. It's gonna take more than one bad loss to chance that.
 
#156
#156
cbrown said:
Asked a buddy who is the SID at another SEC school if Butch is respected around the league. His replied, "No. Hype man."

I hope I am wrong, but I fear we have peaked with him.
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The jury is still out on Butch. Some great coaches have been Hype men. Still could be boom or bust.
 
#157
#157
volfannbama said:
Firing a coach that has posted a higher win total each year is stupid, plan and simple.

As to the Cincy comments, he went 4-8 in his first year and 10-3 the second year, dont really care about any more stats than that and dont care who they played.

As states before, you do not fire a coach who has posted a higher win total each year. The only exception is if you have a sure home run hire and there isnt one. You know how I know that? Because of the 15-20 times ive asked "who ya got?", you know how many answers I got..none, not a single one, just like your answer above.

And dont fool yourself into thinking you hold the key to why everyone like me is wrong because of all these stats. There is only one that matters and thats win/loss total.

Id like to see a new OC, but I said after the florida / georgia games that I hope CBJ is here for a long time. It's gonna take more than one bad loss to chance that.
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Bohl!!!
 
#160
#160
volfannbama said:
Good candidate, isnt his record at wyoming 12-20? Glad that translate to a home run national championship level hire.
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Won 3 national championships at NDSU. 6-2 this year at a truly terrible program before he got there.
 
#161
#161
Burger said:
Won 3 national championships at NDSU. 6-2 this year at a truly terrible program before he got there.
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Yep, as I said he is doing a good job. How does that translate to a sure fire national championship candidate?
 
#162
#162
GAVol said:
That seems harsh, but until proven otherwise, it's hard to argue with that assessment.. This is two years in a row where he's lost a game that he shouldn't have where the team looked uninspired.

Has he been good for the program? Absolutely.

Is he the guy to finish the job? It's getting harder to say.
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Lol. It's gotten much, much easier to say; although it was never that difficult.
 
#164
#164
Burger said:
He knows what it takes to win a HC as he has won 3 as a HC and 1 as an assistant.
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Nowhere near the same thing, not even close. Not saying he cant win, but its not guaranteed, which is what all the Butch haters seem to want.
 
#165
#165
volfannbama said:
Nowhere near the same thing, not even close. Not saying he cant win, but its not guaranteed, which is what all the Butch haters seem to want.
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Nothing is guaranteed. I would take a coach who gives us a good chance.
 
#169
#169
5-7 year in and year out was a reality not that long ago. Show some respect to the coach that pulled us out of being a bottom tier SEC east team. Is Butch the best coach ever? No, but he might take us to a sec championship this year and he might progress as a coach in years to come. He has flaws, but there's only two coaches that are better than everyone else right now so relax enjoy what we got and until we start going towards Dooley level status he should stay. Btw the recruiting class Is looking pretty good especially if we pull a couple 5 stars on NSD
 
#171
#171
chargervol said:
I haven't said much on the subject since the South Carolina loss.

I'm not happy but I like to be able to completely identify a problem.
With Dooley, it was obvious and a consistent decline. What I can't quite put my finger on with Jones, is the consistent rise up until this season. Nothing changed on offense, yet we look like a fraction of what we were last year.
If there were a new OC or new scheme, I would understand, but I just don't. The people who love to trash him just act like it has been this bad but that's not true. Last year's offense would have destroyed Ohio and definitely have won against South Carolina.
I just want to understand what has happened before saying much more.

Anyway, if he does have to go, I like the way they Fade Route posted in another thread - if it's his peak, so be it. I will thank him for getting us out of the crap we had fallen into.

I will not sit behind the keyboard and run my mouth and call him names, like the trashier posters on here. Unlike our previous coach, he has not thrown the players under the bus nor ruined relationships with high school coaches. He doesn't deserve the sh*t even if he isn't the right guy to get us in championship form.
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I've heard a lot of chatter about Hurd being poison in the locker room so they could've been a major distraction for teammates. I do know that the team as a whole looked a lot more happy and energetic tonight vs. the rest of the season. Offense and defense was meeting the other coming off the field with congrats and smiles, don't remember seeing that earlier in year. Just my observations
 
#173
#173
MFL said:
Win out and he's good. Drop one and he's out. Next year looks bad
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He's not out this year regardless. Lame duck AD.

Mind you, I'm not a big fan of Butch. VFL. Program comes first.

Same cannot be said for Debord and some of the position coaches, but we'll see if CBJ's coaching acumen can override his ego.

As for next year, you could be right...but based on what I saw of Dormady, Kelly, and the receivers...and with Shoop having a healthy (hopefully) defense...next year could be good. Really good.

Or not.

Either way, Go Vols.
 
#174
#174
Jones is a classless prick with SPS that's reached his fullest potential. You naive fans will still be wanting to give him a chance this time next year, when he still sucks! Vols are going no where with this moron. And don't give me the neg bs, I've waited too damn long for a good team to show up. Still waiting ...
 
#175
#175
XFAN said:
Jones is a classless prick with SPS that's reached his fullest potential. You naive fans will still be wanting to give him a chance this time next year, when he still sucks! Vols are going no where with this moron. And don't give me the neg bs, I've waited too damn long for a good team to show up. Still waiting ...
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Theres a nice crimson band wagon to jump on, right after your little pity party is over.
 
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