Offensive changes

#77
#77
maxxx said:
I see all the coaching change threads. And I'm sick of them. Canning a guy before his first class are seniors is shear stupidity. It destroys any hope of continuity. And hurts a program more th a n anything. Staying the course is sometimes hard. But yhe reward will be greater.

I've e a these this offense look stale for 3 years now. Does anyone support the idea of firing Chaney and bringing in Freeze? This way the head guy stays the same. And he can continue the strong recruiting. And culture development. It would be cheaper to make zfreeze the highest paid OC in the country. Rather than the huge financial hit of firing Pruitt.
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I love the idea of firing Chaney.................I thought he sucked when he worked for Dooley . Think less of him now. I still say he is most of our problem.
 
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#78
#78
AshG said:
Run the data.

Why has Chaney helmed highly effective offenses everywhere but here this time around?

Why would Freeze consider a demotion from HC to OC?

The idea doesn't add up.
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You are correct. Freeze isn't going to take a demotion at this point. He would stay at Liberty if that is his only option. I have heard that he has been campaigning for the job. Not sure how accurate that is but something to take note about.

As for the offense, I saw at time this year as well as last year where Chaney's play calling was working. Receivers were open but we couldn't get the ball to the receivers accurately. Some of those missed receivers could have/would have changed the outcome of games. Bray made those throws when he QB'd Chaney's offense under Dooley. The problem then was Dooley forcing us into a 3-4 when we didn't have the players who could play that defense successfully. The talent is there on offense. We just need a player at QB who can make the throws accurately and consistently. We haven't had that in the last 4 years. If we did we would have had a number of different outcomes due to having a successful offense. It's even harder when you have young receivers and the QB can't really make the right decisions and accurate throws to help them out.

Things will be different next season. Pruitt's recruits will be starting to mature into SEC caliber players and moving into the leadership positions that Jones' players were having to assume the last 2 years. We lost that leadership last year and there wasn't anyone to fill the gap this year. We had a gap year this year due to the transition from Jones' players who were not good enough to step up and overachieve to the players Pruitt has recruited. I think Pruitt tried to do everything he could to get the most out of Jones's remaining players but it just wasn't there.

My knock on Pruitt at this point was not moving on to his recruits and letting them learn on the job. Freshman and Sophomores take their lumps and learn from them every year on a number of teams and it doesn't hurt their feelings. They then learn from their experiences and grow into the better players. I think that was missed on a number of occasions especially at QB. No reason for JG to be in at the end of the blow out games.

Time will tell. I think Pruitt should be given another year but it's not my decision. We don't need to make a change though just to make one or to bring in another "up and coming" coach. If we can't get a top tiered HC to replace Pruitt then the discussion isn't worth the time. Is Freeze the answer? I'm not so sure of that. But, nothing less than Freeze should even be considered.

GBO
 
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#79
#79
VOLINVONORE said:
A judge once said, "a tiger never changes his stripes". I would think Freeze fits in nicely with the last President at Liberty. Perfect job for him.
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People don’t change fundamentally but they do evolve, they grow, and they become self aware. Give someone a second chance and you might end up being surprised. And remember every moment of our lives is a second chance.
 
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#80
#80
When Dooley lost to Kentucky, I was done but talked myself back up and looked forward to the moves that would fix it next season. Same with Butch after getting plastered by Vandy. This is new territory. I’m a hardline coach backer to a fault. I believe in every chance given before firing them. Never felt less enthused at meaningless delays of the inevitable.
 
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#81
#81
The biggest change we need to make is being 100x more agressive. Example: Between the 2020 and 2021 classes Mike Leach has taken 7 QBs. 3 in 2020 and 4 in 2021.
 
#82
#82
Anyone here old enough to remember Belichick coaching the Browns? I for one never thought he'd be worth a crap after watching that train wreck. It's amazing what finally getting a very good QB will do for a coaching career. Who knows what would have happened had Covid not struck. I do believe that Pruitt needs to keep his nose out of the offense and let Chaney sink or swim if he has been controlling the offense. Never a fan of hiring friends but in this profession his friends could just be coaches he served with over the years. I am a firm believer that if Fulmer believes Pruitt's a good coach (and Fulmer should know what one looks like)then the turning over the coaching staff every 2-3 years would be far more damaging than most on here think. What is funny is instead of having a discussion about the pros and cons we have a few here that try very hard to make themselves SEEM smarter than everybody else.I have no problem saying I don't know everything about what's happened behind the scenes but change for the sake of change is not good. If they have a can't miss coach willing to take over fine. I believe though that is not the case and the usual search would take place.If that happens you can probably write off the next 3-5 years since it will be the up and comer and then in 3 years his replacement. I for one do not want to take that ride again, do you?
 
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#83
#83
GR82BVOL said:
You are correct. Freeze isn't going to take a demotion at this point. He would stay at Liberty if that is his only option. I have heard that he has been campaigning for the job. Not sure how accurate that is but something to take note about.

As for the offense, I saw at time this year as well as last year where Chaney's play calling was working. Receivers were open but we couldn't get the ball to the receivers accurately. Some of those missed receivers could have/would have changed the outcome of games. Bray made those throws when he QB'd Chaney's offense under Dooley. The problem then was Dooley forcing us into a 3-4 when we didn't have the players who could play that defense successfully. The talent is there on offense. We just need a player at QB who can make the throws accurately and consistently. We haven't had that in the last 4 years. If we did we would have had a number of different outcomes due to having a successful offense. It's even harder when you have young receivers and the QB can't really make the right decisions and accurate throws to help them out.

Things will be different next season. Pruitt's recruits will be starting to mature into SEC caliber players and moving into the leadership positions that Jones' players were having to assume the last 2 years. We lost that leadership last year and there wasn't anyone to fill the gap this year. We had a gap year this year due to the transition from Jones' players who were not good enough to step up and overachieve to the players Pruitt has recruited. I think Pruitt tried to do everything he could to get the most out of Jones's remaining players but it just wasn't there.

My knock on Pruitt at this point was not moving on to his recruits and letting them learn on the job. Freshman and Sophomores take their lumps and learn from them every year on a number of teams and it doesn't hurt their feelings. They then learn from their experiences and grow into the better players. I think that was missed on a number of occasions especially at QB. No reason for JG to be in at the end of the blow out games.

Time will tell. I think Pruitt should be given another year but it's not my decision. We don't need to make a change though just to make one or to bring in another "up and coming" coach. If we can't get a top tiered HC to replace Pruitt then the discussion isn't worth the time. Is Freeze the answer? I'm not so sure of that. But, nothing less than Freeze should even be considered.

GBO
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We have made bad decisions in the past. I guess he thinks we will again and hire him.
 
#84
#84
I watched the Costal Carolina, Liberty game last night. Either coach would be a huge improvement over JP. Either coach would beat a JP coached team with their players or with his. Innovative offenses, tough physical football and no quit until the whistle. Great football game to watch.
 
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#85
#85
Mightyvol said:
I watched the Costal Carolina, Liberty game last night. Either coach would be a huge improvement over JP. Either coach would beat a JP coached team with their players or with his. Innovative offenses, tough physical football and no quit until the whistle. Great football game to watch.
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Watching how hard the players on those teams played last night, and then going back and watching some of the film of us this year this morning, is just painful.

Our players look absolutely disinterested in football in comparison.
 
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#86
#86
INDEFENSE said:
Anyone here old enough to remember Belichick coaching the Browns? I for one never thought he'd be worth a crap after watching that train wreck. It's amazing what finally getting a very good QB will do for a coaching career. Who knows what would have happened had Covid not struck. I do believe that Pruitt needs to keep his nose out of the offense and let Chaney sink or swim if he has been controlling the offense. Never a fan of hiring friends but in this profession his friends could just be coaches he served with over the years. I am a firm believer that if Fulmer believes Pruitt's a good coach (and Fulmer should know what one looks like)then the turning over the coaching staff every 2-3 years would be far more damaging than most on here think. What is funny is instead of having a discussion about the pros and cons we have a few here that try very hard to make themselves SEEM smarter than everybody else.I have no problem saying I don't know everything about what's happened behind the scenes but change for the sake of change is not good. If they have a can't miss coach willing to take over fine. I believe though that is not the case and the usual search would take place.If that happens you can probably write off the next 3-5 years since it will be the up and comer and then in 3 years his replacement. I for one do not want to take that ride again, do you?
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I’m wont to give past coaches too much time. Did it with Fulmer, Dooley and Butch...sorry not sorry. I back them until I realize they’ve lost their base...then I’m done. Already written off any seasons remaining with this guy...because I’m done. Sorry not sorry.
 
#87
#87
INDEFENSE said:
Anyone here old enough to remember Belichick coaching the Browns? I for one never thought he'd be worth a crap after watching that train wreck. It's amazing what finally getting a very good QB will do for a coaching career. Who knows what would have happened had Covid not struck. I do believe that Pruitt needs to keep his nose out of the offense and let Chaney sink or swim if he has been controlling the offense. Never a fan of hiring friends but in this profession his friends could just be coaches he served with over the years. I am a firm believer that if Fulmer believes Pruitt's a good coach (and Fulmer should know what one looks like)then the turning over the coaching staff every 2-3 years would be far more damaging than most on here think. What is funny is instead of having a discussion about the pros and cons we have a few here that try very hard to make themselves SEEM smarter than everybody else.I have no problem saying I don't know everything about what's happened behind the scenes but change for the sake of change is not good. If they have a can't miss coach willing to take over fine. I believe though that is not the case and the usual search would take place.If that happens you can probably write off the next 3-5 years since it will be the up and comer and then in 3 years his replacement. I for one do not want to take that ride again, do you?
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I think of Cleveland's merry-go-round treatment of Schottenheimer, Carson, and Belichik pretty often. I was young, and it was my first time seeing the media being so irrational and just seeming to stir the pot.

Cleveland rode Marty Schottenheimer out of town for never getting past John Elway to the Super Bowl, then went nuts for Bud Carson. The sportswriters raved about what an upgrade Carson was, including that he called the game against the NYJ his "own personal Super Bowl." You remember Bud Carson, right? They ditched him after two years, and switched back to a dour 40 yo coach named Belichik who was supposedly a defensive genius with bad people skills. Belichik was a pedigree assistant that had mentored under the immortal Paul Brown; he also then hired an assistant named Nick Saban. (So I guess we can trace Jeremy Pruitt to Paul Brown.)

The Cleveland media, especially writers at the Plain Dealer, seemed to LOATHE Schottenheimer and Belichik, and constantly criticized their player management and handling of the media (surprise). I recall specific criticisms that they were disinterested and showed neither football acumen, personnel management, job passion, nor interpersonal skills. And that they did not have the right stuff to win the Big Ones. These are not different than the criticisms we see of Pruitt when he loses. Interestingly, four of these are where Belichik turned out to excell many years later. Cleveland also had a love/hate relationship with their QB, Bernie Kosar, who took care of the football but had limited upside. Of course, Broncos fans loved to hate Elway, too, for never winning "the Big One"...until he did.

Fans and writers really have NO accountability. They are especially tough on players and coaches who are introverts and just want to focus on their jobs.
 
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#89
#89
Mightyvol said:
I watched the Costal Carolina, Liberty game last night. Either coach would be a huge improvement over JP. Either coach would beat a JP coached team with their players or with his. Innovative offenses, tough physical football and no quit until the whistle. Great football game to watch.
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I watched too, both coaches would definitely fit in at UT. One was coaching players to throw pick sixes, the other mid managed the end of regulatio, throwing away a chance to put the game away, and didn’t have all his players on the same page at the end. One had to win, one had to lose. You could see that both coached to win and that both coached to lose......yep, either would fit in
 
#91
#91
maxxx said:
I know exactly who the hell Chaney is. I know all the NFL talent he's had that didn't perform, also. I know the NFL tight ends he's had and NFL relievers. I also know he's rarely had an explosive offense despite always having superior talent. His offense needs some tweaking, or the kids need another year in the system. Freeze is a guy that can produce an explosive offense. I didn't know what freeze was making, but Tennessee has the ability to make him the highest paid coordinator in the country, and HC in waiting.
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:rolleyes:
 
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#92
#92
Wireless1 said:
I watched too, both coaches would definitely fit in at UT. One was coaching players to throw pick sixes, the other mid managed the end of regulatio, throwing away a chance to put the game away, and didn’t have all his players on the same page at the end. One had to win, one had to lose. You could see that both coached to win and that both coached to lose......yep, either would fit in
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Both are excellent coaches, who , in order to win with less talent, are high in risk/reward type plays that utilize the abilities of their skill players. We already have the king of pick 6 coaches. The Liberty QB overthrew open receivers. It was a competitive game and both teams played hard till the end. Either coach would be an upgrade to JP and his unwatchable football.
 
#93
#93
BeardedVol said:
Watching how hard the players on those teams played last night, and then going back and watching some of the film of us this year this morning, is just painful.

Our players look absolutely disinterested in football in comparison.
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Football was getting in the way of the weed slinging.
 
#95
#95
zydane47 said:
This has got to be one of the dumbest takes I’ve ever seen on here.
If a coach is so thin skinned that a message board would scare him off or would scare recruits off then they’ll never make it far in football or life for that matter.
Pruitt is what he is a very good DC when he has the talent but a piss poor HC.
He needs to be shown the door, another year won’t do any good
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Another year and another losing season, and then we be in competition with Tx, Mich and possibly Penn State. Not much competition now. That is why we need to move now, or immediately after first of the year.
 
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#96
#96
maxxx said:
I see all the coaching change threads. And I'm sick of them. Canning a guy before his first class are seniors is shear stupidity. It destroys any hope of continuity. And hurts a program more th a n anything. Staying the course is sometimes hard. But yhe reward will be greater.

I've e a these this offense look stale for 3 years now. Does anyone support the idea of firing Chaney and bringing in Freeze? This way the head guy stays the same. And he can continue the strong recruiting. And culture development. It would be cheaper to make zfreeze the highest paid OC in the country. Rather than the huge financial hit of firing Pruitt.
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Yeah freeze head coach
 
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