Not so fast... About Justin Wilcox.

#51
#51
Take the stats out of the argument. Its apples and oranges. No blue turf, better players, etc. Especially if you're gonna selectively choose which games you are counting. (not first game, not TCU, etc.)

To me, CDD liked how he had his players playing on the field. Their intensity, did they look well coached, etc. And he liked the schemes and game planning he had. This is the stuff that will translate to TN and the SEC. That is, if his players trust that he's gonna help them succeed.
 
#52
#52
OH yeah...Wilcox is bringing it....

39125af4f660215946501fa208f31ef3aa43510.jpg
 
#55
#55
VolsFreak18 said:
The only think about that is his defense still gave up 42 points. I mean if TN put 8 or even 9 in the box I bet you we could hold a lot of running backs to 3.9 yards a carry. However, as a team they gave up 174 yards of rushing total for an average of 4.6 yards a carry. If anything that defensive showing is less impressive than this years Oregon game, but I am not impressed with either.
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Well homeboy that same year look at the defensive effort the whole season of 2006...which included a blow out of Oregon St. that went on to beat #3 U.S.C. that same season.

Football - Schedule - Broncosports.com - The Official Athletics Website Of Boise State University

Then in 2008...they edged out Oregon in Eugene BUT look at the defensive effort for the entire season by the team:

Football - Schedule - Broncosports.com - The Official Athletics Website Of Boise State University

Then last year they gave up more points but still did enough without superior talent to make enough plays to go undefeated:

Football - Schedule - Broncosports.com - The Official Athletics Website Of Boise State University

I'm just saying with a bunch of Raiques Crumps, Martaze Jacksons, and Dontavis Sapps on Boise St.'s team their defense does what it needs to keep them in games if they were facing really good offenses. While Wilcox has been DC his defenses have given up:

8 points allowed--1 time
7 points allowed--9 times
3 points allowed--2 times
0 points allowed--5 times

The object of defense is to stop the other team from having more points than your team at the end of games....given the talent and effort under Wilcox I'm very impressed...2 undefeated seasons and Boise State's record was 49-4 in four seasons with Wilcox at the defensive helm ....:clapping: GOOD ENOUGH FOR ME :eek:k:!
 
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#56
#56
agree. Cdd said he watched every vid of wilcox d. To look at their success or lack thereof in one or two games probably doesn't tells us too much about the coach. I think cdd liked the schemes, and he saw what he needed to see to say that wilcox is a coach that puts his players in favorable positions to make plays. He has the ability to vary schemes in short periods of time and still be able to teach in a manner that allows it to be installed quickly. In short, he can scheme and he can teach quickly and effectively.

volstexans said:
Take the stats out of the argument. Its apples and oranges. No blue turf, better players, etc. Especially if you're gonna selectively choose which games you are counting. (not first game, not TCU, etc.)

To me, CDD liked how he had his players playing on the field. Their intensity, did they look well coached, etc. And he liked the schemes and game planning he had. This is the stuff that will translate to TN and the SEC. That is, if his players trust that he's gonna help them succeed.
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Posted via VolNation Mobile
 
#57
#57
VolMax said:
The OP said:

"So after doing a little more research and taking off my orange colored glasses I no longer think of this as a home run hire that many on here think it is. I guess I am in the wait and see camp. I am just not going to go all in based on what he did against two teams especially when there could have been reasons why both teams didn't preform well on offense."

IMO, if your name is "VolFreak" anything, you need to be all in on the new staff. To not be all in is to say you do not have enough confidence in the current staff to give your all supporting the Vols. It is silly to say that you support the Vols 75%... "if at some point in the future I find them to be sufficiently competent, I will release the remaing 25% of my support."

Would I have been happier with a DC other than Wilcox? Maybe, but it wouldn't cause me to change my level of support for the Vols. I posted that I was all in when it appeared Cutcliffe was going to be HC even though I thought he was a horrible choice.

If the guy really thinks he has some reservations about supporting the staff at this point, he needs to put his orange colored glasses back on and wait until Double D and Co have had a chance to take the field.

We all LOVED the high profile staff assembled by the little douche that just burned us. How'd that turn out?

Forget Spring Practice and the walk through against Martin, bring on 9/11 and the Ducks!
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I will always love the Vols regardless of the staff. The 2 are not mutually inclusive.
 
#58
#58
everybody just needs to stop overanalizing everything and just give the guy a chance. Of course the coaches haven't work together before. Most coaching staffs haven't. Head coaches have to put together the best people he can for what he want to accomphish in the program. That's why you see some leave because of not being on the same page with the head coach.
 
#59
#59
VolsFreak18 said:
As I have been reading the last few days about peoples reaction to Justin Wilcox I have noticed a few things. The general feelings is that he was either a home run hire or at least a highly thought of hire. I was among the crowd that thought he was a homerun hire as well. After thinking about it a lot more I am not so sure.

His resume does speak volumes about what he has done thus far in his career. Many people are quick to point out what his defense did against Oregon and TCU. After looking up a few things I don't know that I think it was that big of a deal.

The reason I don't put much into what he did against Oregon is because it was the first game of the season. That goes for both offense and defense. I mean we put up 63 against W.Kentucky and we all knew that the UCLA game would be more telling about how good our team was going to be. In week one three games stood out that teams just didn't look like they were ready to play. Georgia was held to 10 points (their season avg was 27.7), BYU and Oklahoma were both way below their averages of 34.8 and 31.1, finally South Carolina and NC State played to a 7-3 game which was off of their averages of 21.8 and 30.3. The main point here is as much as it might look like Justin's defense held Oregon in check, it very well could have been that Oregon (which by the way had a new coach) just struggled on offense because it was the very first game of the season.

TCU might be a little more telling about how good of a job Justin did in calling a defense. However, when I went back to check TCU's schedule a couple games stood out. Against two of the better defenses that TCU played during the regular season they struggled against both. Air Force was giving up only 15.3 points a game this year and TCU only scored 20. Clemson was giving up 21 points a game and in this game TCU only scored 14. So maybe just maybe TCU was held to 10 points because they struggled against decent defenses and perhaps they were a bit overrated.

So after doing a little more research and taking off my orange colored glasses I no longer think of this as a home run hire that many on here think it is. I guess I am in the wait and see camp. I am just not going to go all in based on what he did against two teams especially when there could have been reasons why both teams didn't preform well on offense.
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If we hired anybody for what they did in a handfull of games, I think that would be monumentally stupid. But in the 4 yrs as Boise st DC. Their defense averaged out to 18th in the nation. In the pass happy WAC that is impressive. It may very well not end up being a "homerun hire". But I do believe CJW will prove out to be one of the best young Defensive minds in football. Compare Boises defense before and after. IIRC they averaged around 50th.
 
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#60
#60
sjt18 said:
I will say what I've been saying... We DON'T KNOW YET.

Dooley got off to a good start with what he accomplished with this recruiting class. We don't know if this staff can coach a lick or not. We all hope so. Most of us are willing to look at the positives in their backgrounds. But they haven't even gone through the first spring practice together yet. This group has never coached or run a program together.

There are just way too many unknowns to coronate or condemn them at this point.
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+1
 
#61
#61
DERELICK_MY_VOLS said:
Well homeboy that same year look at the defensive effort the whole season of 2006...which included a blow out of Oregon St. that went on to beat #3 U.S.C. that same season.

Football - Schedule - Broncosports.com - The Official Athletics Website Of Boise State University

Then in 2008...they edged out Oregon in Eugene BUT look at the defensive effort for the entire season by the team:

Football - Schedule - Broncosports.com - The Official Athletics Website Of Boise State University

Then last year they gave up more points but still did enough without superior talent to make enough plays to go undefeated:

Football - Schedule - Broncosports.com - The Official Athletics Website Of Boise State University

I'm just saying with a bunch of Raiques Crumps, Martaze Jacksons, and Dontavis Sapps on Boise St.'s team their defense does what it needs to keep them in games if they were facing really good offenses. While Wilcox has been DC his defenses have given up:

8 points allowed--1 time
7 points allowed--9 times
3 points allowed--2 times
0 points allowed--5 times

The object of defense is to stop the other team from having more points than your team at the end of games....given the talent and effort under Wilcox I'm very impressed...2 undefeated seasons and Boise State's record was 49-4 in four seasons with Wilcox at the defensive helm ....:clapping: GOOD ENOUGH FOR ME :eek:k:!
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Also, if you look at Boise's total defense ranking you'll see a noticeable improvement in 2006 and later (when he took over) compared to 2004 and 2005. Boise's defense was around #50 in '04 and '05 but was no worse than #25 in any of his seasons as DC.
 
#62
#62
triadvolfan said:
Also, if you look at Boise's total defense ranking you'll see a noticeable improvement in 2006 and later (when he took over) compared to 2004 and 2005. Boise's defense was around #50 in '04 and '05 but was no worse than #25 in any of his seasons as DC.
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Exactly my point....the numbers don't lie....nor do the wins....you take those Crumps of the world and get that type of productivity out of them it is what it is....AND THAT IS CALLED COACHING GREAT SCHEMES!
 
#63
#63
Heck if you wanna tear wilcox down before he even gets his chance just consider this when you try to put down his age or his experience as in the WAC.we just had the "almighty Monte Kiffin" the defensive GURU..The legend persay (granted i know he is good) But lets face it.our defence last year wasnt that awesome.we had our moments but there were alot of times we looked like we were being coached by a new young coach...lol

rush defense #7 in league 142.9 a game
scoring defense #6 21.0 a game
total defense #4 308.8
pass defense #4 165.9 (we were behind vandy with our genius coach)wow!
interceptions #10 with 9 in league (sucks to me with the secondary we had)
Sacks tied for #8 (with vandy and lsu)we had 20 florida had 35!!!
Red Zone defense #10 in league opponents scored 33 out of 38 times.go monte go monte get ya tampa on...go monte!!
opponents first downs #5 allowed 211.

compared to the year before
we were #3 in scoring defense 16.8
total defense #1 263.5 a game
rush defense #3 103.1 a game
pass defense #2 160.4
interseptions #3 with 17
sacks #10 with 22 we finsihed ranked lower in the league than we did under monte but we had 2 more than we did under him..
opponents first downs we were #1 we only allowed 196 all year!
red zone scoring #4 opponents scored 27 out of 35 times.

Point is dont sweat the defense.the genius wasnt that great after all....truth is lane kiffin should have kept Chavis and let his dad stay at tampa another year!
And dont even say his name recruited for us because we werent exactly getting every player we wanted on D didnt get many at all that we went hard at before it even came out that kiffin was leaving!look at elam,luc and various others.I would have loved to have gone out and got chavis back.dont get me wrong i always sweated on 3rd down but the guy was a very good defensive coordinator.and im sure everyone will start hollering..monte had no talent..OH WELL! the great one should have been able to have done better!! lol
 
#64
#64
posts like this are why people say tenn fans don't know much about football and a good example of why many proven coaches in good positions stay where they are instead of looking at the tenn job. Too many fans watch a game and have no clue whether the issue is scheme or personnel. They are complacent and used to use winning and if we aren't, it's the coaches fault, get rid of them. Monte had really three dtackles that could play at the level they needed to. We had no linebackers left by the end of the season. Rico, our best lbacker play on an injured knee and had no business being out there in the games late in the season where we got torched. A 205lb true freshman outside linebacker at mike? Of course it was all montes fault. Get ready. I'll predict that half way through the season, thus same bozo is going to be saying how wilcox "sucks" because we aren't going to be good against the run. Belichick himself couldn't come up with a solid run defense with two quality(hopefully) dtackles on a team.

JustinTN27 said:
Heck if you wanna tear wilcox down before he even gets his chance just consider this when you try to put down his age or his experience as in the WAC.we just had the "almighty Monte Kiffin" the defensive GURU..The legend persay (granted i know he is good) But lets face it.our defence last year wasnt that awesome.we had our moments but there were alot of times we looked like we were being coached by a new young coach...lol

rush defense #7 in league 142.9 a game
scoring defense #6 21.0 a game
total defense #4 308.8
pass defense #4 165.9 (we were behind vandy with our genius coach)wow!
interceptions #10 with 9 in league (sucks to me with the secondary we had)
Sacks tied for #8 (with vandy and lsu)we had 20 florida had 35!!!
Red Zone defense #10 in league opponents scored 33 out of 38 times.go monte go monte get ya tampa on...go monte!!
opponents first downs #5 allowed 211.

compared to the year before
we were #3 in scoring defense 16.8
total defense #1 263.5 a game
rush defense #3 103.1 a game
pass defense #2 160.4
interseptions #3 with 17
sacks #10 with 22 we finsihed ranked lower in the league than we did under monte but we had 2 more than we did under him..
opponents first downs we were #1 we only allowed 196 all year!
red zone scoring #4 opponents scored 27 out of 35 times.

Point is dont sweat the defense.the genius wasnt that great after all....truth is lane kiffin should have kept Chavis and let his dad stay at tampa another year!
And dont even say his name recruited for us because we werent exactly getting every player we wanted on D didnt get many at all that we went hard at before it even came out that kiffin was leaving!look at elam,luc and various others.I would have loved to have gone out and got chavis back.dont get me wrong i always sweated on 3rd down but the guy was a very good defensive coordinator.and im sure everyone will start hollering..monte had no talent..OH WELL! the great one should have been able to have done better!! lol
Click to expand...
Posted via VolNation Mobile
 
#65
#65
JustinTN27 said:
Heck if you wanna tear wilcox down before he even gets his chance just consider this when you try to put down his age or his experience as in the WAC.we just had the "almighty Monte Kiffin" the defensive GURU..The legend persay (granted i know he is good) But lets face it.our defence last year wasnt that awesome.we had our moments but there were alot of times we looked like we were being coached by a new young coach...lol

rush defense #7 in league 142.9 a game
scoring defense #6 21.0 a game
total defense #4 308.8
pass defense #4 165.9 (we were behind vandy with our genius coach)wow!
interceptions #10 with 9 in league (sucks to me with the secondary we had)
Sacks tied for #8 (with vandy and lsu)we had 20 florida had 35!!!
Red Zone defense #10 in league opponents scored 33 out of 38 times.go monte go monte get ya tampa on...go monte!!
opponents first downs #5 allowed 211.

compared to the year before
we were #3 in scoring defense 16.8
total defense #1 263.5 a game
rush defense #3 103.1 a game
pass defense #2 160.4
interseptions #3 with 17
sacks #10 with 22 we finsihed ranked lower in the league than we did under monte but we had 2 more than we did under him..
opponents first downs we were #1 we only allowed 196 all year!
red zone scoring #4 opponents scored 27 out of 35 times.

Point is dont sweat the defense.the genius wasnt that great after all....truth is lane kiffin should have kept Chavis and let his dad stay at tampa another year!
And dont even say his name recruited for us because we werent exactly getting every player we wanted on D didnt get many at all that we went hard at before it even came out that kiffin was leaving!look at elam,luc and various others.I would have loved to have gone out and got chavis back.dont get me wrong i always sweated on 3rd down but the guy was a very good defensive coordinator.and im sure everyone will start hollering..monte had no talent..OH WELL! the great one should have been able to have done better!! lol
Click to expand...

Record in those years:
2009 (Monte): 7-6
2008 (3rd and Chavis): 5-7

Stick to things that you actually know something about.
 
#67
#67
lylsmorr said:
To counter your point, it very well could be that Boise was very rusty and struggled at times on D because it was the very first game of the season.
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i think we will be just fine and looking forward to this new group of quility coaches.
 
#68
#68
VolsFreak18 said:
As I have been reading the last few days about peoples reaction to Justin Wilcox I have noticed a few things. The general feelings is that he was either a home run hire or at least a highly thought of hire. I was among the crowd that thought he was a homerun hire as well. After thinking about it a lot more I am not so sure.

His resume does speak volumes about what he has done thus far in his career. Many people are quick to point out what his defense did against Oregon and TCU. After looking up a few things I don't know that I think it was that big of a deal.

The reason I don't put much into what he did against Oregon is because it was the first game of the season. That goes for both offense and defense. I mean we put up 63 against W.Kentucky and we all knew that the UCLA game would be more telling about how good our team was going to be. In week one three games stood out that teams just didn't look like they were ready to play. Georgia was held to 10 points (their season avg was 27.7), BYU and Oklahoma were both way below their averages of 34.8 and 31.1, finally South Carolina and NC State played to a 7-3 game which was off of their averages of 21.8 and 30.3. The main point here is as much as it might look like Justin's defense held Oregon in check, it very well could have been that Oregon (which by the way had a new coach) just struggled on offense because it was the very first game of the season.

TCU might be a little more telling about how good of a job Justin did in calling a defense. However, when I went back to check TCU's schedule a couple games stood out. Against two of the better defenses that TCU played during the regular season they struggled against both. Air Force was giving up only 15.3 points a game this year and TCU only scored 20. Clemson was giving up 21 points a game and in this game TCU only scored 14. So maybe just maybe TCU was held to 10 points because they struggled against decent defenses and perhaps they were a bit overrated.

So after doing a little more research and taking off my orange colored glasses I no longer think of this as a home run hire that many on here think it is. I guess I am in the wait and see camp. I am just not going to go all in based on what he did against two teams especially when there could have been reasons why both teams didn't preform well on offense.
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Interesting how you say "two of the better defenses" and then just a paragraph later say they were "decent"
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#69
#69
braths said:
Record in those years:
2009 (Monte): 7-6
2008 (3rd and Chavis): 5-7

Stick to things that you actually know something about.
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What? If you think our awful 2008 season was because of our defensive woes then you may want to take some of your own advice
Posted via VolNation Mobile
 
#71
#71
I think to go undefeated in the WAC you gotta have a good D. Those teams put up some big numbers on offence. I think he was a good hire & he can defend the spread. Half our season next year is aginst teams that run some form of the spread. With the talent we have & this coaching staff we will get the absoulete best outta these kids.
 
#73
#73
Volunteeer said:
More proof of tenn fans football I.Q. Brilliant analysis, in depth research, facts be damned idiocy.....,
Posted via VolNation Mobile
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Look. I do understand stats and in depth. But I don't look into them that much. We have different players than Boise state so stats are gonna be completly different. Saying I have no football IQ is stupid
 
#74
#74
R0CKYT0P 16 said:
Look. I do understand stats and in depth. But I don't look into them that much. We have different players than Boise state so stats are gonna be completly different. Saying I have no football IQ is stupid
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Ih, look at the post, your comment was about montes d last year. You know, your post that is quoted in my post... I was only questioning your football I.Q. Maybe the reading skills are in doubt at well.
Posted via VolNation Mobile
 
#75
#75
Volunteeer said:
Ih, look at the post, your comment was about montes d last year. You know, your post that is quoted in my post... I was only questioning your football I.Q. Maybe the reading skills are in doubt at well.
Posted via VolNation Mobile
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I don't intend to waste my time reading long posts. Not that I'm too lazy just don't want to waste my time on someone rambling on a topic. Which Most people are like that. The Truth is No one knows exactly how Wilcox will do in the SEC. We all do know is that we want him to stop the Spread. We never been successful at stopping it. Yes?
 
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