No one should be surprised

#1

VolBeef88

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#1
This team is what it is. We as fans can want them to be more but they just aren't. I don't think so much they quit as much as Oregon woke up. Maybe our guys realized they were in trouble and it showed. But this is going to be a VERY long season. I don't like it but it's where we are as a program.
Our AD should be fired for allowing UT to reach this level.
Posted via VolNation Mobile
 
#3
#3
This team is what it is. We as fans can want them to be more but they just aren't. I don't think so much they quit as much as Oregon woke up. Maybe our guys realized they were in trouble and it showed. But this is going to be a VERY long season. I don't like it but it's where we are as a program.
Our AD should be fired for allowing UT to reach this level.
Posted via VolNation Mobile

it just the case of having the same coach and no bang for so many years. Keeping a coach in place for such a long time you go through peaks and valleys (florida State, Michigan, Penn state..ect...ect). Fulmer should of never been let go or forced out we would of risen again. Lane K was a splash hire to get some of the bang that Florida, Alabama, South Carolina made with there hires..the only difference was they hired coaches with actually winning records we let a coach go that had 100 more wins then losses yes it was tough times, but Fulmer also wouldnt have a team as bad as this either he was still recruiting he just need to find a strong OC he tried with Clawfense, but it blew up on him he should of stayed to his roots or hired a different OC. Hamilton should of not hired Lane Kiffin. Who would want to come to a program that outsted Fulmer for having a great winning record..nobody thats why we got stuck with Kiffin. Dooly will turn this around, but its going to take time. Hamilton should of put more pressure on Fulmer to fire the Clawfense instead of uprooting the whole program and not of hired Lame Kiffin. For you Fulmer haters out there...he worked like hack and had a great winning percentage. Yes we were in tough times, but he just needed a solid OC like Cutcliff and we would have been relevent the past 4 years. :rock:
 
#7
#7
it just the case of having the same coach and no bang for so many years. Keeping a coach in place for such a long time you go through peaks and valleys (florida State, Michigan, Penn state..ect...ect). Fulmer should of never been let go or forced out we would of risen again. Lane K was a splash hire to get some of the bang that Florida, Alabama, South Carolina made with there hires..the only difference was they hired coaches with actually winning records we let a coach go that had 100 more wins then losses yes it was tough times, but Fulmer also wouldnt have a team as bad as this either he was still recruiting he just need to find a strong OC he tried with Clawfense, but it blew up on him he should of stayed to his roots or hired a different OC. Hamilton should of not hired Lane Kiffin. Who would want to come to a program that outsted Fulmer for having a great winning record..nobody thats why we got stuck with Kiffin. Dooly will turn this around, but its going to take time. Hamilton should of put more pressure on Fulmer to fire the Clawfense instead of uprooting the whole program and not of hired Lame Kiffin. For you Fulmer haters out there...he worked like hack and had a great winning percentage. Yes we were in tough times, but he just needed a solid OC like Cutcliff and we would have been relevent the past 4 years. :rock:

typed this while on the phone at work! basically what I am saying is he shouldnt of fired Fulmer just found a young OC to take over the OC job (not a clawfense) we would of still been in good shape
 
#8
#8
OK, i am good with firing MH. Letting the program get to this level is the bottom line. Any casual observer can see that the program has gone on a downward spiral since he took over. Let's not say that Dickey was a wiz at the job either, but ever since MH took over, we've seen the program's overall performance suffer. I think people who blame Fulmer may be somewhat correct, but let's remember that Fulmer can only do what Fulmer was allowed to do. I have no idea what all goes on, but i can tell you that i have gone through changes from one boss to another where all other variables are the same and something is drastically different. I know that each time i've seen this up close, you have the younger-up-and-coming professional wanting to make a name for him/herself. And each time, a lot of the BS that goes on that you didn't have to put up with before may not alter how you go about doing things but it just doesn't sit well and you start to wonder if it is all worth it. I think we only see the head coach on the sidelines and in the paper. But who knows who does all the stuff behind the scenes. There are other reasons that the AD may/may not have a hand in but you gotta wonder why EVERYTHING that changed, changed for the worse:
1. We lose David Cutcliffe. We replace with Sanders. We keep Sanders until it's either Sanders' job or Fulmers' that gets lost. Too long. Why not ask your coach to come up with a replacement plan to A. promote within and B. Go out and find a better OC than then the one we had and evaluate which is best for UT.
2. We lose Rodney Garner. Not sure who replaced him. Same deal as above, but here, we lose probably the best recruiting coach for TN. He knew GA well. He recruited the players that won us a NC. Replacing him with just another position coach is not acceptable. Did Fulmer present a plan to MH to upgrade this position or save some money and hire within?
3. We have reduced the stadium capacity to 102,000 from a high of 107,000+. Only 5,000 people you might say and those newer seats command much more $$. But, we have lost the edge/buzz that we had. We were top two or three on campus stadiums. That's an easy sell to recruits. What are we going to say now? Oh, uh, we have more high paying seats now. Does that resonate well with recruits? Probably not. It doesn't resonate well with me because i think fans are now so pampered that we are becoming similar to the Dodgers where everybody leaves after the 5th inning once the food becomes cold and the halftime hotdogs and ice cream are gone.
4. Where was the Vote-of-confidence for Fulmer? Where was it? Did he once get in front of the media and say "Fulmer is our coach"? No. He went on the air and flat-out outlined a plan whereby we could find the money to buy Fulmer out. Who does that? At that point, when you have an AD publicly stating that it's doable to fire the coach even though he has a 16-year track record and a national championship, you don't go out and make him look already fired when he is trying to motivate a team, a fanbase and trying to get to a bowl game. That to me was inexcusable. Fulmer deserved more than that and that showed me that somebody else was pushing MH and his own big mouth should have stayed shut.
5. We fire a UT legend and hire a snot-nosed brat that was out of here first opportunity to "better" hisself. OK, nuff said.
6. Charging students whom this whole program is about for attending games.
7. Charging absurd rates for tickets and mandatory donations.

All of these things were done on his watch. For that, i think you're on to something.
BYOBBIO
 
#9
#9
OK, i am good with firing MH. Letting the program get to this level is the bottom line. Any casual observer can see that the program has gone on a downward spiral since he took over. Let's not say that Dickey was a wiz at the job either, but ever since MH took over, we've seen the program's overall performance suffer. I think people who blame Fulmer may be somewhat correct, but let's remember that Fulmer can only do what Fulmer was allowed to do. I have no idea what all goes on, but i can tell you that i have gone through changes from one boss to another where all other variables are the same and something is drastically different. I know that each time i've seen this up close, you have the younger-up-and-coming professional wanting to make a name for him/herself. And each time, a lot of the BS that goes on that you didn't have to put up with before may not alter how you go about doing things but it just doesn't sit well and you start to wonder if it is all worth it. I think we only see the head coach on the sidelines and in the paper. But who knows who does all the stuff behind the scenes. There are other reasons that the AD may/may not have a hand in but you gotta wonder why EVERYTHING that changed, changed for the worse:
1. We lose David Cutcliffe. We replace with Sanders. We keep Sanders until it's either Sanders' job or Fulmers' that gets lost. Too long. Why not ask your coach to come up with a replacement plan to A. promote within and B. Go out and find a better OC than then the one we had and evaluate which is best for UT.
2. We lose Rodney Garner. Not sure who replaced him. Same deal as above, but here, we lose probably the best recruiting coach for TN. He knew GA well. He recruited the players that won us a NC. Replacing him with just another position coach is not acceptable. Did Fulmer present a plan to MH to upgrade this position or save some money and hire within?
3. We have reduced the stadium capacity to 102,000 from a high of 107,000+. Only 5,000 people you might say and those newer seats command much more $$. But, we have lost the edge/buzz that we had. We were top two or three on campus stadiums. That's an easy sell to recruits. What are we going to say now? Oh, uh, we have more high paying seats now. Does that resonate well with recruits? Probably not. It doesn't resonate well with me because i think fans are now so pampered that we are becoming similar to the Dodgers where everybody leaves after the 5th inning once the food becomes cold and the halftime hotdogs and ice cream are gone.
4. Where was the Vote-of-confidence for Fulmer? Where was it? Did he once get in front of the media and say "Fulmer is our coach"? No. He went on the air and flat-out outlined a plan whereby we could find the money to buy Fulmer out. Who does that? At that point, when you have an AD publicly stating that it's doable to fire the coach even though he has a 16-year track record and a national championship, you don't go out and make him look already fired when he is trying to motivate a team, a fanbase and trying to get to a bowl game. That to me was inexcusable. Fulmer deserved more than that and that showed me that somebody else was pushing MH and his own big mouth should have stayed shut.
5. We fire a UT legend and hire a snot-nosed brat that was out of here first opportunity to "better" hisself. OK, nuff said.
6. Charging students whom this whole program is about for attending games.
7. Charging absurd rates for tickets and mandatory donations.

All of these things were done on his watch. For that, i think you're on to something.
BYOBBIO

right with you. Hamilton screwed up by letting Fulmer go the wrong way thats the problem here
 
#10
#10
OK, i am good with firing MH. Letting the program get to this level is the bottom line. Any casual observer can see that the program has gone on a downward spiral since he took over. Let's not say that Dickey was a wiz at the job either, but ever since MH took over, we've seen the program's overall performance suffer. I think people who blame Fulmer may be somewhat correct, but let's remember that Fulmer can only do what Fulmer was allowed to do. I have no idea what all goes on, but i can tell you that i have gone through changes from one boss to another where all other variables are the same and something is drastically different. I know that each time i've seen this up close, you have the younger-up-and-coming professional wanting to make a name for him/herself. And each time, a lot of the BS that goes on that you didn't have to put up with before may not alter how you go about doing things but it just doesn't sit well and you start to wonder if it is all worth it. I think we only see the head coach on the sidelines and in the paper. But who knows who does all the stuff behind the scenes. There are other reasons that the AD may/may not have a hand in but you gotta wonder why EVERYTHING that changed, changed for the worse:
1. We lose David Cutcliffe. We replace with Sanders. We keep Sanders until it's either Sanders' job or Fulmers' that gets lost. Too long. Why not ask your coach to come up with a replacement plan to A. promote within and B. Go out and find a better OC than then the one we had and evaluate which is best for UT.
2. We lose Rodney Garner. Not sure who replaced him. Same deal as above, but here, we lose probably the best recruiting coach for TN. He knew GA well. He recruited the players that won us a NC. Replacing him with just another position coach is not acceptable. Did Fulmer present a plan to MH to upgrade this position or save some money and hire within?
3. We have reduced the stadium capacity to 102,000 from a high of 107,000+. Only 5,000 people you might say and those newer seats command much more $$. But, we have lost the edge/buzz that we had. We were top two or three on campus stadiums. That's an easy sell to recruits. What are we going to say now? Oh, uh, we have more high paying seats now. Does that resonate well with recruits? Probably not. It doesn't resonate well with me because i think fans are now so pampered that we are becoming similar to the Dodgers where everybody leaves after the 5th inning once the food becomes cold and the halftime hotdogs and ice cream are gone.
4. Where was the Vote-of-confidence for Fulmer? Where was it? Did he once get in front of the media and say "Fulmer is our coach"? No. He went on the air and flat-out outlined a plan whereby we could find the money to buy Fulmer out. Who does that? At that point, when you have an AD publicly stating that it's doable to fire the coach even though he has a 16-year track record and a national championship, you don't go out and make him look already fired when he is trying to motivate a team, a fanbase and trying to get to a bowl game. That to me was inexcusable. Fulmer deserved more than that and that showed me that somebody else was pushing MH and his own big mouth should have stayed shut.
5. We fire a UT legend and hire a snot-nosed brat that was out of here first opportunity to "better" hisself. OK, nuff said.
6. Charging students whom this whole program is about for attending games.
7. Charging absurd rates for tickets and mandatory donations.

All of these things were done on his watch. For that, i think you're on to something.
BYOBBIO
Fulmer pushed to get Hamilton in. He was no more than a yes man for much of his tenure. He is absolutely clueless about the game of football, missed signs that maybe things aren't as they should be. Let a idiot from the left coast come in here and make a mockery of the traditions by selling it as USC east, garbage. Showing highlight films of SC in the walk of fame should have gotten him canned last year. He's in over his head, always has been and you could train a monkey to raise funds at UT.
 
#11
#11
Fulmer pushed to get Hamilton in. He was no more than a yes man for much of his tenure. He is absolutely clueless about the game of football, missed signs that maybe things aren't as they should be. Let a idiot from the left coast come in here and make a mockery of the traditions by selling it as USC east, garbage. Showing highlight films of SC in the walk of fame should have gotten him canned last year. He's in over his head, always has been and you could train a monkey to raise funds at UT.

That is absolutely correct. The number of people who credit Hamilton with raising money are clueless about the loyalty of its donors. UT donors are giving to help fix the problems they recognize, not to show support for the guy holding the hat.
 
#12
#12
OK, i am good with firing MH. Letting the program get to this level is the bottom line. Any casual observer can see that the program has gone on a downward spiral since he took over. Let's not say that Dickey was a wiz at the job either, but ever since MH took over, we've seen the program's overall performance suffer. I think people who blame Fulmer may be somewhat correct, but let's remember that Fulmer can only do what Fulmer was allowed to do. I have no idea what all goes on, but i can tell you that i have gone through changes from one boss to another where all other variables are the same and something is drastically different. I know that each time i've seen this up close, you have the younger-up-and-coming professional wanting to make a name for him/herself. And each time, a lot of the BS that goes on that you didn't have to put up with before may not alter how you go about doing things but it just doesn't sit well and you start to wonder if it is all worth it. I think we only see the head coach on the sidelines and in the paper. But who knows who does all the stuff behind the scenes. There are other reasons that the AD may/may not have a hand in but you gotta wonder why EVERYTHING that changed, changed for the worse:
1. We lose David Cutcliffe. We replace with Sanders. We keep Sanders until it's either Sanders' job or Fulmers' that gets lost. Too long. Why not ask your coach to come up with a replacement plan to A. promote within and B. Go out and find a better OC than then the one we had and evaluate which is best for UT.
2. We lose Rodney Garner. Not sure who replaced him. Same deal as above, but here, we lose probably the best recruiting coach for TN. He knew GA well. He recruited the players that won us a NC. Replacing him with just another position coach is not acceptable. Did Fulmer present a plan to MH to upgrade this position or save some money and hire within?
3. We have reduced the stadium capacity to 102,000 from a high of 107,000+. Only 5,000 people you might say and those newer seats command much more $$. But, we have lost the edge/buzz that we had. We were top two or three on campus stadiums. That's an easy sell to recruits. What are we going to say now? Oh, uh, we have more high paying seats now. Does that resonate well with recruits? Probably not. It doesn't resonate well with me because i think fans are now so pampered that we are becoming similar to the Dodgers where everybody leaves after the 5th inning once the food becomes cold and the halftime hotdogs and ice cream are gone.
4. Where was the Vote-of-confidence for Fulmer? Where was it? Did he once get in front of the media and say "Fulmer is our coach"? No. He went on the air and flat-out outlined a plan whereby we could find the money to buy Fulmer out. Who does that? At that point, when you have an AD publicly stating that it's doable to fire the coach even though he has a 16-year track record and a national championship, you don't go out and make him look already fired when he is trying to motivate a team, a fanbase and trying to get to a bowl game. That to me was inexcusable. Fulmer deserved more than that and that showed me that somebody else was pushing MH and his own big mouth should have stayed shut.
5. We fire a UT legend and hire a snot-nosed brat that was out of here first opportunity to "better" hisself. OK, nuff said.
6. Charging students whom this whole program is about for attending games.
7. Charging absurd rates for tickets and mandatory donations.

All of these things were done on his watch. For that, i think you're on to something.
BYOBBIO

Fulmer was spent; past his time and prime and way behind the curve. We saw a 10-year decline in fortunes, mainly because no one had the balls to confront the problem we were faced with: having to get rid of a has-been head coach with a NC. Hamilton finally did the right thing, but then things went down hill. We should have put 7 or 8 million out there and hired a top tier, proven coach. Instead, we did it on the cheap, twice. This program has over 100,000 paying customers. We should be able to afford the best out there. We didn't. End of story, at least for about four years or so.
 
#13
#13
Fulmer was spent; past his time and prime and way behind the curve. We saw a 10-year decline in fortunes, mainly because no one had the balls to confront the problem we were faced with: having to get rid of a has-been head coach with a NC. Hamilton finally did the right thing, but then things went down hill. We should have put 7 or 8 million out there and hired a top tier, proven coach. Instead, we did it on the cheap, twice. This program has over 100,000 paying customers. We should be able to afford the best out there. We didn't. End of story, at least for about four years or so.
Good points and it's just another reason why his time as AD has been one big fail.
 
#14
#14
I've been saying this for awhile....MH needs to go.....not only has our beloved football program achieved nothing under his tenure, the 'AA has investigatd both the football and basketball teams while under his watch as well....his time has come
 
#15
#15
The end of the gubernatorial race is the end of Mike Hamilton. Count on that. It still won't change the fact that we are rebuilding for a few years, but it will change how things are handled in the future.
 
#16
#16
right with you. Hamilton screwed up by letting Fulmer go the wrong way thats the problem here

WRONG. Hamilton screwed up by not firing Captain Titanic (aka Fulmer) in 2005. Fulmer is the one who ran this program into the grave. Don't fool yourselves.
 
#17
#17
WRONG. Hamilton screwed up by not firing Captain Titanic (aka Fulmer) in 2005. Fulmer is the one who ran this program into the grave. Don't fool yourselves.
From what i've heard and i've heard it from many his hands were tied back then. He should have been gone then , but Fulmer was in with too many that mattered. It's a shame the casual fan could see it coming and i saw it coming even before 2005. He had too much pull and was rooted in like a tick. The stuff that happened after 2005 is even more reason that they should have cleaned it all up , coach, AD, the whole thing.
 
#18
#18
Fulmer deserved to be fired when he was fired. He earned a firing.
MH has earned a firing and the sooner the better.
There's an AD at TCU that would be a nice fit. And he can bring his coaching staff as well.
JMO
Posted via VolNation Mobile
 
#20
#20
How is an AD responsible for a coach leaving on his own will?

He hired him.

Go to any good business in the country and you'll find that Executives are responsible for results and if they choose the wrong guy for whatever job or reason... and that guy quits for a better job... the standard is still the same: Succeed or bring boxes to work with you.

Kiffin was a failed hire behind a guy with alot of political capital and history of success. You can try to rationalize it or you can call it a stupid hire of a volatile young coach... either way it was a failed hire. FWIW, the Bush stuff was out there before MH hired LK. It was not a far fetched notion that Carroll would bolt to the NFL or that USC would go after former asst coaches.
 
#21
#21
We never would have seen Kiffin had Fulmer been fired after 2005. Who is responsible for that?
Blame some big pull boosters then, maybe write a letter to Jim Haslam or ole Thunder Thornton. In 2005 Fulmer was untouchable apparently.
 
#24
#24
From what i've heard and i've heard it from many his hands were tied back then. He should have been gone then , but Fulmer was in with too many that mattered. It's a shame the casual fan could see it coming and i saw it coming even before 2005. He had too much pull and was rooted in like a tick. The stuff that happened after 2005 is even more reason that they should have cleaned it all up , coach, AD, the whole thing.

I think most of us did. I also agree with you that MH's hands were tied in 05. Fulmer knew how to play booster politics, that's for sue. Come to think of it, that's how he got the job in the first place.
 
#25
#25
It's MH's job to take care of the university of Tennessee AD and he has failed on many levels.
We should fire him asap and go after the TCU AD.
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