NFL.com combine grades/results

#77

butchna

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#77
It's okay if we disagree....

It's over the top, IMO, to claim that Zach Thomas--an unanimous All-American LB, and 7-time NFL pro-bowler who played 13 years in the league was less agile than Bituli.
And then you go beyond that stretch to compare Bituli with Maualuga--another All-American, 3X first team PAC-10 player, and PAC-10 defensive player of the year.

Just on objective standards of recognition from D-1 coaching evaluations--Bituli's best is 2nd team All-SEC once in 4 years by SEC coaches.

It just blows my mind how you could make those statements.
Maybe you’re prone to overreaction? Zach Thomas was a lightly regarded NFL prospect out of Texas Tech who’s talent Jimmy Johnson managed to recognize. MikeVol44’s of that era were 13 years away from having their revisionist minds blown. And Maualuga managed to overcome being on the best team in college football during his time there? Wowsers! Kind of veering away from your evaluations and going straight to awards to draft your team? Bituli had to fight through being converted to DE and then thrust into the fray at MLB in the historically bad 4-2-5 we put on the field. Despite that he always had that instinct and fire and nose for the ball. Right NFL team’s getting a long term starter imo. We’ll revisit in a few seasons if you remember being on your side of this argument.
 
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#79

greazy1722

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#79
6’3 215 lb nfl TE? Good grief. JJ will make a roster because he’ll shine on special teams and I believe he’ll transition from there into a rotation at WR, likely in the slot. He’ll never, ever play TE in the nfl, doesn’t have the body for it.

TE, that’s your take? Explains a lot.
I think he to slow to play WR in the NFL and he dont run good routes. TE I think down the line would be perfect. Its alot of former WR's thats playing TE so what u talking about. Dont act like its never happened.
 
#81

KBVol

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#81
I think he to slow to play WR in the NFL and he dont run good routes. TE I think down the line would be perfect. Its alot of former WR's thats playing TE so what u talking about. Dont act like its never happened.
It WILL NOT happen with JJ. He has great intangibles which will keep in the league at WR, playing out of the slot. And he’ll be a beast on special teams. I certainly recognize his lack of speed, everybody does....but there are plenty of great nfl players and WRs (Fitzgerald, Bolton, Hines Ward, etc, etc) who didnt run great 40 times. He’ll be one of those guys imo. He has excellent hands and great ball skills and he just makes plays.

Before this last season, I argued he wouldn’t even be drafted, that he’d be an UDFA who would make a practice squad or the tail end of a 53 man roster because of his special teams play. But after this season, after he was clearly the mvp of this team with his playmaking ability and showing just how good of a “football player” he is, I think he’s a mid to late round pick. He’s earned it.
 
#82

RockyTopTexas

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#82
DWA looks fantastic out there. Looks honestly like the only capable TE besides waegnor from uga. Pinkney for Vandy looks like garb and Belicheck told him he sucked lol
 
#84

BeardedVol

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#84
Also, not his speed but his desire/determination after the catch. That's what Volnation loves about him. IMHO
Speed is great, but how many of those guys that run a 4.5 in the combine actually manage to keep the perfect form and such required to run a 4.5 in game?

I'd wager not many.
 
#85

MikeVol44

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#85
Maybe you’re prone to overreaction? Zach Thomas was a lightly regarded NFL prospect out of Texas Tech who’s talent Jimmy Johnson managed to recognize. MikeVol44’s of that era were 13 years away from having their revisionist minds blown. And Maualuga managed to overcome being on the best team in college football during his time there? Wowsers! Kind of veering away from your evaluations and going straight to awards to draft your team? Bituli had to fight through being converted to DE and then thrust into the fray at MLB in the historically bad 4-2-5 we put on the field. Despite that he always had that instinct and fire and nose for the ball. Right NFL team’s getting a long term starter imo. We’ll revisit in a few seasons if you remember being on your side of this argument.
Good grief, Butch....It's laudable that you on the Bituli band-wagon....but trying to say that there's been ANY indications that he will be a good NFL player is just absolute homerism at best!

And I didn't do any revisionism....Thomas and Mauluga's accomplishments in college are well documented!
How can you completely IGNORE the objective record of both Zach and Rey's college honors and awards?

Zach Thomas' COLLEGIATE AWARDS:
  • Second-team Houston Chronicle All-SWC (1993)
  • Second-team Houston Post All-SWC (1993)
  • First-team UPI All-American (1994)
  • Second-team Football News All-American (1994)
  • Second-team Sporting News All-American (1994)
  • 2× SWC Defensive Player of the Year (1994, 1995)
  • Unanimous first-team All-American (1995)
  • First-team All-SWC (1995)
Rey Mauluga COLLEGIATE AWARDS:

Now....just what kind of awards has Bituli received during his college career--other than 1 time 2nd team All-SEC as a senior??

There was OVERWHELMING evidence that both Thomas and Mauluga were going to prosper in the NFL....

THE ONLY hesitation about Thomas was his height.....
But Johnson looked past his height issue and drafted him anyway in the 4th round---minimal $$$ chance on a guy who obviously had a history of excellent performance.
And that turned out very well.

My Father-in-Law, who was 6'3, met Thomas in Miami when he was playing for the Dolphins.
He just couldn't believe how short Thomas was in person.

Thomas had the awards, but NOT the measurables.

Mauluga had everything.....and drafted in 2nd round, even though he was projected pre-draft to be taken in the 1st.

Bituli is the exact opposite. He has the SIZE, but not the athleticism.
He has NOTHING but a huge frame with long arms....and NO WHERE near the performance history that Thomas and Mauluga had.

Bituli will be probably sign with someone as a free agent......and may even make a practice squad.

And yes sir.....I'll be sure to watch over the next couple of years to see where it all shakes out.
 
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#88

MikeVol44

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#88
It WILL NOT happen with JJ. He has great intangibles which will keep in the league at WR, playing out of the slot. And he’ll be a beast on special teams. I certainly recognize his lack of speed, everybody does....but there are plenty of great nfl players and WRs (Fitzgerald, Bolton, Hines Ward, etc, etc) who didnt run great 40 times. He’ll be one of those guys imo. He has excellent hands and great ball skills and he just makes plays.

Before this last season, I argued he wouldn’t even be drafted, that he’d be an UDFA who would make a practice squad or the tail end of a 53 man roster because of his special teams play. But after this season, after he was clearly the mvp of this team with his playmaking ability and showing just how good of a “football player” he is, I think he’s a mid to late round pick. He’s earned it.
This year definitely helped JJ.

Some guys are just FB players....JJ is one of 'em IMO.
Some NFL team is gonna recognize it....
 
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#91

butchna

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#91
Good grief, Butch....It's laudable that you on the Bituli band-wagon....but trying to say that there's been ANY indications that he will be a good NFL player is just absolute homerism at best!

And I didn't do any revisionism....Thomas and Mauluga's accomplishments in college are well documented!
How can you completely IGNORE the objective record of both Zach and Rey's college honors and awards?

Zach Thomas' COLLEGIATE AWARDS:
  • Second-team Houston Chronicle All-SWC (1993)
  • Second-team Houston Post All-SWC (1993)
  • First-team UPI All-American (1994)
  • Second-team Football News All-American (1994)
  • Second-team Sporting News All-American (1994)
  • 2× SWC Defensive Player of the Year (1994, 1995)
  • Unanimous first-team All-American (1995)
  • First-team All-SWC (1995)
Rey Mauluga COLLEGIATE AWARDS:

Now....just what kind of awards has Bituli received during his college career--other than 1 time 2nd team All-SEC as a senior??

There was OVERWHELMING evidence that both Thomas and Mauluga were going to prosper in the NFL....

THE ONLY hesitation about Thomas was his height.....
But Johnson looked past his height issue and drafted him anyway in the 4th round---minimal $$$ chance on a guy who obviously had a history of excellent performance.
And that turned out very well.

My Father-in-Law, who was 6'3, met Thomas in Miami when he was playing for the Dolphins.
He just couldn't believe how short Thomas was in person.

Thomas had the awards, but NOT the measurables.

Mauluga had everything.....and drafted in 2nd round, even though he was projected pre-draft to be taken in the 1st.

Bituli is the exact opposite. He has the SIZE, but not the athleticism.
He has NOTHING but a huge frame with long arms....and NO WHERE near the performance history that Thomas and Mauluga had.

Bituli will be probably sign with someone as a free agent......and may even make a practice squad.

And yes sir.....I'll be sure to watch over the next couple of years to see where it all shakes out.
You got it backwards. Neither Thomas nor Maualuga had the range of Bituli and still persevered. Players play. Already discussed the unstable situation that Bituli had to overcome so if you can’t overcome being a slave to awards and honors and how they factor least towards a pro career, I’ll have to leave you in your flabbergasted state. We’re making different predictions based on different personal criteria...nothing to get worked up about. 😎
 
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#93

butchna

Sit down and tell me all about it...way over there
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#93
Another reason I don’t get swept up in NFL Combine nerdiness. Good information for tiebreakers, but worrying about hip and butt explosiveness indicates you missed the exit 3 stops back. As a Bears fan, one of my favorite Combine Moments of Zen...
E3094881-9DB3-401C-91C6-DC9772F484C2.jpeg
 
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#94

MikeVol44

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#94
You got it backwards. Neither Thomas nor Maualuga had the range of Bituli and still persevered. Players play. Already discussed the unstable situation that Bituli had to overcome so if you can’t overcome being a slave to awards and honors and how they factor least towards a pro career, I’ll have to leave you in your flabbergasted state. We’re making different predictions based on different personal criteria...nothing to get worked up about. 😎
Typical elitist condescension of the worst sort.....You're just wrong in your less than objective evaluations--and too arrogant to admit it...
Those awards Thomas and Mauluga earned are valuable evidence in athletic evaluation because they are OBJECTIVE--and come from outside of the respective programs.
You do revisionism in REVERSE....and say that they don't matter....and then arrogantly chide me by saying that I'm a slave to awards and honors.

I just applied objective evidence to support the reasonable conclusion that Thomas and Mauluga's NFL success was NO SURPRISE.

Bituli has no objective evidence indicating that he will be a good NFL player....absolutely none.
He's 2nd team all-SEC one time in his collegiate career....with an overwhelming body of work that screams average to below-average.
Those NFL scouts don't dream up their evaluations....

And there's plenty of guys out there who look like Tarzan and play like Jane.
 
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#95

pimo1

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#95
JJ and DWA have had surprising performances thus far. A 4.7 and a 4.9 I seriously didn't see that coming. I really hope they can improve on that at pro day. I haven't seen JJ's second run yet though
 
#96

butchna

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#96
Typical elitist condescension of the worst sort.....You're just wrong in your less than objective evaluations--and too arrogant to admit it...
Those awards Thomas and Mauluga earned are valuable evidence in athletic evaluation because they are OBJECTIVE--and come from outside of the respective programs.
You do revisionism in REVERSE....and say that they don't matter....and then arrogantly chide me by saying that I'm a slave to awards and honors.

I just applied objective evidence to support the reasonable conclusion that Thomas and Mauluga's NFL success was NO SURPRISE.

Bituli has no objective evidence indicating that he will be a good NFL player....absolutely none.
He's 2nd team all-SEC one time in his collegiate career....with an overwhelming body of work that screams average to below-average.
Those NFL scouts don't dream up their evaluations....

And there's plenty of guys out there who look like Tarzan and play like Jane.
Blah blah blah...I challenge you to find where I’ve D4H’d a Vol prospect. Hasn’t happened. NFL scouts hit some miss some...they’re not infallible. We don’t even have his numbers yet and you’re squawking about his measurables. Allz I know was our defense was better when he was back there. He was a disruptive beast who’s performance also disrupted your desperate and tiresome Tarzan/Jane analogy. You submitted their college popularity contest results as your “EVIDENCE” and I showed their scouting report on Eddie Jackson as mine that they can be as FOS as the next amateur draftnik. You’re spitting out a lot of words when it simply boils down to you think I overvalue him and I think you undervalue him. Time will be the final jury.
 

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